a blind fighter [Archive] - Wizards Community

a blind fighter [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
The Wild Rover
12-30-05, 02:26 PM hey all, i had a bit of an idea after i saw blind fight. to make a character that was entirely blind

i thought the idea is pretty cool, actually i'm not sure but i might have seen a thread on it before but i have little to no recollection on it.

anyways aside from blind fight how else can i make my character useful? i know there is the wild feat blindsense but i'm really not looking to make a character that shapeshifts

there's hear the unseen but that requires a move action to locate all the enemies

basically what i was hoping for was a way to get blindsense without having to take wild feats.

for those that are curious i was actually planning to play a soulknife 16/shadow sentinel3/ fighter1 or soulknife 16/ shadow sentinel 4 i haven't really decided. and yes i know these aren't the most optimised builds but my DM hates dipping into alot of different classes, 3 is usually the most he'll allow.
AviLazar
12-30-05, 02:37 PM Since you are totally giving up vision, why not ask your DM to compensate by giving you Blind Sense that is 10 feet/level (ala Daredevil)

It is still subpar to regular sight...yes on occasion, when the DM decides to put the group in total darkness, you will be ok...but that does not happen very often - and you are still limited to 10'/level.

Other then that..your best bet is taking blind fight feat, and either picking up a wild shaping class to get blind sense, or getting a magical item that will let you see...but if you are going to all that trouble, then it is not worth losing your sight.

I personall think a VoP Monk who is blind, but compensated with the above blind sense would be cool to play.
rilem
12-30-05, 02:42 PM This comes up every couple of months. You might try an advanced search on google.

What you want to do is come up with overlapping solutions, each of which can help in certain circumstances.

1. Psionic classes give a bunch of options: Synesthete (hear light), Touchsight and even Psicrystal, which acts as your seeing-eye rock.

2. Mindsight (LoM) lets you pinpoint stuff, if you can get telepathy somehow. I think Eberron Changelings can get this.

3. Hear the Unseen is obvious, and worthwhile.

4. Sword & Fist had Blindsight, 5-foot radius. Requires a high wisdom.

5. Grimlocks are nifty.

6. Blindfold of Perfect Darkness (A&E Guide) gives blindsight 60ft. and is ridiculously unbalanced at its current price.

Just a note: a lot of people who ask for a "blind fighter" are really asking for "a fighter who's just as competent as a sighted fighter in every way" which isn't really rational given the advantages that blindness gives you in D&D.
Surreal
12-30-05, 03:29 PM There's the feat chain from Sandstorm: Scorpion's Resolve and Scorpion's Sense, which gives you a +4 against mind effect, and limited tremorsense.
rilem
12-30-05, 03:43 PM Right, forgot that. Cave Lord gives you tremorsense, too. Listening Lorecall (Complete Adventurer) gives you blindsight for a limited time.

Another note: A soulknife-heavy build is not a great idea for this, as you'll need feats, spells or powers and maybe racial hit dice — or a combination thereof — to pull it off.
The Wild Rover
12-30-05, 03:55 PM first off thanks everyone for the tips, there were some i had no idea about so good lookin out there

second let me just say ya, i know the soulknife is a poor way to go about doing this, really all i was asking is if there were any ways to get blindsight/blindsense with a feat/feats, you guys have answered that and i thank you, it seems like this is not the build to try out this concept
Gerdreg
12-30-05, 03:56 PM MoI has a few ways to gain blindsight, though some of them may require a move action to use (I don't have my book handy).
1. The Soulsight Feat
2. The Shadow Mantle Soulmeld
3. The level 7 ability of the Umbral Disciple PrC.

As an aside, I LOVE the Soulknife Shadow Sentinel combo. So few classes can be used to improve the Soul Blade (just Kensai and Shadow Sentinel I believe?). I think Soulknife 5/ Umbral Disciple 3 is a great segway into Shadow Sentinel and it gives HiPS. You can take Psycarnum Blade or Midnight Dodge (it can be taken in place of Dodge to meet the Spring Attack requirement, which you should take if you have HiPS anyway) to meet the essentia requirment. Shadow Sentinel is full BAB, so I use it to get to BAB +16 if you can. I personally like Soulknife 5/ Umbral Disciple 3/ Shadow Sentinel 8/ Umbral Disciple 4-7 as a build. I also love the Weapon Focus (Mind Blade) synergy with Improved Aesh Sigil (essentially you get a +2 damage with every form your blade can take via Shape Mind Blade and Morphic Blade).
rilem
12-30-05, 04:02 PM I don't mind Soulknife, just 16 levels may be too much when you need flexibility.

