A wizard in armor [Archive] - Wizards Community

A wizard in armor [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Jaak
06-02-05, 05:19 PM Hi

I will use armor and be a wizard. I dont want ASF (arcane spell failure) and i dont wanna lose caster levels.

Classes

Spellsword has a good first lvl giving -10 % ASF + 1 cast lvl + 2 fort.. but the req are hard: weapon prof martial, armor prof all, bab..

Havoc mage make me lose one or two caster levels, able to wear medium or heavy armor as benefit

Armors

half-weigh ?? (from ?)

Mithral: -10 % ASF (material from srd)

Blended Quarts: -20% ASF, weigh twice as much (material from Arms and Eq)

If you people have any more options i would be very thankfull letting me know.

---------
Furdaddy
06-02-05, 06:00 PM Runesmith PrC from Races of Stone. The key prereqs are dwarven and proficiency with heavy armor. First level ability is using runes (a material component) instead of somatic components. Thus, no ASF.

I know you don't want to lose caster levels, but since heavy armor proficiency entails a 3 feat investment, you might be better off taking the caster level hit. Or, I believe Dragonslayer from the Draconomicon grants heavy armor proficiency, but I don't have the book so I don't know the prereqs on that one.
Ice Wolf
06-02-05, 06:34 PM Rods of Metamagic: Still Spell

Have more than one. Depending on how many spells you're apt to cast per day. When you get Epic, start taking the Automatic Still Spell Feat.

It might be more costly than other methods, but it will still allow almost complete freedom on your progression.
Much to my DM's chagrin, I employed these methods in the past. I believe at one point, my character had upwards of 37 of these in his possession :plotting: .
goblinsnot
06-02-05, 06:34 PM twilight from BoED... an extra -10%
ogral1
06-02-05, 06:47 PM Dragon Slayer

BAB +5
Dodge, Iron Will
Tumble 2 ranks

Grants simple and martial weapons and all types of armor and shields.
Critical Mass
06-02-05, 07:02 PM Rods of Metamagic: Still Spell

Have more than one. Depending on how many spells you're apt to cast per day. When you get Epic, start taking the Automatic Still Spell Feat.

It might be more costly than other methods, but it will still allow almost complete freedom on your progression.
Much to my DM's chagrin, I employed these methods in the past. I believe at one point, my character had upwards of 37 of these in his possession :plotting: .

...

If you're gonna be wasting that much money on metamagic rods, especially greater ones, you may as well just buy braces of armor +8 and wear a suit of light armor with no ASF and a +5 enhancement.
Nagol
06-02-05, 07:45 PM Runesmith PrC from Races of Stone. The key prereqs are dwarven and proficiency with heavy armor. First level ability is using runes (a material component) instead of somatic components. Thus, no ASF.

I know you don't want to lose caster levels, but since heavy armor proficiency entails a 3 feat investment, you might be better off taking the caster level hit. Or, I believe Dragonslayer from the Draconomicon grants heavy armor proficiency, but I don't have the book so I don't know the prereqs on that one.

There is a simple way to avoid the loss if you can afford to put armour-wearing off until the low-teens.

Wizard 12 (or prestige classes -- you need a BAB +6)
Dragonslayer 1 (grants all armour and martial weapons)
Runesmith 1

It costs two general feats (Dodge and Iron Will) and a handful of cross-class skill points.
Iaimeki
06-02-05, 08:23 PM There is a simple way to avoid the loss if you can afford to put armour-wearing off until the low-teens.

Wizard 12 (or prestige classes -- you need a BAB +6)
Dragonslayer 1 (grants all armour and martial weapons)
Runesmith 1

It costs two general feats (Dodge and Iron Will) and a handful of cross-class skill points.

Dragonslayer only takes a +5 BAB (and 2 ranks in Tumble, so cross-class 4 points), so you can enter it at 10th level as a straight wizard.
catharz
06-02-05, 08:30 PM There is a simple way to avoid the loss if you can afford to put armour-wearing off until the low-teens.

