Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Fălenganor 01-16-05, 12:43 AM	Well, I'm not a rogue fan, but since it's over 3 AM and I have nothing better to do I came up with a build, and any sugestions of improvements are apreciated(and a way to sneak more than one sneak attack per round would be apreciated): Rogue 3/ Spellthief 1/ Ninja 1/ Cancer Mage 1/ Invisible Blade 5/ Ronin 1/ Assassin 1/ Guild Thief 1/ Bayushi Deceiver 1/ Psychic Rogue 1/ Nightsong Enforcer 1/ Shadow Thief of Amn 1/ Something 2 Sneak attack 15d6(1d6 is actually sudden strike from Ninja) Well, anything I missed? Improvements?Anyone cares to do the saves?
Burning Duck 01-16-05, 04:10 AM	According to WotC "Rules Reference": 3.0 Ninja of the Crescent Moon -> 3.5 Ninja (base class from Complete Adventurer) Sorry
Pinky's brain 01-16-05, 05:39 AM	Polymorph can net you addition sneak attack dice (kelvezu, splinterwaif etc), Flanking, ring of blinking, blindsight with smoke/fog (smokesticks, eversmoking bottle etc). Lots of ways to get more than 1 sneak attack a round. Since you have invisible blade you can just feint too. With UA's fractional addition your BAB/saves would obviously be higher. Without that the skillfull weapon ability can help (although you are still boned if you want to use touch attacks from spells ... unless you take a level in daggerspell mage). You'd still have poor saves.
Snicker-Snack 01-16-05, 07:42 AM	Well, you could also use the Sneak Attack Fighter variant from Unearthed Arcana, and if you don't mind using Rokugan material, there's always the Rokugan Ninja.
Caelic 01-16-05, 09:27 AM	Uhm...you are keeping in mind that SoD isn't just a class with "good alignment" as a requirement...it's an Exalted class. Right? Other than that, it's an impressive SA total. I think there are better ways to accomplish it, though. If you're good enough to convince your DM to allow you to retain Exalted class abilities while jumping to a Vile class the very next level, you're surely good enough to convince him to allow you to use the Generic Spellcaster from Unearthed Arcana--in which case you can net yourself a similar SA total and ninth-level arcane spellcasting to boot.
Fălenganor 01-16-05, 12:06 PM	I don't like variant rules, the same way, I hardly ever use Dragon material. Thanks for the help people, anyone knows more classes with 1d6 sneak attack at level 1?
Caelic 01-16-05, 01:06 PM	Spymaster, from S&S.
Santherus 01-16-05, 01:11 PM	???? >> and a way to sneak more than one sneak attack per round would be apreciated): Errr... nothing limits you to one sneak attack per round - you have invisible blade 5, allowing you to feint as a free action - unless I'm missing something obvious here. I can't see the build working as written though, as Slayer of Domiel has a Good Alignment prereq - when you lose the prereq, you lose the class features gained - i.e. that die of sneak attack.
Caelic 01-16-05, 01:15 PM	I would personally drop the Cancer Mage, and take the feat (I misremember what it's called) that increases sneak attack against favored enemies.
Fălenganor 01-16-05, 01:21 PM	Slayer and Ninja of the Crescent Moon are now out. Caelic, why droping Cancer Mage? And what's this feat's name?
Santherus 01-16-05, 03:06 PM	Just off the top of my head: A BAB that bad means that a) You won't be hitting that often b) you won't be getting many attacks. An off the wall idea might be to use warlock 4 for deceive item to give a 'take 10' on UMD checks - this might help you to use staffs/scrolls of Divine Power as a BAB boost. Perhaps hideous blow as an invocation if you decide that 1 attack REALLY needs to hurt. I've not gotten Complete Adventurer yet, but you might find the spring attack route works well for you along with the scout's extra damaging abilities. Worth a look. Finally: Might be worth getting somone to run the maths for you, and ascertain whether it's worth getting the 'deadly precision' feat as you've so MANY sneak attack. Deadly Precision basically lets you reroll 1s on sneak attack dice, I think that it's a feat found in the XPH. [edited for typo]
Tenken 01-17-05, 09:53 AM	There's a magic weapon enchantment that lets you add +2d6 to your sneak attack.