Soulsight — that would help. You'll still need feats, though: Soulsight + Open Chakra (brow) + Bonus Essentia + Midnight Dodge will get you 20 ft. blindsight. Does umbral disciple give Chakra Binds? That would save you a feat.
Abulafia
12-30-05, 04:06 PM There's a PrC in the Quintessential Monk (3.0) that is geared around the blind fighter archetype. I think it's called Blind Master. Anyway, if you have access to QM check it out.
Gerdreg
12-30-05, 04:10 PM I don't mind Soulknife, just 16 levels may be too much when you need flexibility.

Soulsight — that would help. You'll still need feats, though: Soulsight + Open Chakra (brow) + Bonus Essentia + Midnight Dodge will get you 20 ft. blindsight. Does umbral disciple give Chakra Binds? That would save you a feat.

UD does not grant Chakra binds but gives you full Blindsight (10' per essentia) at level 7.
Molimo
12-30-05, 04:27 PM If you want to get a bit more exotic, play as a Hag, form a covey with two NPCs, and get a Hag Eye. You can see through it whenever you want, so it's a good way to have no eyes but still see. If you're an Annis Hag, you also get fog cloud 3/day as a SLA, which of course is convenient for a fighter who doesn't have to worry about seeing her opponents; Annis also get blind-fight automatically.
AegisShade
12-30-05, 05:24 PM From Complete Adventurer, the spell Embrace the Wild gives you the senses of any animal whose HD is up to your caster level for 10 min/caster level. Use that and take on the bat's blindsense 20 ft. (or better yet, the dire bat's 40 ft. range) and you got yourself a freaky lil':fight!:. Best part is, it's a Druid 1, Ranger 1 spell!

If they for some reason go invisible, take the Earth Sense feat from Races of Stone. Sure you can't pinpoint them with it, but it'll sure be fun surprising them even when they think they're completely hidden from you.

Certainly this isn't the permanent answer to your question, but it'd be humorous to play a blind character who walks around stumbling into things but then wades into combat and whoops :censored:.
ninjarabbit
12-30-05, 06:23 PM Maybe havea familar act as your eyes.
slimgoodbody
12-30-05, 08:51 PM Take Blind Fight cause, well, you have to. Next, take Hear the Unseen to make listen checks in order to tell where enemies are. Unfortunately, listening in a non-reflexive manner requires a move action. You can circumvent this by taking Quick Reconnoiter, which allows you to make listen and spot checks as a free action every round, and grants you a +2 unnamed bonus to initiative. If your DM allows you to take the 5 ft. Blindsight feet from Sword and Fist, you're pretty much set. Go first due to good initiative, listen for enemies, charge over and start making penalty-less attacks once you're within melee range. You end up with a very Zatoichi style fighter: a blind warrior that doesn't require magic to still be effective in combat. A good thing to round out the build would be Improved Initiative, to beef up initiative even more and make sure you can stomp your enemies before they can take advantage of your blindness.
rilem
12-30-05, 10:16 PM Take Blind Fight cause, well, you have to ... You end up with a very Zatoichi style fighter.

Mix all of that with Psychic Warrior (for feats, powers and Psicrystal) and you'll be in decent shape. (Though according to the last thread this came in, Zatoichi was just pretending to be blind the whole time, which is probably an even better strategy. Just put lots of ranks in bluff).
Skilgannon
12-30-05, 10:20 PM If you want to look at an idea on how the character would play - I suggest you pick up the Zatoichi movies - they are japanese (at least from memory) movies about a blind masseur who is also an expert swordsman.
Far_Traveler
12-31-05, 07:39 PM there is a listed benefit to being blind you know...

two bonus feats. thwere is a flaw called one-eyed, and you can take it twice for complete blindness (by being naturally eyeless), this also trumps regeneration
klode_me
12-31-05, 07:59 PM there is a listed benefit to being blind you know...

two bonus feats. thwere is a flaw called one-eyed, and you can take it twice for complete blindness (by being naturally eyeless), this also trumps regeneration