Wizard 12 (or prestige classes -- you need a BAB +6)
Dragonslayer 1 (grants all armour and martial weapons)
Runesmith 1

It costs two general feats (Dodge and Iron Will) and a handful of cross-class skill points.

The worth of Runesmith after surviving 13 levels without armor is questionable. With a BAB of +8 and HD of 12d4 + 2d8, you won't exactly be a tank. And by that time a wizard has many better options open to him.
dragonseth
06-02-05, 08:31 PM ...

If you're gonna be wasting that much money on metamagic rods, especially greater ones, you may as well just buy braces of armor +8 and wear a suit of light armor with no ASF and a +5 enhancement.

Bracers of armor and armor don't stack, they're both an armor bonus to AC. Unless I'm stupid, which I highly doubt. :D
allenchan
06-02-05, 09:21 PM Bracers of armor and armor don't stack, they're both an armor bonus to AC. Unless I'm stupid, which I highly doubt. :D

+8 from the bracers, +5 from the enchantment. he's just wearing the armor for its magical qualities, not its base protection.
runestar
06-02-05, 10:50 PM Militia grants proficiency with all martial weapons, paving the way for eldritch knight and spellsword. But you end up losing a caster lv.
nachtmeister
06-03-05, 02:41 AM +8 from the bracers, +5 from the enchantment. he's just wearing the armor for its magical qualities, not its base protection.

so you think that gives you a net +13 to AC ?
Acirema
06-03-05, 06:59 AM The bracers or the Armor even with it's enhancements work towards the AC, not both. Only the highest singular Armor bonus counts. And yes, Full Plate +5 is a +13 armor bonus to AC, and Bracers +8 is a +8 armor bonus to AC. You get the Full Plate +5 (+13 Armor bonus) to your AC only.

The way I go to cast arcane spells in armor without penalty is Warmage. Yes it's not a straight wizard, I know.

There are a few feats (Anyspell, & Arcane Disciple to name 2) that grant you extra spells to your Arcane Spell List.

Warmage is also pretty much an entry into Spell Sword or Eldrich Knight with but a singular level of Fighter.

There are a number of ways to do as you want to, this is just one alternative to consider. :cool:
Necron
06-03-05, 07:24 AM The bracers or the Armor even with it's enhancements work towards the AC, not both. Only the highest singular Armor bonus counts. And yes, Full Plate +5 is a +13 armor bonus to AC, and Bracers +8 is a +8 armor bonus to AC. You get the Full Plate +5 (+13 Armor bonus) to your AC only.

I would say wrong .. the full plate +5 is basicly two types of boni a +8 armor bonus as well as a +5 enhancement bonus to armor. They stack because they are different types of boni.
If you had the money for bracers of armor +8 (armor bonus) to enchant them with a +5 enhancement you would end with +13 to AC (8 armor and 5 enhancement).

Just my 2 cents

Necron
Funny Slaughter
06-03-05, 07:26 AM i just don't see the need for heavy armor as a wizboy.
go with a Mithral Chainshirt, Mithral Charhar-Aina [OA], Mithral Dastana [A&E] and a Mithral Buckler. Add Twillight as needed.
base-ac is 7 and ypu have plenty of space for enhancements without getting your movement hampered.

drawback: all of them are a bit costly, nothing to wear from the start. but thats the same with most presented solutions...

just as my opinion: a wizard that needs armor is played the wrong way. or dead anyway...
R-man
06-03-05, 07:30 AM Warmage gives you the ability to wear Light armor without ASF, and at 8th level you can wear medium armor without ASF. Battlecaster feat allows you to wear armor of one grade heavier then you could otherwise. I.e. a 1st level Bard with Battlecaster could wear Medium armor. You still need the relevant proficiencies.

An eighth level Warmage can wear Adamantine full plate if he took the Battlecaster feat.

A pure Wizard with the Battlecaster feat could wear Mithral Breastplate as Mithral makes it light armor.

Combine this with a mithral small shield for no ASF as well and you are well on your way.

However to do all of this without caster level loss will require that you actually buy Light armor proficiency. Shield proficiency isn't required due to it not having an armor check penalty after you make it Mithral.

