14d6 sneak attack at character level 12 [Archive] - Wizards Community

14d6 sneak attack at character level 12 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Neonsamurai
05-26-04, 04:04 PM With all the fuzz about the polymorph clarifications i started to think a bit about polymorph and came to this little nifty trick:

You need 12 HD
You need maxed out UMD
You need a wand of polymorph (caster level 12th)
You need the outsider type

So lets say we have a 12th level aasimar 0 rogue with maxed out UMD and a CL12 wand of polymorph. Use it to polymorph into a Kelvezu to pump your DEX way through the roof, get a lot natural armor, continous poison (CON damage), good bonuses to hide and move silently and 8D6 ADDITIONAL SNEAK ATTACK DICE :D

If this isnt something that every 2WF rogue desires i don't know what :p
Critical Mass
05-26-04, 04:20 PM Kelvezu? MMII? FF? Which book?
Neonsamurai
05-26-04, 04:27 PM Its from MM2
Grim Sage
05-26-04, 04:29 PM cute but the whole point about ECL0 planetouched is that they aren't outsiders anymore :rolleyes:
Autosponge
05-26-04, 04:29 PM "following types: aberration, animal, dragon, fey, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, plant, or vermin. "

Not Outsider (extraplanar) (which I'm pretty sure you're refering to a Demon).
Effling
05-26-04, 04:38 PM Grim Sage, that's the beauty of the Savage Species Aasimar, it's ECL +0 and still an Outsider. Later on, you could take another "level" in Aasimar, giving you +1 LA and getting all the fun benefits.
Neonsamurai
05-26-04, 04:50 PM And even if you don't or can't use the Aasimar 0 cheese, you still can go for the "real" aasimar. 14d6 sneak attack at ECL13 is still impressive enough ;o)
Grim Sage
05-26-04, 04:51 PM oh yeah, forgot about that one... usually when people say 'ECL0 [Planetouched]' they mean the PGtF version.

And i still think it's kinda dodgy to never take the rest of the levels; as you'd be walking around as essentially an incomplete race... but then again by the rules it's legal so you can probably come up with a good ingame reason for it...
"When she learned of her divine heritage, she began transcending her form, becoming something beyond mere mortality... but she became bored with it after awhile so she stopped in favor of persuing a career as pickpocket"
Should make an interesting character to say the least...
Ricter
05-26-04, 06:11 PM Anyone know if they're going to make more savage progressions, or if there are hardfast rules to make your own?
Grim Sage
05-26-04, 06:21 PM The Savage Progressions articles were discontinued; you can still view all the past ones but there won't be any new.

As for making your own; it's pretty easy:
Divide the template in [amount of ECL] equal chunks and put them in order of least powerful to most.
it's mostly a matter of experience; take a look at the savage progressions, the SS progressions and the ones by players on the SS boards; then try making your own (starting with ECL +1 to +3 templates / races). Keep asking yourself these things: Would i want to play this as a player, would there be any reason not to play it, and would i allow this as a DM. If the answer to all questions is 'yes', you're well on your way.
Ask around on the SS boards (or PM me) if you want some more help.
newblar32
05-26-04, 10:28 PM A Kelvezu is also deadly in an Arcane Trickster build.

Aasimar0/Rogue1/Wizard5/GuildTheif1/AT10/XXX

The added bonus from the Kelvezu is that it also grants evasion. This would allow you to save a level and still keep the same survivability as a rogue3 AT build. Also, assuming the last 3 levels are all spellcaster levels this would give you 15d6 SA to piggy back on all your ray spells. Making them cantrips a lot more lethal.
necrosnoop110
05-26-04, 11:08 PM I'm sorry I hate to be the one to do this but I can't find Kelvezu in MM2. Is it under a different heading or something? Page?

Thanks,
Necrosnoop

Found it right after I said I couldn't find it, always works that way. It's on page 60 under the heading Demon if anyone else was lost.

