Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Lethian 03-31-04, 07:47 PM	So I'm putting together a twelfth-level human Sorceror for a FR campaign. Pretty much any book 3e or later (3.5 campaign; 3.0 stuff legal if not updated) is acceptable with DM approval. I will have levels in Incantatrix, and eventually Archmage, but I've never played a caster before, and was wondering what other classes/builds are widely used. I've heard things about the Elemental Savant, but beyond that, nothing. Can anyone help me out here?
MoogleEmpMog 03-31-04, 08:10 PM	As usual, I advise an Arcane Trickster of the Bayushi's Technique variety. However, to use it you have to use a 2nd-party source (AEG's semi-WotC-official Rokugan book). This Build Requires: PHB, DMG, Rokugan campaign setting book from AEG 1 Sorcerer 1, Way of the Scorpion, Versatile 2 Sorcerer 2 3 Sorcerer 3, Empower Spell 4 Sorcerer 4 5 Sorcerer 5 6 Sorcerer 6, Bayushi's Technique 7 Sorcerer 7 8 Sorcerer 8 9 Sorcerer 9, Bayushi's Technique 10 Arcane Trickster 1 11 Arcane Trickster 2 12 Arcane Trickster 3, Quicken Spell 13 Arcane Trickster 4 14 Arcane Trickster 5 15 Arcane Trickster 6, Maximize Spell 16 Arcane Trickster 7 17 Arcane Trickster 8 18 Arcane Trickster 9, Bayushi's Technique 19 Arcane Trickster 10 20 Sorcerer 10 You're a full caster, Epic-ready with 10 levels in an effective PrC, with 8d6 of sneak attack to add to your ranged touch spells, better skills than a straight Sorcerer, and some nifty abilities. All you lose is 10 levels of familiar progression (no biggie) and 3 feats. Basically, it's an improvement over a straight Sorcerer in every way. In the campaign I'm currently in, the party mage is an NPC Shadow Adept. The save DCs against her Shadow Evocations require enemies without a high Will save to roll 20s to disbelieve them (hasn't happened yet, and she's tossed numerous Fireballs and a Lightning Bolt that hit 10 guys). Or to make their Reflex saves for 1/2 damage. I haven't looked into the mechanics myself, but this seems VERY effective, you might want to look into it.
Lethian 03-31-04, 08:34 PM	Innnnnteresting. I don't really know how far I want to get into Rokugani stuff, seeing as how we already have a guy from Kara-Tur, but I suppose it's doable. I dunno how much I need the Sneak Attack damage, although I certainly can't see how it's a bad thing.
MoogleEmpMog 03-31-04, 08:46 PM	Basically, with a Sorcerer, what you need to do is decide what Prestige Class you want and how to get into it while losing the least amount of caster levels. :D As a player and a DM, I'm very open to changing the flavor of a feat or PrC to make it appropriate to a different setting, so long as it remains just as flavorful and, in cases where severe role-playing restrictions are imposed, just as restrictive. I like a lot of AEG's Rokugan and WotC's Forgotten Realms mechanics, but normally play in homebrew European-style worlds, so this comes up a lot. Unfortunately, I can't help much with other 3.5-compatible mage builds (at least for humans; if you were an Aurak Draconian, now... :smirk:), since I haven't looked closely at the newer arcane Prestige Classes. As I said, Shadow Adept seemed nasty when I saw it in action, and Archmage appears to still be the same old reliable powerhouse it always was. Hope this helped.