Source?
Ectoplasmoid
01-01-06, 04:13 AM Consider Changeling Rog5/Cabinet Trickster5/Mindspy5/X5. Grab Mindsight from LoM and you're good to go.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The Wild Rover 12-30-05, 02:26 PM	hey all, i had a bit of an idea after i saw blind fight. to make a character that was entirely blind i thought the idea is pretty cool, actually i'm not sure but i might have seen a thread on it before but i have little to no recollection on it. anyways aside from blind fight how else can i make my character useful? i know there is the wild feat blindsense but i'm really not looking to make a character that shapeshifts there's hear the unseen but that requires a move action to locate all the enemies basically what i was hoping for was a way to get blindsense without having to take wild feats. for those that are curious i was actually planning to play a soulknife 16/shadow sentinel3/ fighter1 or soulknife 16/ shadow sentinel 4 i haven't really decided. and yes i know these aren't the most optimised builds but my DM hates dipping into alot of different classes, 3 is usually the most he'll allow.
AviLazar 12-30-05, 02:37 PM	Since you are totally giving up vision, why not ask your DM to compensate by giving you Blind Sense that is 10 feet/level (ala Daredevil) It is still subpar to regular sight...yes on occasion, when the DM decides to put the group in total darkness, you will be ok...but that does not happen very often - and you are still limited to 10'/level. Other then that..your best bet is taking blind fight feat, and either picking up a wild shaping class to get blind sense, or getting a magical item that will let you see...but if you are going to all that trouble, then it is not worth losing your sight. I personall think a VoP Monk who is blind, but compensated with the above blind sense would be cool to play.
rilem 12-30-05, 02:42 PM	This comes up every couple of months. You might try an advanced search on google. What you want to do is come up with overlapping solutions, each of which can help in certain circumstances. 1. Psionic classes give a bunch of options: Synesthete (hear light), Touchsight and even Psicrystal, which acts as your seeing-eye rock. 2. Mindsight (LoM) lets you pinpoint stuff, if you can get telepathy somehow. I think Eberron Changelings can get this. 3. Hear the Unseen is obvious, and worthwhile. 4. Sword & Fist had Blindsight, 5-foot radius. Requires a high wisdom. 5. Grimlocks are nifty. 6. Blindfold of Perfect Darkness (A&E Guide) gives blindsight 60ft. and is ridiculously unbalanced at its current price. Just a note: a lot of people who ask for a "blind fighter" are really asking for "a fighter who's just as competent as a sighted fighter in every way" which isn't really rational given the advantages that blindness gives you in D&D.
Surreal 12-30-05, 03:29 PM	There's the feat chain from Sandstorm: Scorpion's Resolve and Scorpion's Sense, which gives you a +4 against mind effect, and limited tremorsense.
rilem 12-30-05, 03:43 PM	Right, forgot that. Cave Lord gives you tremorsense, too. Listening Lorecall (Complete Adventurer) gives you blindsight for a limited time. Another note: A soulknife-heavy build is not a great idea for this, as you'll need feats, spells or powers and maybe racial hit dice — or a combination thereof — to pull it off.
The Wild Rover 12-30-05, 03:55 PM	first off thanks everyone for the tips, there were some i had no idea about so good lookin out there second let me just say ya, i know the soulknife is a poor way to go about doing this, really all i was asking is if there were any ways to get blindsight/blindsense with a feat/feats, you guys have answered that and i thank you, it seems like this is not the build to try out this concept
Gerdreg 12-30-05, 03:56 PM	MoI has a few ways to gain blindsight, though some of them may require a move action to use (I don't have my book handy). 1. The Soulsight Feat 2. The Shadow Mantle Soulmeld 3. The level 7 ability of the Umbral Disciple PrC. As an aside, I LOVE the Soulknife Shadow Sentinel combo. So few classes can be used to improve the Soul Blade (just Kensai and Shadow Sentinel I believe?). I think Soulknife 5/ Umbral Disciple 3 is a great segway into Shadow Sentinel and it gives HiPS. You can take Psycarnum Blade or Midnight Dodge (it can be taken in place of Dodge to meet the Spring Attack requirement, which you should take if you have HiPS anyway) to meet the essentia requirment. Shadow Sentinel is full BAB, so I use it to get to BAB +16 if you can. I personally like Soulknife 5/ Umbral Disciple 3/ Shadow Sentinel 8/ Umbral Disciple 4-7 as a build. I also love the Weapon Focus (Mind Blade) synergy with Improved Aesh Sigil (essentially you get a +2 damage with every form your blade can take via Shape Mind Blade and Morphic Blade).
