A houserule I want to break [Archive] - Wizards Community

A houserule I want to break [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Radijs
04-11-06, 07:01 AM My DM has instituted a houserule that rolling a threat will add an additional +10 unnamed bonus on your attack rolls. I think its a rather stupid rule but he hasn't listened to me and kept the rule.

So I want to break it with my new character. A barbarian wielding a falchion.

Now once he reaches an appropriate level or when I can amass enough wealth he will get the improved critical feat or the weapon will get the keen enhancement. They don't stack but are there other ways to increased my threat range for some really brokeny goodness?
Edit: Current build: http://members1.home.nl/jaapstoel/Mekhtor.pdf
Bio: For those who care http://members1.home.nl/jaapstoel/Mekhtor%20of%20klatch.doc
_J_
04-11-06, 07:06 AM Disciple of Dispater in Book of Vile Darkness increases threat range.
Radijs
04-11-06, 07:07 AM Thanks but I'd prefer very much to keep my character good-aligned.
Tytalus
04-11-06, 07:12 AM The old 3.0 Weapon Master [S&F] (now replaced by Exotic Weapon Master [CW]) and the Psionic Weapon Master add +2 to your threat range.

Disciple of Dispater [BoVD] is also 3.0 material (but should be compatible) and triples the threat range (which explicitly stacks with Improved Critical).
Ashianyl
04-11-06, 08:25 AM Even if you think it's abusable, just remember that monsters have the same advantage, and as the DMG says, any rule that increases a random chance of hurt actually hurts the players more.

I think it's a stupid idea only because it hurts the PCs more than it provides an advantage.

:)
_J_
04-11-06, 08:33 AM Unless the players abuse it more than the enemies :D
Asciiman
04-11-06, 10:56 AM Unless the players abuse it more than the enemies :D

Not possible. Even if the DM doesn't do anyting to increase the chance, the simple fact is that his characters can die with no real consequence to his actions. The PC's however can't die period. Numerically, the survival chance of every character should eventually approach zero. The difference being that random numbers tend to speed this along.

Fewer random chances = longer character life.
pale_enchantress
04-11-06, 11:18 AM Well get fortification armor and maby be an ac junky too if you can wing it. If you really want to break it abuse the hell out of it and don't even give anyone a chance to put it to any use on you.

On second thought maby HP is a better resistance to this then AC. Fortification still is goodness, In fact you might want to read up on the "hit me please" builds people here have where takeing damage only makes you stronger....and angry.
nittanytbone
04-11-06, 11:29 AM An alternative to the barbarian idea might be being a Kensai. This allows you to get your +X keen falchion for free, and put all that money you saved towards fortification armor.
Fwib
04-11-06, 12:03 PM That sounds very odd. Confusable with the 'rolling a nat. 20 is a 30, not an autohit' house-rule.

Is it definite that your DM meant 'crits will confirm much more often' ?
DragonChildX
04-11-06, 01:56 PM Common think about it

Improved Crit with the weapon
Class: Disciple Of Dispater (BoVD)
Ability at level 4 doubles the crit rating of the weapon (Does stack with Improved crit)
Ability at level 8 Triples the Crit rating of the weapon(Does stack with Improved crit)

So a Falcian 18-20 crit
goes to 16-20 crit from improved crit
Then drops to triple the bonus!

With the Disciple Of Dispater you can combine it with their greater Iron Hews and you will get a +6 bonus to strike and damage in one round. Usuable as many times as your con bonus!

Be Evil Just this once. Common You know you Wannna!
Llochlyn
04-11-06, 02:15 PM actually, 18-20 becomes 15-20 (18-19-20 = 3 chances, 15 16 17 18 19 20 = 6 chances)

Now, with disciple of dispater, you get to have a double critical range (3 more chances or a 12-20) then a triple critical range (6 more chances / 9-20)
Karm Hundredfists
04-11-06, 02:38 PM Play as a construct or an undead or something else that's immune to crits :P.

Seriously, ask if you can play a (3.0) weaponmaster, it's no fair that only badguys get to double their crit range.

