Game Break Armor? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Game Break Armor? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
PseudobulbusAffect
12-31-07, 02:01 AM So we have recently been busy bees number crunching and playing with an artificer.

How does this rub you? Take Living Armor from Eberron Campaign setting, and you make an effigy of it (Complete Arcane) with your artificer. the cost to create is 2500g +160xp. Retail of 4500g. Less than half price!

That isn't the best part. What you essentially have is armor that has the same stats as a +2 mithril full plate with DR 1/Adamantine. This gives you a +10 armor bonus, armor check penalty -2, Arcane spell failure 15%, max Dex +5, and is medium armor. We aren't sure if the light fortification would still apply, but you don't get the +4 Con or the Stabilize host ability that the Living Armor would get.

The armor itself would have 11 HP, it can be targeted independently from the wearer, but that warrants an attack of opportunity. Since the armor has to be targeted independently, spells like rusting grasp would also grant an attack of opportunity.

Did we make a new standard for power gamers?
PseudobulbusAffect
12-31-07, 02:16 PM Okay, so we did more research. It turns out that the +10 bonus is the Living Armor's NATURAL ARMOR! Which means through infusions, you can boost the bonus up to +15. But wait, we have more! This also means you can use Magic Vestment, and Barkskin (or what you like the best, silly abjurers). Yeah, DM's, don't ever let your players' Artificers get a hold of Complete Arcane.
vegetalss4
01-01-08, 02:43 PM i did some research what you get is +8 amor bonus, armor check penalty -2,Dr10/bysehk(or something similiar), Arcane spell failure 15%, max Dex +5, and is medium armor and maybe light fortification
PseudobulbusAffect
01-02-08, 10:32 AM Open up your Eberron Campaign Setting and your copy of Unearthed Arcana.

See what we made was an EFFIGY of Living Armor. It's a construct. Which gives +2 to its natural armor (+10) and it doesn't give the special abilities like Stabilize host, or the +4 con.
Fwib
01-02-08, 11:01 AM An Effigy Living Breastplate wouldn't have the (symbiont) subtype, so you couldn't even wear it.
admus
01-06-08, 03:58 PM too wrong. the lack of (symbiotic) subtype means that the creature doesn't need the lifesource of other creatures to keep itself alive.
Fwib
01-06-08, 05:40 PM too wrong. the lack of (symbiotic) subtype means that the creature doesn't need the lifesource of other creatures to keep itself alive.OK, maybe I've missed something. Where do the rules let you wear a creature?

[edit]And even if your DM were to rule that you get to wear the Effigy Living Breastplate, then it dies the first time you are exposed to an area-effect attack, like a fireball, or even burning hands, or if somebody attacks it for 12hp or more.
BetaSquirrell
01-07-08, 07:08 PM Yeah, AoE's tear this apart. Trying to Sunder is a bad idea, because the wearer gets AoOs, but all I have to do is drop an average CL5 fireball on you and this thing is toast.

Also, I'm not up to speed on my Eberron, but if the armor, as a construct, is getting all sorts of armor bonuses, where is it said that these armor bonuses apply to you...?

And Effigy is from CArc, not Unearthed Arcana.

Sorry, but I'm having a hard time seeing how this thing is 'Game-Break.' I mean, according to what vegetalss4 says, it's basically Mithril Platemail...
Fwib
01-07-08, 07:51 PM Yeah, AoE's tear this apart. Trying to Sunder is a bad idea, because the wearer gets AoOs, but all I have to do is drop an average CL5 fireball on you and this thing is toast.

Also, I'm not up to speed on my Eberron, but if the armor, as a construct, is getting all sorts of armor bonuses, where is it said that these armor bonuses apply to you...?

And Effigy is from CArc, not Unearthed Arcana.

Sorry, but I'm having a hard time seeing how this thing is 'Game-Break.' I mean, according to what vegetalss4 says, it's basically Mithril Platemail...No need to sunder. Just attack the creature. No AoOs.
EvilCouch
01-08-08, 01:22 AM Also, I'm not up to speed on my Eberron, but if the armor, as a construct, is getting all sorts of armor bonuses, where is it said that these armor bonuses apply to you...? Yeah, I'm hung up on that, too. Since it's hanging out around him, I'd rule that he gets some value of cover for it (probably 50%), but the armor bonus only applies to the construct itself, unless there's some funky rule out there I'm unaware of.

