Post/Author/DateTime	Post
shervie 10-11-04, 04:46 PM	Hello, Have lurked for months ad finally registered. Was looking for help crafting a full build for a dastardly wizard or sorccerer, mostly just feats after 1st lvl. I apoligize for the lack of sources, I'm away from my books at the moment, but here goes. The basic idea involves a human or strongheart (I think) halfling for two feats at first level. 28 point build. First level feats are Fell Drain (liber mortis pg. 27, +2 spell lvl. any living creature damaged by the spell gains one neg. lvl. Neg. lvl lasts 1 hour/caster lvl. no save to remove and apparently no save to resist.) and easy metamagic (dragon #325, pg. 62) that reduces the cost of a metamagic feat, chosen at the time the feat is gained, by one level. At first lvl. fell drain can then be applied to a 0 lvl. spell. I like acid splash for no save no SR. Continues to be effective over many levels if I'm not mistaken. Any input as to how effective level drain is this early on? Can anyone tell me why this wouldn't work? Is the quick burst of power worth delaying PrC entry? thanks in advance, shervie <edit: added proper sources of feats>
AngryJoe 10-11-04, 05:43 PM	Now, I am not familiar with the two feats you listed but I can offer some advice. Personally, I don't feel that negative levels this early in the game are really worth your time. Negative levels give -1 to attack, saves, skill checks, HD, and spell levels (if I forgot something, post them). Yes, it will kill anything of 1HD or lower, but at the same time so will a magic missile or even your trusty crossbow. Which brings me to my next point: Why cripple your progress to the PrC of your choice? The feats you listed might not be bad at later levels, but you really should focus on feats that will get you out of wizard ASAP.
shervie 10-11-04, 06:47 PM	neg. level also give -5 HP. which boosts the damage from acid splash to 6-8 per spell, while providing support in the form of combat mods to other PC's. Also interested in the possibility of Diping into as many caster classes as possible for gobs of first lvl. slots to drain with, possibly sor, clr, etc. into PrC that gives bonus slots, not spell lvls. -shervie
scrollreader 10-11-04, 08:39 PM	If you damage a creature multiple times with the spell, do they gain multiple negative levels? And is this an [Evil] feat? If the answers are Yes, then No, respectively, my artificer is now one hell of alot scarier. :D
shervie 10-11-04, 10:20 PM	as far as I know negative levels stack regardless of source. The feat makes no mention of bestowing the [evil] descriptor to the spell modified, so one could assume it doesn't. However, your GM may disagree on the topic. I probably would. Hope your arty makes awe-fell use of this. -shervie
scrollreader 10-11-04, 10:25 PM	No. The question isn;t if I hit them four rounds in a row, if they get four negative levels (they do). The question is what happens when I hit the BBEG with four of my MM from the same spell. Does he get four? Or just one?
AngryJoe 10-11-04, 10:29 PM	Right, so your acid orb does 6-8 dmg now? It's not bad for now, but once again you run into the problem of what your character is going to do in the long run. As you stated, you could dip into multiple spellcasting classes to get a ton of 1st level spell slots, but your overall effectiveness as a wizard/sorcerer is going to suffer. You're going to lose a lot of really good higher level spells (both damage and utility) and when you finally get mid level spells, they're going to be late (i.e. 2nd level wizard spells like at level 8-9, yikes!). If you want to play an enervating madman, then by all means do so, your plan works for that. Just remember, your overall effectiveness will suffer due to slow CL progression, on top of the two feats you used to do this (meaning very late PrC's).
shervie 10-11-04, 10:30 PM	I see. That's been the biggest point of discussion in my group so far. As for MM we've been leaning toward no, but if all four are sent to different targets they all get a neg. lvl. Still not sure how acid arrow, fire shield, spike growth, wall spells, and magic weapon behave.
scrollreader 10-11-04, 10:35 PM	What are the pre-reqs for this marvelous little feat? It seems /perfect/ for my artificer. Twinned, Quickened, Acid Splashes would give me ... 4 negative levels, no save and no SR, for a lowly 375 GP wand. Much cheaper than the wand of evervation. :P And hey, as long as we're going that way ... at higher levels, a twinned, quickened, maximized enervation does 20 negative levels. Better hope you're got SR. :D
AngryJoe 10-11-04, 10:41 PM	And as far as Magic Missile is concerned, I agree that a single target of multiple missiles should only get one negative level, while multiple targets of one casting should all get netative levels. Spells that do damage over time (Fire Shield, Wall of Fire, Barrier spells, etc...) should only give one negative level per creature no matter how many times they are damaged by a single casting. In other words, like the Magic Missile situation, a single creature will only recieve one negative level per casting. And as far as Magic Weapon/Fang is concerned, the spell itself isn't doing damage, the weapon is. And the damage of the weapon is being augmented by the spell. I guess it's kind of up to your DM on how that works, but I don't think it should.
shervie 10-11-04, 10:42 PM	No prereq's. And don't forget repeat spell. Don't know if it's 3.5, either from an old splat book or dragon iirc, cast the same spell on the same target again the next round (assuming they're still in range & a valid target)
Qaetar 10-12-04, 12:48 PM	Apocalypse from the Sky could be a later use of this baby. (Qaetar)