So Human Wizard 1st level who somehow comes up with the money for a Mithral breastplate 4200gp? and a Mithral small shield 1050gp? Who spends both his feats on Light armor proficiency and Battlecaster will have an armor class of 16 before enchantment or Dex are included. Very expensive but occassionally worth it.
Necron
06-03-05, 07:42 AM A pure Wizard with the Battlecaster feat could wear Mithral Breastplate as Mithral makes it light armor.

Nope .. since the feat requieres that you can already ignore ASP, as warmage or bard.

Just my 2 cents

Necron
Skadrian
06-03-05, 07:55 AM Why would you need the proficiency, you just take a hit to your atk rol, but you could ignore touch spells.

Blended quartz + twilight makes you able to wear full plate with only 5% asf or a breastplate with no asf
Acirema
06-03-05, 08:19 AM The way I go to cast arcane spells in armor without penalty is Warmage.

This is just how I go about no AsF in armor.

There are a number of ways to do as you want to, this is just one alternative to consider. :cool:

Yes Warmage is not everybodies desired way to go for an armor wearing Arcane caster, the Warmage is just one of many.

and at 8th level you can wear medium armor without ASF

I understand this, but it also grants you Armor Proficiency:medium Armor as well.

The bracers or the Armor even with it's enhancements work towards the AC, not both. Only the highest singular Armor bonus counts. And yes, Full Plate +5 is a +13 armor bonus to AC, and Bracers +8 is a +8 armor bonus to AC. You get the Full Plate +5 (+13 Armor bonus) to your AC only.

Can I get a RAW on this please, for my and everyone elses benifit.

(Not a rant, just many replies at once :D )
Ty
06-03-05, 08:57 AM Use the feat Innate Spell from the Player's Guide to Faerun. Requires two requisite metamagic feats, namely "still spell", which also lets you avoid arcane spell failure, but nets you the ability to cast a spell as a spell-like ability (which has no ASF chance).

Just a thought.
cvazi
06-03-05, 11:12 AM Can I get a RAW on this please, for my and everyone elses benifit.

Bracers of Armor
These items appear to be wrist or arm guards. They surround the wearer with an invisible but tangible field of force, granting him an armor bonus of +1 to +8, just as though he were wearing armor. Both bracers must be worn for the magic to be effective.

Moderate conjuration; CL 7th; Craft Wondrous Item, mage armor, creator’s caster level must be at least two times that of the bonus placed in the bracers; Price 1,000 gp (+1), 4,000 gp (+2), 9,000 gp (+3), 16,000 gp (+4), 25,000 gp (+5), 36,000 gp (+6), 49,000 gp (+7), 64,000 gp (+8);Weight 1 lb.

Bracers provide an armor bonus. DOES NOT STACK WITH ARMOR
DDogwood
06-03-05, 11:13 AM I would go for Dragonslayer, and take Still Spell. Remember that there are several spells you can cast in armor without penalty, including Blindness/Deafness, Blur, Charm Monster (Mass), Contact Other Plane, Darkness, Dimension Door, Displacement, Feather Fall, Flesh to Stone, Geas (Lesser), Geas/Quest, Hold Portal, Otto's Irresistable Dance, Knock, Light, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Phase Door, Power Word: Blind, Power Word: Kill, Power Word: Stun, Prismatic Sphere, Shout, Suggestion, Suggestion (Mass), Teleport, Teleport (Object), Teleport (Greater), Teleportation Circle, Time Stop, Tongues, True Strike, Ventriloquism, Wail of the Banshee, and Wish, because they have no Somatic components.
Bonzai
06-03-05, 12:12 PM Unfortunatly, most prc's that offer armor proficiency and reduced ASF tend to make you loose caster lvls. The ones that come to mind are Warmage, Spellsword, and Palemaster.

However, I would recomend that you take either the battle caster feat, or save up for a mythril buckler, and get the animated enhancement on it. This way you get the AC, no penalty, and your hands are free for casting.
Critical Mass
06-03-05, 04:37 PM The +5 is an enhancement bonus to the armor's armor bonus, not an enhancement bonus directly to your AC. Brain fart, so to speak.