And with a low number of hit points and crap DR instead of awesome hardness, it's going to die fast when the AoEs drop. If there's a way to use the hardness instead of the DR, or stack the DR onto it, it'd be a lot better, but it's still just cover, not armor.
Prime32
01-10-08, 06:08 PM Just make a simulacrum :rolleyes:
Fwib
01-10-08, 06:23 PM Just make a simulacrum :rolleyes:By the time you can cast level 7 spells, a Simulacrum Living Breastplate is no longer nifty :(
The_Mad_Linguist
01-10-08, 07:25 PM By the time you can cast level 7 spells, a Simulacrum Living Breastplate is no longer nifty :(

Hire a spellcaster to cast it for you. The pricing is fairly reasonable.
Fwib
01-11-08, 12:32 PM Hire a spellcaster to cast it for you. The pricing is fairly reasonable.Around 1400gp is good, if your DM allows you to get away with it, true.

[edit] ~1400gp, forgot the HD got halved.
BetaSquirrell
01-12-08, 11:07 AM Simalcrum? Why? You've still just got a really expensive tower shield that doesn't grant any armor bonuses.
Prime32
01-12-08, 11:12 AM Say what? Beta, have you seen the stats for a Living Breastplate? It's a living creature that also functions as armour, gives +4 to Con, stabilises you if you die...
BetaSquirrell
01-12-08, 11:35 AM Oh...I see. Make a simalcrum of the breastplate, not the effigy breastplate.
PhaedrusXY
01-18-08, 06:05 PM You can wear a construct. An intelligent suit of armor should be a legitimate magic item, even just using the rules in the PHB.

Also, since it is armor, it is not a legitimate target for Sunder.

And since it is a piece of your equipment, it isn't damaged by area spells unless you roll a natural 1 on a saving throw.

It could be targeted by a spell, but how often does that happen?
BetaSquirrell
01-19-08, 10:01 AM Yes, intelligent armor is possible, but its not a construct. It's an intelligent magical item IIRC.

Honestly, I'd rather have intelligent armor than an effigy living breastplate, because it would gain all sorts of nifty powers, while the effigy breastplate might do something and might not, and in any case is really just mithril platemail with a tower shield.
PhaedrusXY
01-19-08, 07:39 PM Yes, intelligent armor is possible, but its not a construct. From the rules on Intelligent magic items... Intelligent items can actually be considered creatures because they have Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores. Treat them as constructs.
BetaSquirrell
01-20-08, 02:41 PM I did not know that. Interesting...