Also, I can only imagine that Disciple of Dispater doesn't double the crit range, then triple that new crit range. Damn crit on a 9-20. You could tell your DM that since you have improved critical which doubles the crit range then you get to use the new crit range for the doubling. Crit on a 3-20, of course, usually, DMs don't like to be told things.
Wayne Frobisher
04-11-06, 04:04 PM Take the Power Critical feat (Comp. War.) to have +14 to cinfirm your crit, then do things like making your weapon out of platinum to make it heavy and do more damage, throwing proficiency out the window since it won't make any difference at all any more...

Other things that affect attack bonus like using over-sized weapons wouldn't matter either, a possible justification for Monkey Grip (or at least makes it slightly less crappy).

Make it mercurial too-a large platinum mercurial falchion.
AviLazar
04-11-06, 04:32 PM Actually, I've always liked this idea and toyed around with it a bit. But this was in a campaign where a natural 20 didn't gaurantee a hit and a natural 1 didn't gaurantee a miss. So I did a 20 gives +10 to attack and 1 gives a -10 to attack.

In standard 3.5 20 always hits, and 1 always misses so this just gives an extra advantage (and really more heavily) to those who have high crit ranges. My fellow player has a character wielding an exotic weapon with the keen weapon property...he threats 15-20...that is a lot of +10's for him.

So yea, pretty bad rule in a standard game. Especially since +attack tends to outstrip AC anyhow.
Radijs
04-11-06, 05:08 PM As far as I can guess the reasoning of my DM it has to do with the parry feats from the Dragon or dungeon magazine.

Most characters in the campaign have the feat and reciognized its power. We're using light weapons almost all the time and our attack bonuses are very high. So when he rolls a crit he's kind of annoyed when we parry the crit disallowing him some good damage. So by adding this rule he hopes to hit us a few more times when he rolls well.

Weapon master is Sword & fist? Thats a favorite book of my DM. He'll probably allow it.
ArayanAraya
04-11-06, 05:12 PM Choose Neutral Good alignment and take a 2 level dip into Stalker of Kharash from BoED. This makes all evil beings favored enemy's. Take Favored Critical feat from... I think it's the fighters splatbook. Increases your threat range against all evil and stacks with most anything.

enjoy
mostholy2
04-11-06, 05:19 PM As there are only limited ways to increase the threat range for a weapon, I think that you should focus on breaking the +10 unnamed attack bonus in addition to increasing threat range. Try to get as much power attack/improved power attack/supreme or similar increases for power attack to take advantage of the +10 attack bonus he's giving you for every threat roll you have. Continue to do this type of attack for as much damage as you can.
X-Codes
04-11-06, 05:48 PM Wow... I mean, Psychic Weapon Master dude... It's Weapon Master + 1/2 Psionic Progression. I can't believe nobody's mentioned this before.

Psywar 4/Barbarian 1 For humans, Psywar 5/Barbarian 1 for non-humans. Then do full-out Psychic Weapon Master 10, taking Combat Reflexes and Improved Critical before certain levels so you get the added benefits of those (maybe sooner if you want Whirlwind Attack as a standard action). End it out as Psywar 8/Barbarian 2/PsyWM 10.

Psychic Weapon Master (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040827d)
nihility
04-11-06, 06:52 PM I'd also advocate Psychic Weapon Master.
Radijs
04-12-06, 04:28 AM Don't you mean psywar 5/barbarian 1 or psywar 4 /barb 2 for humans?
I need Dodge, Mobility, Power Attack, Psionic Dodge, Psionic Weapon and Weapon Focus.
Humans gain 2 feats on lvl 1 and another at level 3 And psychic warrior gains 1 at first and one at 2nd level.
At lvl 5 you have 5 out of 6 feats required and a BAB of 4
Tytalus
04-12-06, 04:36 AM Wow... I mean, Psychic Weapon Master dude... It's Weapon Master + 1/2 Psionic Progression. I can't believe nobody's mentioned this before.