I still want to try playing a Runecaster though.
Mommy was an Orc
06-03-05, 06:31 PM Not to mention that technically, there is no such thing as a Rod of Still Spell - or at least the designers consider it a really bad idea(as they left it out of DMG...)

...

If you're gonna be wasting that much money on metamagic rods, especially greater ones, you may as well just buy braces of armor +8 and wear a suit of light armor with no ASF and a +5 enhancement.
MechaboyDos
06-03-05, 10:07 PM The +5 is an enhancement bonus to the armor's armor bonus, not an enhancement bonus directly to your AC. Brain fart, so to speak.

I still want to try playing a Runecaster though.

Yeah, what he said... It's a +5 enhancement to armor bonus. So basically you have Full Plate that's extra strong and durable thanks to special magical preparations and treatments and the like... It's a suit of Full Plate that grants +13 armor bonus instead of the normal +8, it's not +8 armor bonus and +5 base. You'd need something enchanting you in order for the base to increase.
Solais
06-04-05, 10:33 PM There's always the Pale master from libris mortis... insane prc. reduced ASF, added buffs from being partially undead, immunities, str bonus... costing 1 CL. quite nice.

Where is blended quartz from?
catharz
06-05-05, 04:32 AM OK, Bracers of Armor provide an Armor Bonus to AC.
Armor provides an Armor Bonus AC.

Two Armor Bonuses to AC don't stack. Rather, you use the higher of the two Armor Bonuses as the occasion warrants.

So a character wearing Bracers of Armor +2 and a Breastplate will use the Breastplate against standard weapon attacks, but the Bracers against touch attacks.

According to the SRD, "Magic armor bonuses are enhancement bonuses, never rise above +5 [pre-Epic], and stack with regular armor bonuses (and with shield and magic shield enhancement bonuses)."

From that, it appears that Magic Armor Bonuses stack with regular Armor Bonuses as per normal stacking rules. That is, with whatever Armor Bonus is currently being used.

So using the above example, if the Chainmail was +2 Chainmail, the character defending against a touch attack would effectively be wearing +2 Bracers of Armor +2 (= +4).

However, according to the SRD, "Both bracers must be worn for the magic to be effective." And if this means that Bracers of Armor provide a Magic Armor Bonus, then it is a Magic Armor Bonus, which is therefore an Enhancement Bonus, and won't stack with the +2.

However, if the Bracers of Armor did provide a Magic Armor Bonus, they would (1) be limited to +5 and would (2) stack with regular armor bonuses.

Either way you win out: One option is that +1 Platemail and +8 Bracers will net you +16 AC, the other is that +5 Leather Armor and +8 Bracers will net you +13 AC.

That is all very well and good in argument. But if all you want is usefulness from wearing both Bracers and Armor without fuss, just make the Armor +N and the Bracers +Special (= Fortification, Soulfire, whatever). Or vice-versa.
ronyon
06-06-05, 02:33 AM Did he even mention heavy armor...lets see...nope.
Isnt there Thistledown armor with no Arcane Spell Failure, in the Races of the Wild ?
Gothic Rose
06-06-05, 02:56 AM Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Dragonlance War Mage 4/XXXX 10

That lets you ignore 20 percent ASF. Get Mythral Full Plate with the Twilight quality, and you have no ASF. Toss on a mythral buckler, and your ac is nice.

Ultimately, I'd say the best way to go with the above is with 10 levels of Eldritch Knight - you lose 1 more caster level, but you gain a total BaB of +16, which means 4 attacks per round, and a caster level of 18.
Baneslayer
06-06-05, 03:05 AM From that, it appears that Magic Armor Bonuses stack with regular Armor Bonuses as per normal stacking rules. That is, with whatever Armor Bonus is currently being used.

No, not quite. As stated earlier, Armor Bonus enchantments affect the specific armor directly. So +1 Fullplate = Armor Bonus +9. The Enchantment and the Armor add together to give the stated Armor Bonus.