The only thing I can think of now is giving the armor more HD and (since it has an Int score) feats.
Kycir
01-24-08, 03:30 PM Uhh you need to read Your Eberron books a little closer. The living armor as loot or a magical item is an ARTIFACT. If your DM will let you make effiges of an Artifact then I'm sure you really don't have to go through much effort to break all your characters. (page 154 MoE)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
PseudobulbusAffect 12-31-07, 02:01 AM	So we have recently been busy bees number crunching and playing with an artificer. How does this rub you? Take Living Armor from Eberron Campaign setting, and you make an effigy of it (Complete Arcane) with your artificer. the cost to create is 2500g +160xp. Retail of 4500g. Less than half price! That isn't the best part. What you essentially have is armor that has the same stats as a +2 mithril full plate with DR 1/Adamantine. This gives you a +10 armor bonus, armor check penalty -2, Arcane spell failure 15%, max Dex +5, and is medium armor. We aren't sure if the light fortification would still apply, but you don't get the +4 Con or the Stabilize host ability that the Living Armor would get. The armor itself would have 11 HP, it can be targeted independently from the wearer, but that warrants an attack of opportunity. Since the armor has to be targeted independently, spells like rusting grasp would also grant an attack of opportunity. Did we make a new standard for power gamers?
PseudobulbusAffect 12-31-07, 02:16 PM	Okay, so we did more research. It turns out that the +10 bonus is the Living Armor's NATURAL ARMOR! Which means through infusions, you can boost the bonus up to +15. But wait, we have more! This also means you can use Magic Vestment, and Barkskin (or what you like the best, silly abjurers). Yeah, DM's, don't ever let your players' Artificers get a hold of Complete Arcane.
vegetalss4 01-01-08, 02:43 PM	i did some research what you get is +8 amor bonus, armor check penalty -2,Dr10/bysehk(or something similiar), Arcane spell failure 15%, max Dex +5, and is medium armor and maybe light fortification
PseudobulbusAffect 01-02-08, 10:32 AM	Open up your Eberron Campaign Setting and your copy of Unearthed Arcana. See what we made was an EFFIGY of Living Armor. It's a construct. Which gives +2 to its natural armor (+10) and it doesn't give the special abilities like Stabilize host, or the +4 con.
Fwib 01-02-08, 11:01 AM	An Effigy Living Breastplate wouldn't have the (symbiont) subtype, so you couldn't even wear it.
admus 01-06-08, 03:58 PM	too wrong. the lack of (symbiotic) subtype means that the creature doesn't need the lifesource of other creatures to keep itself alive.
Fwib 01-06-08, 05:40 PM	too wrong. the lack of (symbiotic) subtype means that the creature doesn't need the lifesource of other creatures to keep itself alive.OK, maybe I've missed something. Where do the rules let you wear a creature? [edit]And even if your DM were to rule that you get to wear the Effigy Living Breastplate, then it dies the first time you are exposed to an area-effect attack, like a fireball, or even burning hands, or if somebody attacks it for 12hp or more.
BetaSquirrell 01-07-08, 07:08 PM	Yeah, AoE's tear this apart. Trying to Sunder is a bad idea, because the wearer gets AoOs, but all I have to do is drop an average CL5 fireball on you and this thing is toast. Also, I'm not up to speed on my Eberron, but if the armor, as a construct, is getting all sorts of armor bonuses, where is it said that these armor bonuses apply to you...? And Effigy is from CArc, not Unearthed Arcana. Sorry, but I'm having a hard time seeing how this thing is 'Game-Break.' I mean, according to what vegetalss4 says, it's basically Mithril Platemail...
Fwib 01-07-08, 07:51 PM	Yeah, AoE's tear this apart. Trying to Sunder is a bad idea, because the wearer gets AoOs, but all I have to do is drop an average CL5 fireball on you and this thing is toast. Also, I'm not up to speed on my Eberron, but if the armor, as a construct, is getting all sorts of armor bonuses, where is it said that these armor bonuses apply to you...? And Effigy is from CArc, not Unearthed Arcana. Sorry, but I'm having a hard time seeing how this thing is 'Game-Break.' I mean, according to what vegetalss4 says, it's basically Mithril Platemail...No need to sunder. Just attack the creature. No AoOs.
EvilCouch 01-08-08, 01:22 AM	Also, I'm not up to speed on my Eberron, but if the armor, as a construct, is getting all sorts of armor bonuses, where is it said that these armor bonuses apply to you...? Yeah, I'm hung up on that, too. Since it's hanging out around him, I'd rule that he gets some value of cover for it (probably 50%), but the armor bonus only applies to the construct itself, unless there's some funky rule out there I'm unaware of. And with a low number of hit points and crap DR instead of awesome hardness, it's going to die fast when the AoEs drop. If there's a way to use the hardness instead of the DR, or stack the DR onto it, it'd be a lot better, but it's still just cover, not armor.
Prime32 01-10-08, 06:08 PM	Just make a simulacrum :rolleyes:
Fwib 01-10-08, 06:23 PM	Just make a simulacrum :rolleyes:By the time you can cast level 7 spells, a Simulacrum Living Breastplate is no longer nifty :(
The_Mad_Linguist 01-10-08, 07:25 PM	By the time you can cast level 7 spells, a Simulacrum Living Breastplate is no longer nifty :( Hire a spellcaster to cast it for you. The pricing is fairly reasonable.
Fwib 01-11-08, 12:32 PM	Hire a spellcaster to cast it for you. The pricing is fairly reasonable.Around 1400gp is good, if your DM allows you to get away with it, true. [edit] ~1400gp, forgot the HD got halved.
BetaSquirrell 01-12-08, 11:07 AM	Simalcrum? Why? You've still just got a really expensive tower shield that doesn't grant any armor bonuses.
Prime32 01-12-08, 11:12 AM	Say what? Beta, have you seen the stats for a Living Breastplate? It's a living creature that also functions as armour, gives +4 to Con, stabilises you if you die...
BetaSquirrell 01-12-08, 11:35 AM	Oh...I see. Make a simalcrum of the breastplate, not the effigy breastplate.
PhaedrusXY 01-18-08, 06:05 PM	You can wear a construct. An intelligent suit of armor should be a legitimate magic item, even just using the rules in the PHB. Also, since it is armor, it is not a legitimate target for Sunder. And since it is a piece of your equipment, it isn't damaged by area spells unless you roll a natural 1 on a saving throw. It could be targeted by a spell, but how often does that happen?
BetaSquirrell 01-19-08, 10:01 AM	Yes, intelligent armor is possible, but its not a construct. It's an intelligent magical item IIRC. Honestly, I'd rather have intelligent armor than an effigy living breastplate, because it would gain all sorts of nifty powers, while the effigy breastplate might do something and might not, and in any case is really just mithril platemail with a tower shield.
PhaedrusXY 01-19-08, 07:39 PM	Yes, intelligent armor is possible, but its not a construct. From the rules on Intelligent magic items... Intelligent items can actually be considered creatures because they have Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores. Treat them as constructs.
BetaSquirrell 01-20-08, 02:41 PM	I did not know that. Interesting... The only thing I can think of now is giving the armor more HD and (since it has an Int score) feats.
Kycir 01-24-08, 03:30 PM	Uhh you need to read Your Eberron books a little closer. The living armor as loot or a magical item is an ARTIFACT. If your DM will let you make effiges of an Artifact then I'm sure you really don't have to go through much effort to break all your characters. (page 154 MoE)