PS - If that Aasimar 0 level thing is out of the question in your campaign you can use the "Otherworldly" feat in the PGtF
Mucknuggle
05-27-04, 08:14 AM With all the fuzz about the polymorph clarifications i started to think a bit about polymorph and came to this little nifty trick

What's the fuzz you are writing about?
Funny Slaughter
05-27-04, 08:18 AM What's the fuzz you are writing about?

see wizards.com for the latest "inventions" of the sage. or find the link in one of the rant-threads over here.
or wait until i send you the link ;)

gs
Funny

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Neonsamurai 05-26-04, 04:04 PM	With all the fuzz about the polymorph clarifications i started to think a bit about polymorph and came to this little nifty trick: You need 12 HD You need maxed out UMD You need a wand of polymorph (caster level 12th) You need the outsider type So lets say we have a 12th level aasimar 0 rogue with maxed out UMD and a CL12 wand of polymorph. Use it to polymorph into a Kelvezu to pump your DEX way through the roof, get a lot natural armor, continous poison (CON damage), good bonuses to hide and move silently and 8D6 ADDITIONAL SNEAK ATTACK DICE :D If this isnt something that every 2WF rogue desires i don't know what :p
Critical Mass 05-26-04, 04:20 PM	Kelvezu? MMII? FF? Which book?
Neonsamurai 05-26-04, 04:27 PM	Its from MM2
Grim Sage 05-26-04, 04:29 PM	cute but the whole point about ECL0 planetouched is that they aren't outsiders anymore :rolleyes:
Autosponge 05-26-04, 04:29 PM	"following types: aberration, animal, dragon, fey, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, plant, or vermin. " Not Outsider (extraplanar) (which I'm pretty sure you're refering to a Demon).
Effling 05-26-04, 04:38 PM	Grim Sage, that's the beauty of the Savage Species Aasimar, it's ECL +0 and still an Outsider. Later on, you could take another "level" in Aasimar, giving you +1 LA and getting all the fun benefits.
Neonsamurai 05-26-04, 04:50 PM	And even if you don't or can't use the Aasimar 0 cheese, you still can go for the "real" aasimar. 14d6 sneak attack at ECL13 is still impressive enough ;o)
Grim Sage 05-26-04, 04:51 PM	oh yeah, forgot about that one... usually when people say 'ECL0 [Planetouched]' they mean the PGtF version. And i still think it's kinda dodgy to never take the rest of the levels; as you'd be walking around as essentially an incomplete race... but then again by the rules it's legal so you can probably come up with a good ingame reason for it... "When she learned of her divine heritage, she began transcending her form, becoming something beyond mere mortality... but she became bored with it after awhile so she stopped in favor of persuing a career as pickpocket" Should make an interesting character to say the least...
Ricter 05-26-04, 06:11 PM	Anyone know if they're going to make more savage progressions, or if there are hardfast rules to make your own?
Grim Sage 05-26-04, 06:21 PM	The Savage Progressions articles were discontinued; you can still view all the past ones but there won't be any new. As for making your own; it's pretty easy: Divide the template in [amount of ECL] equal chunks and put them in order of least powerful to most. it's mostly a matter of experience; take a look at the savage progressions, the SS progressions and the ones by players on the SS boards; then try making your own (starting with ECL +1 to +3 templates / races). Keep asking yourself these things: Would i want to play this as a player, would there be any reason not to play it, and would i allow this as a DM. If the answer to all questions is 'yes', you're well on your way. Ask around on the SS boards (or PM me) if you want some more help.
newblar32 05-26-04, 10:28 PM	A Kelvezu is also deadly in an Arcane Trickster build. Aasimar0/Rogue1/Wizard5/GuildTheif1/AT10/XXX The added bonus from the Kelvezu is that it also grants evasion. This would allow you to save a level and still keep the same survivability as a rogue3 AT build. Also, assuming the last 3 levels are all spellcaster levels this would give you 15d6 SA to piggy back on all your ray spells. Making them cantrips a lot more lethal.
necrosnoop110 05-26-04, 11:08 PM	I'm sorry I hate to be the one to do this but I can't find Kelvezu in MM2. Is it under a different heading or something? Page? Thanks, Necrosnoop Found it right after I said I couldn't find it, always works that way. It's on page 60 under the heading Demon if anyone else was lost. PS - If that Aasimar 0 level thing is out of the question in your campaign you can use the "Otherworldly" feat in the PGtF
Mucknuggle 05-27-04, 08:14 AM	With all the fuzz about the polymorph clarifications i started to think a bit about polymorph and came to this little nifty trick What's the fuzz you are writing about?
Funny Slaughter 05-27-04, 08:18 AM	What's the fuzz you are writing about? see wizards.com for the latest "inventions" of the sage. or find the link in one of the rant-threads over here. or wait until i send you the link ;) gs Funny