Uh, I mentioned it in post #4, just seemingly got the name wrong.
X-Codes
04-12-06, 07:22 AM Uh, I mentioned it in post #4, just seemingly got the name wrong.
Oh... well still, 17 replies and only one mention. Pretty odd considering all the abilities of the class.
Fwib
04-12-06, 10:19 AM Probably because PWM is from the website, not from a book, (I think)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Radijs 04-11-06, 07:01 AM	My DM has instituted a houserule that rolling a threat will add an additional +10 unnamed bonus on your attack rolls. I think its a rather stupid rule but he hasn't listened to me and kept the rule. So I want to break it with my new character. A barbarian wielding a falchion. Now once he reaches an appropriate level or when I can amass enough wealth he will get the improved critical feat or the weapon will get the keen enhancement. They don't stack but are there other ways to increased my threat range for some really brokeny goodness? Edit: Current build: http://members1.home.nl/jaapstoel/Mekhtor.pdf Bio: For those who care http://members1.home.nl/jaapstoel/Mekhtor%20of%20klatch.doc
_J_ 04-11-06, 07:06 AM	Disciple of Dispater in Book of Vile Darkness increases threat range.
Radijs 04-11-06, 07:07 AM	Thanks but I'd prefer very much to keep my character good-aligned.
Tytalus 04-11-06, 07:12 AM	The old 3.0 Weapon Master [S&F] (now replaced by Exotic Weapon Master [CW]) and the Psionic Weapon Master add +2 to your threat range. Disciple of Dispater [BoVD] is also 3.0 material (but should be compatible) and triples the threat range (which explicitly stacks with Improved Critical).
Ashianyl 04-11-06, 08:25 AM	Even if you think it's abusable, just remember that monsters have the same advantage, and as the DMG says, any rule that increases a random chance of hurt actually hurts the players more. I think it's a stupid idea only because it hurts the PCs more than it provides an advantage. :)
_J_ 04-11-06, 08:33 AM	Unless the players abuse it more than the enemies :D
Asciiman 04-11-06, 10:56 AM	Unless the players abuse it more than the enemies :D Not possible. Even if the DM doesn't do anyting to increase the chance, the simple fact is that his characters can die with no real consequence to his actions. The PC's however can't die period. Numerically, the survival chance of every character should eventually approach zero. The difference being that random numbers tend to speed this along. Fewer random chances = longer character life.
pale_enchantress 04-11-06, 11:18 AM	Well get fortification armor and maby be an ac junky too if you can wing it. If you really want to break it abuse the hell out of it and don't even give anyone a chance to put it to any use on you. On second thought maby HP is a better resistance to this then AC. Fortification still is goodness, In fact you might want to read up on the "hit me please" builds people here have where takeing damage only makes you stronger....and angry.
nittanytbone 04-11-06, 11:29 AM	An alternative to the barbarian idea might be being a Kensai. This allows you to get your +X keen falchion for free, and put all that money you saved towards fortification armor.
Fwib 04-11-06, 12:03 PM	That sounds very odd. Confusable with the 'rolling a nat. 20 is a 30, not an autohit' house-rule. Is it definite that your DM meant 'crits will confirm much more often' ?
DragonChildX 04-11-06, 01:56 PM	Common think about it Improved Crit with the weapon Class: Disciple Of Dispater (BoVD) Ability at level 4 doubles the crit rating of the weapon (Does stack with Improved crit) Ability at level 8 Triples the Crit rating of the weapon(Does stack with Improved crit) So a Falcian 18-20 crit goes to 16-20 crit from improved crit Then drops to triple the bonus! With the Disciple Of Dispater you can combine it with their greater Iron Hews and you will get a +6 bonus to strike and damage in one round. Usuable as many times as your con bonus! Be Evil Just this once. Common You know you Wannna!
Llochlyn 04-11-06, 02:15 PM	actually, 18-20 becomes 15-20 (18-19-20 = 3 chances, 15 16 17 18 19 20 = 6 chances) Now, with disciple of dispater, you get to have a double critical range (3 more chances or a 12-20) then a triple critical range (6 more chances / 9-20)