rilem 12-30-05, 04:02 PM	I don't mind Soulknife, just 16 levels may be too much when you need flexibility. Soulsight — that would help. You'll still need feats, though: Soulsight + Open Chakra (brow) + Bonus Essentia + Midnight Dodge will get you 20 ft. blindsight. Does umbral disciple give Chakra Binds? That would save you a feat.
Abulafia 12-30-05, 04:06 PM	There's a PrC in the Quintessential Monk (3.0) that is geared around the blind fighter archetype. I think it's called Blind Master. Anyway, if you have access to QM check it out.
Gerdreg 12-30-05, 04:10 PM	I don't mind Soulknife, just 16 levels may be too much when you need flexibility. Soulsight — that would help. You'll still need feats, though: Soulsight + Open Chakra (brow) + Bonus Essentia + Midnight Dodge will get you 20 ft. blindsight. Does umbral disciple give Chakra Binds? That would save you a feat. UD does not grant Chakra binds but gives you full Blindsight (10' per essentia) at level 7.
Molimo 12-30-05, 04:27 PM	If you want to get a bit more exotic, play as a Hag, form a covey with two NPCs, and get a Hag Eye. You can see through it whenever you want, so it's a good way to have no eyes but still see. If you're an Annis Hag, you also get fog cloud 3/day as a SLA, which of course is convenient for a fighter who doesn't have to worry about seeing her opponents; Annis also get blind-fight automatically.
AegisShade 12-30-05, 05:24 PM	From Complete Adventurer, the spell Embrace the Wild gives you the senses of any animal whose HD is up to your caster level for 10 min/caster level. Use that and take on the bat's blindsense 20 ft. (or better yet, the dire bat's 40 ft. range) and you got yourself a freaky lil':fight!:. Best part is, it's a Druid 1, Ranger 1 spell! If they for some reason go invisible, take the Earth Sense feat from Races of Stone. Sure you can't pinpoint them with it, but it'll sure be fun surprising them even when they think they're completely hidden from you. Certainly this isn't the permanent answer to your question, but it'd be humorous to play a blind character who walks around stumbling into things but then wades into combat and whoops :censored:.
ninjarabbit 12-30-05, 06:23 PM	Maybe havea familar act as your eyes.
slimgoodbody 12-30-05, 08:51 PM	Take Blind Fight cause, well, you have to. Next, take Hear the Unseen to make listen checks in order to tell where enemies are. Unfortunately, listening in a non-reflexive manner requires a move action. You can circumvent this by taking Quick Reconnoiter, which allows you to make listen and spot checks as a free action every round, and grants you a +2 unnamed bonus to initiative. If your DM allows you to take the 5 ft. Blindsight feet from Sword and Fist, you're pretty much set. Go first due to good initiative, listen for enemies, charge over and start making penalty-less attacks once you're within melee range. You end up with a very Zatoichi style fighter: a blind warrior that doesn't require magic to still be effective in combat. A good thing to round out the build would be Improved Initiative, to beef up initiative even more and make sure you can stomp your enemies before they can take advantage of your blindness.
rilem 12-30-05, 10:16 PM	Take Blind Fight cause, well, you have to ... You end up with a very Zatoichi style fighter. Mix all of that with Psychic Warrior (for feats, powers and Psicrystal) and you'll be in decent shape. (Though according to the last thread this came in, Zatoichi was just pretending to be blind the whole time, which is probably an even better strategy. Just put lots of ranks in bluff).
Skilgannon 12-30-05, 10:20 PM	If you want to look at an idea on how the character would play - I suggest you pick up the Zatoichi movies - they are japanese (at least from memory) movies about a blind masseur who is also an expert swordsman.
Far_Traveler 12-31-05, 07:39 PM	there is a listed benefit to being blind you know... two bonus feats. thwere is a flaw called one-eyed, and you can take it twice for complete blindness (by being naturally eyeless), this also trumps regeneration
klode_me 12-31-05, 07:59 PM	there is a listed benefit to being blind you know... two bonus feats. thwere is a flaw called one-eyed, and you can take it twice for complete blindness (by being naturally eyeless), this also trumps regeneration Source?
Ectoplasmoid 01-01-06, 04:13 AM	Consider Changeling Rog5/Cabinet Trickster5/Mindspy5/X5. Grab Mindsight from LoM and you're good to go.