Bracers of Armor give an Armor Bonus of AC 2 to AC 8. So wearing the Bracers +8 with +1 Fullplate sets two non-stacking Armor Bonuses onto the character. The AC 9 bonus will override the AC 8 bonus in all cases except for one - Incorporial Touch Attacks.

A character gets One Armor Bonus, One Deflection Bonus, One Natural Armor Bonus (though there are a couple of PrCs and feats that will provide a stacking Natural Armor bonus, these exceptions specifically are stated in their descriptions - not all NA bonuses stack), and as many Dodge Bonuses and Unnamed Bonuses they can manage.

Now if you had AC 8 bracers and +1 Leather that also had other special abilities, like Resistances and Invulnerability, the Leather's special abilities would still be usable even though the Armor Bonus was overridden by the bracers.

And just so you know I'm not making this up on my own, go check out the Official Rules FAQ, first question on the top of page 18.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Main35FAQv05272005.zip
Iaimeki
06-06-05, 03:54 AM Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Dragonlance War Mage 4/XXXX 10

That lets you ignore 20 percent ASF. Get Mythral Full Plate with the Twilight quality, and you have no ASF. Toss on a mythral buckler, and your ac is nice.

Ultimately, I'd say the best way to go with the above is with 10 levels of Eldritch Knight - you lose 1 more caster level, but you gain a total BaB of +16, which means 4 attacks per round, and a caster level of 18.

Couldn't you add spellsword to that instead of an eldritch knight level, to get -30% ASF, and ditch the twilight property?
Gothic Rose
06-06-05, 04:01 AM Gah! I really should proofread :P

The build should be

Fighter 1/Wizard 5/War Wizard 4/Spellsword 1/XXXXX 9

Heh, sorry about that :P
catharz
06-06-05, 04:05 AM http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Main35FAQv05272005.zip