Karm Hundredfists 04-11-06, 02:38 PM	Play as a construct or an undead or something else that's immune to crits :P. Seriously, ask if you can play a (3.0) weaponmaster, it's no fair that only badguys get to double their crit range. Also, I can only imagine that Disciple of Dispater doesn't double the crit range, then triple that new crit range. Damn crit on a 9-20. You could tell your DM that since you have improved critical which doubles the crit range then you get to use the new crit range for the doubling. Crit on a 3-20, of course, usually, DMs don't like to be told things.
Wayne Frobisher 04-11-06, 04:04 PM	Take the Power Critical feat (Comp. War.) to have +14 to cinfirm your crit, then do things like making your weapon out of platinum to make it heavy and do more damage, throwing proficiency out the window since it won't make any difference at all any more... Other things that affect attack bonus like using over-sized weapons wouldn't matter either, a possible justification for Monkey Grip (or at least makes it slightly less crappy). Make it mercurial too-a large platinum mercurial falchion.
AviLazar 04-11-06, 04:32 PM	Actually, I've always liked this idea and toyed around with it a bit. But this was in a campaign where a natural 20 didn't gaurantee a hit and a natural 1 didn't gaurantee a miss. So I did a 20 gives +10 to attack and 1 gives a -10 to attack. In standard 3.5 20 always hits, and 1 always misses so this just gives an extra advantage (and really more heavily) to those who have high crit ranges. My fellow player has a character wielding an exotic weapon with the keen weapon property...he threats 15-20...that is a lot of +10's for him. So yea, pretty bad rule in a standard game. Especially since +attack tends to outstrip AC anyhow.
Radijs 04-11-06, 05:08 PM	As far as I can guess the reasoning of my DM it has to do with the parry feats from the Dragon or dungeon magazine. Most characters in the campaign have the feat and reciognized its power. We're using light weapons almost all the time and our attack bonuses are very high. So when he rolls a crit he's kind of annoyed when we parry the crit disallowing him some good damage. So by adding this rule he hopes to hit us a few more times when he rolls well. Weapon master is Sword & fist? Thats a favorite book of my DM. He'll probably allow it.
ArayanAraya 04-11-06, 05:12 PM	Choose Neutral Good alignment and take a 2 level dip into Stalker of Kharash from BoED. This makes all evil beings favored enemy's. Take Favored Critical feat from... I think it's the fighters splatbook. Increases your threat range against all evil and stacks with most anything. enjoy
mostholy2 04-11-06, 05:19 PM	As there are only limited ways to increase the threat range for a weapon, I think that you should focus on breaking the +10 unnamed attack bonus in addition to increasing threat range. Try to get as much power attack/improved power attack/supreme or similar increases for power attack to take advantage of the +10 attack bonus he's giving you for every threat roll you have. Continue to do this type of attack for as much damage as you can.
X-Codes 04-11-06, 05:48 PM	Wow... I mean, Psychic Weapon Master dude... It's Weapon Master + 1/2 Psionic Progression. I can't believe nobody's mentioned this before. Psywar 4/Barbarian 1 For humans, Psywar 5/Barbarian 1 for non-humans. Then do full-out Psychic Weapon Master 10, taking Combat Reflexes and Improved Critical before certain levels so you get the added benefits of those (maybe sooner if you want Whirlwind Attack as a standard action). End it out as Psywar 8/Barbarian 2/PsyWM 10. Psychic Weapon Master (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040827d)
nihility 04-11-06, 06:52 PM	I'd also advocate Psychic Weapon Master.
Radijs 04-12-06, 04:28 AM	Don't you mean psywar 5/barbarian 1 or psywar 4 /barb 2 for humans? I need Dodge, Mobility, Power Attack, Psionic Dodge, Psionic Weapon and Weapon Focus. Humans gain 2 feats on lvl 1 and another at level 3 And psychic warrior gains 1 at first and one at 2nd level. At lvl 5 you have 5 out of 6 feats required and a BAB of 4
Tytalus 04-12-06, 04:36 AM	Wow... I mean, Psychic Weapon Master dude... It's Weapon Master + 1/2 Psionic Progression. I can't believe nobody's mentioned this before. Uh, I mentioned it in post #4, just seemingly got the name wrong.
X-Codes 04-12-06, 07:22 AM	Uh, I mentioned it in post #4, just seemingly got the name wrong. Oh... well still, 17 replies and only one mention. Pretty odd considering all the abilities of the class.
Fwib 04-12-06, 10:19 AM	Probably because PWM is from the website, not from a book, (I think)