The Lone Drow 01-17-05, 10:15 AM	You could also be good and take the exalted feat that nets you d8s on SA against evil.
Santherus 01-17-05, 03:18 PM	He's got cancer mage and assassin in there. Good alignment isn't an option :D
Ramses III 01-18-05, 03:30 AM	Spymaster, from S&S. Spymaster's reprinted in CV and doesn't have SA at level 1. Hmm, that affects my assassin build a bit... though now I only have to take 1 level of spymaster to get the key ability I need from it....
Richmud 01-18-05, 10:40 PM	Well if you have enough intelligence to get bonus spells as an assassin you can use the first level assassin spell from complete adv call distract assailent and make your foe flatfooted as a swift action
Kelyme 01-19-05, 12:22 PM	Like Tenken said one of the only 2 new enchantments in complete adventurer enchants a weapon for +2d6 more sneak attack.
Fălenganor 01-19-05, 12:58 PM	+2d6 from spell and +2d6 from weapon for a total 17d6. Any more ideas?
Pinky's brain 01-19-05, 01:52 PM	Polymorph.
Fălenganor 01-19-05, 07:30 PM	Polymorph. :drool: Kelzevu for +8d6, isn't it? We're at 25d6 now :evillaugh
Kanphuzian_Duskwalker 01-19-05, 09:56 PM	Can one sneak attack with a Scyth? That would up the damage considerably. :D
FlimFlam 01-19-05, 10:11 PM	Are you looking for JUST Sneak Attack damage, or any "precision" damage? Or perhaps things that add extra d6s to damage? If it is the later, you can also take Psionic Weapon (adds +2d6) and Greater Psionic Weapon (bumps that up another +2d6, for a total of +4d6). Take the Wild Talent feat, then you can get these two... Oh yes, and don't forget to take a level in the "generic" Expert class, for a chance to pick up another +2d6 sneak attack (this is from Arcana Unearthed variant rules).
Fălenganor 01-19-05, 10:27 PM	Are you looking for JUST Sneak Attack damage, or any "precision" damage? Or perhaps things that add extra d6s to damage? If it is the later, you can also take Psionic Weapon (adds +2d6) and Greater Psionic Weapon (bumps that up another +2d6, for a total of +4d6). Take the Wild Talent feat, then you can get these two... Oh yes, and don't forget to take a level in the "generic" Expert class, for a chance to pick up another +2d6 sneak attack (this is from Arcana Unearthed variant rules). I'm not using variant rules, and I'm looking only to increase sneak attack(and sudden strike too, if it proves more optimal to the build), but your sugestions are welcome, when I make the ''full'' character I'll surely add them :D .
Lord Likk 01-19-05, 11:27 PM	shadow thief of amn 1 will get you another 1d6 sa. someone out there with cv ought to be able to find 3 more classes with +1d6 sa at lvl one. if that isn't possible, but one more could be found, you could go sta1/xxx2/that class1, where xxx=a class you've already started (rogue, for instance), that'll provide another 1d6 sa in two lvls. the former will net you 29d6 by lvl20, the latter 28d6, assuming all of the previous methods work fine.
Fălenganor 01-19-05, 11:45 PM	Well, I'm not a rogue fan, but since it's over 3 AM and I have nothing better to do I came up with a build, and any sugestions of improvements are apreciated(and a way to sneak more than one sneak attack per round would be apreciated): Rogue 3/ Spellthief 1/ Ninja 1/ Cancer Mage 1/ Invisible Blade 5/ Ronin 1/ Assassin 1/ Guild Thief 1/ Bayushi Deceiver 1/ Psychic Rogue 1/ Nightsong Enforcer 1/ Shadow Thief of Amn 1/ Something 2 An alternative: Rogue 3/ Spellthief 1/ Ninja 1/ Cancer Mage 1/ Invisible Blade 5/ Ronin 1/ Assassin 1/ Guild Thief 1/ Bayushi Deceiver 1/ Psychic Rogue 1/ Nightsong Enforcer 4 For 11 BAB but less sneak attack.
