Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Illithid13 12-21-05, 02:11 PM	Ok, So I was reading this thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=543811) and had a thought that inspired me. Why not make a Warforged Legacy Item That has the Psiforged body feat and conducts itself as a paladin type. The reason for the Psiforged body feat is because they are described as having more of a sense of purpose, and I thought that this would be more compatible with my concept. The problem comes as if I were to play a Psiforged Paladin, the latent psionic nature of the psiforged body feat would be somewhat wasted. So I thought that if I defiantly wanted to do the paladin thing (code of honor, upstanding citizen, defender of the week and oppressed, you know your classic lawful stupid character), but wanted it to be more towards the psionic spectrum, maybe I could use a combo of Mind blade and psi warrior or just psi warrior or something along those lines and just RP out the code of conduct. I also wanted him to have the adamantian body feat (along with the psiforged body feat (using a flaw)... one of the stretches of my challenge, but my reasoning behind this is that it is part of his "Legacy"). My visualization of this guy is a 7 foot tall shiny behemoth that has crystal shards poking out of various parts of his body, and with 4 sizeable dragon shards in prominent places (the ones that start with a "K" and are commonly used in the creation of Psiforged). One in the middle of the forehead, one on each shoulder, and the largest one in the middle of his chest. The challenge comes in getting what I want out of what I have to work with. I thought of making him a P-Warrior 8/Ranger 2/Slayer 10. This nets me several goodies: ML 17 (level 6 p-warrior powers), Selective mind block (slayer goodies), a BAB of +18 and twf and track as class feats, plus favored enemy. The one problem with this build is the lack of Paladin feel. So I was coming to you guys to see if you could help me think of a way of being more Paladin. Would this require making a variant of the P-Warrior to be more righteous? Making a Paladin More Psionic? I don't know where to start. Lets face it. the goodies of a paladin and the goodies of a pwarrior are nicely balanced now, but combining them is a recipe for disaster. Anyone feel up to helping me out?
Khazra Reborn 12-21-05, 02:32 PM	The warmind has to be lawful & is a member of an orginisation which is a good start to build on if you consider that option. PW2/paladin8/warmind10 is a quite nice build. The mindknights (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20020819a) are a lawful orginisation who can bonuses when defending the weak. Overall you'd end up more like a PW/monk RPing as a paladin. Unfortuanetly, you'd have to update the prc with your DM. Last suggestion is paladin4/PW16 Its actually pretty good. 6th level powers & 16 BaB. If you have access, a recent issue of dragon magasine had a feat called serenity which made paladin cha related abilities wis based which would help reduce Multiple Attribute Dependency (MAD).
Grizzled Gryphon 12-21-05, 02:53 PM	I like Khazra's Paladin/ Pwarrior idea. The Pwarrior has the potential to be like any other given fighter class, and saying the powers he manifests seem divine in origon isn't all that hard to justify. As it wouldn't change the affect of the power, I see no reason for the visual aspect to look any way you want. At least, that is how I would handle it. With the above build, you have all the basics you need. After that, it is mostly a flavor problem, and you can fix that with the apparent divine aspect of your powers. Hope this helps.
catharz 12-21-05, 03:08 PM	a recent issue of dragon magasine had a feat called serenity which made paladin cha related abilities wis based which would help reduce Multiple Attribute Dependency (MAD). Recent... I think that magazine is three years old. :P But ya, you don't have to be a "paladin" to be lawful good. Kensai, for example, would work well if you could make "Mindblade" your signature weapon. How about a combo of soulknife, fighter, Kensai, and Champion of Legacy (and Warmind 5 if you can fit it in)? Use both legacy armor and the shortsword/mindblade legacy item, neither of which can be taken from you if you keep the sword in mindblade form. Otherise, Psychic Warrior 10/Champion of Legacy 10 is simple and good.
Illithid13 12-22-05, 09:39 AM	What does the Champion of Legacy do for this build. Don't have Weapons of legacy yet, but I believe it will be here on Sunday... If not, I'm ordering it.