Thanks for the link. I should know by now to check the FAQ first. *Sigh*

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jaak 06-02-05, 05:19 PM	Hi I will use armor and be a wizard. I dont want ASF (arcane spell failure) and i dont wanna lose caster levels. Classes Spellsword has a good first lvl giving -10 % ASF + 1 cast lvl + 2 fort.. but the req are hard: weapon prof martial, armor prof all, bab.. Havoc mage make me lose one or two caster levels, able to wear medium or heavy armor as benefit Armors half-weigh ?? (from ?) Mithral: -10 % ASF (material from srd) Blended Quarts: -20% ASF, weigh twice as much (material from Arms and Eq) If you people have any more options i would be very thankfull letting me know. ---------
Furdaddy 06-02-05, 06:00 PM	Runesmith PrC from Races of Stone. The key prereqs are dwarven and proficiency with heavy armor. First level ability is using runes (a material component) instead of somatic components. Thus, no ASF. I know you don't want to lose caster levels, but since heavy armor proficiency entails a 3 feat investment, you might be better off taking the caster level hit. Or, I believe Dragonslayer from the Draconomicon grants heavy armor proficiency, but I don't have the book so I don't know the prereqs on that one.
Ice Wolf 06-02-05, 06:34 PM	Rods of Metamagic: Still Spell Have more than one. Depending on how many spells you're apt to cast per day. When you get Epic, start taking the Automatic Still Spell Feat. It might be more costly than other methods, but it will still allow almost complete freedom on your progression. Much to my DM's chagrin, I employed these methods in the past. I believe at one point, my character had upwards of 37 of these in his possession :plotting: .
goblinsnot 06-02-05, 06:34 PM	twilight from BoED... an extra -10%
ogral1 06-02-05, 06:47 PM	Dragon Slayer BAB +5 Dodge, Iron Will Tumble 2 ranks Grants simple and martial weapons and all types of armor and shields.
Critical Mass 06-02-05, 07:02 PM	Rods of Metamagic: Still Spell Have more than one. Depending on how many spells you're apt to cast per day. When you get Epic, start taking the Automatic Still Spell Feat. It might be more costly than other methods, but it will still allow almost complete freedom on your progression. Much to my DM's chagrin, I employed these methods in the past. I believe at one point, my character had upwards of 37 of these in his possession :plotting: . ... If you're gonna be wasting that much money on metamagic rods, especially greater ones, you may as well just buy braces of armor +8 and wear a suit of light armor with no ASF and a +5 enhancement.
Nagol 06-02-05, 07:45 PM	Runesmith PrC from Races of Stone. The key prereqs are dwarven and proficiency with heavy armor. First level ability is using runes (a material component) instead of somatic components. Thus, no ASF. I know you don't want to lose caster levels, but since heavy armor proficiency entails a 3 feat investment, you might be better off taking the caster level hit. Or, I believe Dragonslayer from the Draconomicon grants heavy armor proficiency, but I don't have the book so I don't know the prereqs on that one. There is a simple way to avoid the loss if you can afford to put armour-wearing off until the low-teens. Wizard 12 (or prestige classes -- you need a BAB +6) Dragonslayer 1 (grants all armour and martial weapons) Runesmith 1 It costs two general feats (Dodge and Iron Will) and a handful of cross-class skill points.
Iaimeki 06-02-05, 08:23 PM	There is a simple way to avoid the loss if you can afford to put armour-wearing off until the low-teens. Wizard 12 (or prestige classes -- you need a BAB +6) Dragonslayer 1 (grants all armour and martial weapons) Runesmith 1 It costs two general feats (Dodge and Iron Will) and a handful of cross-class skill points. Dragonslayer only takes a +5 BAB (and 2 ranks in Tumble, so cross-class 4 points), so you can enter it at 10th level as a straight wizard.
catharz 06-02-05, 08:30 PM	There is a simple way to avoid the loss if you can afford to put armour-wearing off until the low-teens. Wizard 12 (or prestige classes -- you need a BAB +6) Dragonslayer 1 (grants all armour and martial weapons) Runesmith 1 It costs two general feats (Dodge and Iron Will) and a handful of cross-class skill points. The worth of Runesmith after surviving 13 levels without armor is questionable. With a BAB of +8 and HD of 12d4 + 2d8, you won't exactly be a tank. And by that time a wizard has many better options open to him.
dragonseth 06-02-05, 08:31 PM	... If you're gonna be wasting that much money on metamagic rods, especially greater ones, you may as well just buy braces of armor +8 and wear a suit of light armor with no ASF and a +5 enhancement. Bracers of armor and armor don't stack, they're both an armor bonus to AC. Unless I'm stupid, which I highly doubt. :D
allenchan 06-02-05, 09:21 PM	Bracers of armor and armor don't stack, they're both an armor bonus to AC. Unless I'm stupid, which I highly doubt. :D +8 from the bracers, +5 from the enchantment. he's just wearing the armor for its magical qualities, not its base protection.
runestar 06-02-05, 10:50 PM	Militia grants proficiency with all martial weapons, paving the way for eldritch knight and spellsword. But you end up losing a caster lv.