PonTelon 08-07-05, 04:36 PM	The best way to get more out of your sneak attacks are not to get +1d6 but get one more attack in a round to do extra damage. Polymorph into a Hydra comes to mind, but another alternative would be to build a TWF rogue and have something/someone to keep you hasted at all times. Give yourself two speed weapons(probably combined with the +2d6 enhancement) I'll let others work out the BAB, but given a +15 BAB that is 6(3 per hand) attacks +1(Hasted)+2(2 speed weapons) for 9 sneak attacks in a round. If you manage a 20 BAB(perhaps from the Fighter Variant in UA) that mans 2 more attacks a round. +10d6+2d6(from enhancement)+8d6(Polymorph)=20d6 per attack 20d6*9 attacks=180d6 possible sneak attack damage. Go Variant Fighter and that makes it: 20d6*11=220d6 possible sneak attack damage a round. It's also a lot easier to get a character OK'd that only has one class than one that has 20 different classes. Invisible Blade(pre-erratta) would be a definitely good choice for this build. Of course, Greater Invisibility should do the trick just as well, though. Is there any other way to get more attacks per round than that Pre-epic? Since every other attack is an extra +20d6 damage, one more attack helps tons. This still doesn't compare to a well-built Warmage in all out damage, but it's pretty darn good for not resorting to cheesy stuff.
NekoWorldOrder 08-07-05, 05:07 PM	Since you already have two evil classes in there, don't forget Craven from Lords of Ruin! Not extra dice, but +1 damage on a sneak attack for every level you have. Also, th Fingerblade from Sandstorm adds another 1D6 damage again a flatfooted opponent on the first round of combat. Not great, but since we're just trying to up the damage here... :D
allenchan 08-07-05, 05:42 PM	Isnt there a race in MMIII that gives S/A based on total HD, or is my memory really bad?
Jolly Josh 08-07-05, 08:09 PM	There's a magic weapon enchantment that lets you add +2d6 to your sneak attack. dual strike TWF those bonuses
AlienFromBeyond 08-07-05, 08:31 PM	There's that new Indigo Strike from the Magic of Incarnum preview...
PonTelon 08-18-05, 11:56 PM	The race in Sandstorm, Marrulurk gives +2d6 sneak attack, a death attack, and poison use(along with a breath weapon) all for +1 LA. I thought this was an interesting find for any rogue(though it does have 3 HD)
spaceadet 08-19-05, 01:17 AM	A level of Scout will give you +1d6 Skirmish. which is pretty much treated as a SA bonus
Surreal 08-19-05, 03:33 AM	Does anyone have a good way to abuse Savage Grapple? I can't seem to find a good way to balance grapple ability with sneak attack (and wind up being mediocre at both)
SaintX 08-19-05, 09:00 AM	you cant stack speed weapons with speed weapons or haste rogue 3 ninja 3 spellthief 1 assassin 3 dread commando 5 invisible blade 5 this has 8d6 sneak attack and 5d6 sudden strike and BAB 16 theres a difficult feat crunch and a question about xp penalty but point blank shot, far shot, WF daggar (IB Prereqs) dodge, mobility (DC Prereqs) 2wf, i2wf, g2wf (for extra sneak attacks) deadly precision (reroll 1's on SA) craven 13d6+2d6mgc+8d6polymorph =23d6 x 8 attacks when hasted. =184d6 i cant find the spell that increases sneak attack damage. having a high UMD with wands of grave strike, golem strike, vine strike, and wraithstrike would be very helpful as well.