Grizzled Gryphon 12-23-05, 06:48 AM	What does the Champion of Legacy do for this build. Don't have Weapons of legacy yet, but I believe it will be here on Sunday... If not, I'm ordering it. Waste of money. My buddy bought it, and after looking through it, I am glad I didn't.
SigmaJargon 12-23-05, 07:03 AM	I agree with Gryphon. Having read the book through, I think you will use it rarely (if ever) as a player, and almost never as an optimizer. The material in the book is too much work for the DM and too little crunch when it comes to the numbers to be really worth using in a game or buying. Just use UA's legendary weapon system instead. If you insist on sticking with WoL, I would take cathraz's advice. The soulknife is one of the few classes who can easily benefit from WoL without the whole bothersome process of designing a new legacy item. Champion of Legacy is a great way to continue advancing Kensai class abilities while gaining some Legacy item synergy (for swapping out and extra uses per day of legacy powers), though the 3/4 BAB is a step down from Kensai.
Gothic Rose 12-23-05, 08:21 AM	For the semi-paladin effect, why not go PsyWar 14/Sanctified Mind 6?
Grizzled Gryphon 12-23-05, 09:36 AM	I, in return, have to agree with Sigma. Cathraz's idea is the best way to go, as the soulknife shortsword in WoL is the only one remotely worth it. Just so you know, I am not nay saying the book from an optimizer point of veiw. If I were, I would beg and plead with you not to get the book. I don't like the book because most of the legacy costs make the weapon not worth it. What sane caster would give up a spell slot PER LEVEL for a +4 staff? And then there are the rituals. Ship Captain: "Let me get this straight, you want me to take you out to sea until we can't see land, so you can tie yourself up with chains, and jump overboard. Then, we are to wait for you for 24 hrs, and then take you back?" Player " yeah, thats it exactly!!" Captain " someone call the watch, we have a nut house escapee, here!!" I mean, come on. If you want ANY realism in the game, what captain in their right mind would do that? The only one that would is the unscrupulous one that would have you pay him up front, and set sail as soon as you were over the side. And that is just one weapon. The biggest prob with the book is all the items have more negatives than positives. The kukris have more negatives to BAB than you get bonuses to. All for bonuses to intimidate, and stuff. Well, THATS worth it. At least try and take a good long look at it before you buy it. Go to Barnes and Noble, grab a copy, and pull up a comfy chair, and read it for a while. You will see what we mean.
Illithid13 12-23-05, 10:38 AM	For the semi-paladin effect, why not go PsyWar 14/Sanctified Mind 6? Because you need divine spell casting... I am considering the PrC though. Just cannot find a good way to get the flavor I am after. Thanks for the info on WoL, I might change my mind, but the completeionest in me is screaming for it (I'm pretty good at quelling it when it comes to WotC stuff), because in several campaigns that me and my buddy DM run we have done this sort of thing over and over and over again. So I'm hoping that this will offer some other ideas to what we do.
Gothic Rose 12-23-05, 10:47 AM	No, you don't. Prereqs: Alignment: Any Nonevil Base Attack Bonus: +4 Skills: Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 2 ranks, Knowledge (psionics) 2 ranks, Sense Motive 2 ranks Feat: Iron Will Proficiency: Proficient with all Martial Weapons Psionics: Must have a power point reserve of at least 1 power point. It ADVANCES Divine Casting OR Psionic Manifestation.
Illithid13 12-28-05, 11:37 AM	No, you don't. Prereqs: Alignment: Any Nonevil Base Attack Bonus: +4 Skills: Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 2 ranks, Knowledge (psionics) 2 ranks, Sense Motive 2 ranks Feat: Iron Will Proficiency: Proficient with all Martial Weapons Psionics: Must have a power point reserve of at least 1 power point. It ADVANCES Divine Casting OR Psionic Manifestation. I read the Or as And... Sorry My wife bought the book for me for Xmas. It's an interesting read, but as you guys said, pretty much a waste of money. The whole Idea is poorly thought out. Not only do you have to pay for the ritules to unlock the powers, but you take the negitives and loose a feat or 3. So not worth it. This book needs a complete overhaul to even be useful for more than brain storming stimulation or firewood.