ksbsnowowl 03-31-04, 09:08 PM	Divine Oracle and Sacred Exorcist, both from Defenders of the Faith, are excellent sorcerer PrC's. Each grants a Prestige Domain, the spells of which you gain as extra spells known. Here's a list of the goodies between the two classes (copied from an older thread): -------------------------------------------------------------------------- You get 17 extra spells known (or 18 with 3.5 and spell swapping) from the Divination and Exorcism domains. You also have hit dice of 7d4 + 4d6 + 9d8, giving you an average of 22 more hit points over a straight sorcerer. You also get some rather nifty abilities: Evasion, Divination Enhancement, Uncanny Dodge, Turn Undead along with several extra turning feats (moderately useful - better if you want to get divine feats), bonuses to resist possession, bonuses to skills and caster level checks (such as for SR) against undead or outsiders, Concecrated Presence, the ability to Dispel Evil as a spell-like ability, and the ability to force possessing spirits out of people (similar to a turning check). You also end with a BAB of +11/+6/+1. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- A good Progression (3.0) was Sorcerer 7/Divine Oracle 4/Sacred Exorcist 9. However due to the Living Greyhawk 3.5 updated prereq's for DO, I'm not sure you can take it at 8th character level (the prereq's used to be 10 ranks in Scry and Skill Focus: Scry) Since scry is no longer a skill in 3.5 the prereq's were changed to Spell Focus: Divination, and the ability to cast Scry or Greater Scrying. Also, SE has prereq's of Know(planes): 7 ranks, Know(religion): 10 ranks [Div Or has Know(rel) as a class skill], and the ability to cast Dismissal. Since you gain both Scry and Dismissal as spells known from the domain lists, you can later use your 3.5 swap-out ability to replace the duplicates.
Outsider Subtype 03-31-04, 09:36 PM	Here is a build for a blaster mage who does one thing but does it well. It incorporates the Incantatrix levels you said you wanted. Bloodline of Fire is from the new Player's Guide; Calishite Elementalist and Genie Lore are from Races of Faerun. 1 Sorceror 1 Bloodline of Fire, Iron Will 2 Sorceror 2 3 Sorceror 3 Calishite Elementalist 4 Sorceror 4 5 Sorceror 5 6 Sorceror 6 Empower Spell 7 Incantatrix 1 Extend Spell 8 Incantatrix 2 9 Incantatrix 3 Spell Focus (Evocation) 10 Incantatrix 4 Widen Spell 11 Incantatrix 5 12 Incantatrix 6 Greater Spell Focus (Evocation) 13 Incantatrix 7 Quicken Spell 14 Incantatrix 8 15 Incantatrix 9 Genie Lore 16 Incantatrix 10 Enlarge Spell 17 Arcane Devotee 1 18 Arcane Devotee 2 Improved Initiative 19 Arcane Devotee 3 20 Arcane Devotee 4
Lethian 03-31-04, 10:30 PM	I forgot to mention I was looking for a combat oriented build, but I think you people covered that :D . What's Arcane Devotee from?
Outsider Subtype 03-31-04, 10:40 PM	The 3.5 version is in the new Player's Guide to Faerun.
ZenRanger 04-01-04, 04:30 PM	if you're looking for a combat orient build, incorporate one level of dagon slayer (Dracominocon) and one level of Spellsword (Complete Warrior). The one level of dagon slayer gives you all the weapon and armor proficencies you need for spellsword, which gives you a 10% ASF reduction, and both levels increase you effective caster level. Combine that 10% reduction, mithril, and the twilight special ability (+1 Bonus), and you can be walking around in breastplate casting spells and swinging a greatsword. make use of extend and persistent spell (used to be +4, though i hear it maybe have been move up to +6 in 3.5) to buff yourself up with combat bonuses and protective spells and you'll have a pretty effective combat caster who hasnt lost any spell progression.
Sisyfos 04-01-04, 04:43 PM	Take a look at the "sorc_spells" link in my signature to find spells for your combat oriented sorc :) The build ideas look fine btw. Sisyfos
Neonsamurai 04-01-04, 08:13 PM	I am playing an aasimar sorcerer11/sacred exorcist at the moment with divine might and celestial familiar. i took a lantern archon as familiar which is impressively useful till now. 11 levels of sorcerer give your familiar spellresistance and good natural ac improvement. with outsider polymorph, divine might and arcane strike you can be an impressive meleer in higher levels (i love astral deva as my preferred polymorph form) and still be a good blaster sorc, especially versus outsiders due to the additional spells known from your prestige domain.