nachtmeister 06-03-05, 02:41 AM	+8 from the bracers, +5 from the enchantment. he's just wearing the armor for its magical qualities, not its base protection. so you think that gives you a net +13 to AC ?
Acirema 06-03-05, 06:59 AM	The bracers or the Armor even with it's enhancements work towards the AC, not both. Only the highest singular Armor bonus counts. And yes, Full Plate +5 is a +13 armor bonus to AC, and Bracers +8 is a +8 armor bonus to AC. You get the Full Plate +5 (+13 Armor bonus) to your AC only. The way I go to cast arcane spells in armor without penalty is Warmage. Yes it's not a straight wizard, I know. There are a few feats (Anyspell, & Arcane Disciple to name 2) that grant you extra spells to your Arcane Spell List. Warmage is also pretty much an entry into Spell Sword or Eldrich Knight with but a singular level of Fighter. There are a number of ways to do as you want to, this is just one alternative to consider. :cool:
Necron 06-03-05, 07:24 AM	The bracers or the Armor even with it's enhancements work towards the AC, not both. Only the highest singular Armor bonus counts. And yes, Full Plate +5 is a +13 armor bonus to AC, and Bracers +8 is a +8 armor bonus to AC. You get the Full Plate +5 (+13 Armor bonus) to your AC only. I would say wrong .. the full plate +5 is basicly two types of boni a +8 armor bonus as well as a +5 enhancement bonus to armor. They stack because they are different types of boni. If you had the money for bracers of armor +8 (armor bonus) to enchant them with a +5 enhancement you would end with +13 to AC (8 armor and 5 enhancement). Just my 2 cents Necron
Funny Slaughter 06-03-05, 07:26 AM	i just don't see the need for heavy armor as a wizboy. go with a Mithral Chainshirt, Mithral Charhar-Aina [OA], Mithral Dastana [A&E] and a Mithral Buckler. Add Twillight as needed. base-ac is 7 and ypu have plenty of space for enhancements without getting your movement hampered. drawback: all of them are a bit costly, nothing to wear from the start. but thats the same with most presented solutions... just as my opinion: a wizard that needs armor is played the wrong way. or dead anyway...
R-man 06-03-05, 07:30 AM	Warmage gives you the ability to wear Light armor without ASF, and at 8th level you can wear medium armor without ASF. Battlecaster feat allows you to wear armor of one grade heavier then you could otherwise. I.e. a 1st level Bard with Battlecaster could wear Medium armor. You still need the relevant proficiencies. An eighth level Warmage can wear Adamantine full plate if he took the Battlecaster feat. A pure Wizard with the Battlecaster feat could wear Mithral Breastplate as Mithral makes it light armor. Combine this with a mithral small shield for no ASF as well and you are well on your way. However to do all of this without caster level loss will require that you actually buy Light armor proficiency. Shield proficiency isn't required due to it not having an armor check penalty after you make it Mithral. So Human Wizard 1st level who somehow comes up with the money for a Mithral breastplate 4200gp? and a Mithral small shield 1050gp? Who spends both his feats on Light armor proficiency and Battlecaster will have an armor class of 16 before enchantment or Dex are included. Very expensive but occassionally worth it.
Necron 06-03-05, 07:42 AM	A pure Wizard with the Battlecaster feat could wear Mithral Breastplate as Mithral makes it light armor. Nope .. since the feat requieres that you can already ignore ASP, as warmage or bard. Just my 2 cents Necron
Skadrian 06-03-05, 07:55 AM	Why would you need the proficiency, you just take a hit to your atk rol, but you could ignore touch spells. Blended quartz + twilight makes you able to wear full plate with only 5% asf or a breastplate with no asf
Acirema 06-03-05, 08:19 AM	The way I go to cast arcane spells in armor without penalty is Warmage. This is just how I go about no AsF in armor. There are a number of ways to do as you want to, this is just one alternative to consider. :cool: Yes Warmage is not everybodies desired way to go for an armor wearing Arcane caster, the Warmage is just one of many. and at 8th level you can wear medium armor without ASF I understand this, but it also grants you Armor Proficiency:medium Armor as well. The bracers or the Armor even with it's enhancements work towards the AC, not both. Only the highest singular Armor bonus counts. And yes, Full Plate +5 is a +13 armor bonus to AC, and Bracers +8 is a +8 armor bonus to AC. You get the Full Plate +5 (+13 Armor bonus) to your AC only. Can I get a RAW on this please, for my and everyone elses benifit. (Not a rant, just many replies at once :D )
Ty 06-03-05, 08:57 AM	Use the feat Innate Spell from the Player's Guide to Faerun. Requires two requisite metamagic feats, namely "still spell", which also lets you avoid arcane spell failure, but nets you the ability to cast a spell as a spell-like ability (which has no ASF chance). Just a thought.
cvazi 06-03-05, 11:12 AM	Can I get a RAW on this please, for my and everyone elses benifit. Bracers of Armor These items appear to be wrist or arm guards. They surround the wearer with an invisible but tangible field of force, granting him an armor bonus of +1 to +8, just as though he were wearing armor. Both bracers must be worn for the magic to be effective. Moderate conjuration; CL 7th; Craft Wondrous Item, mage armor, creator’s caster level must be at least two times that of the bonus placed in the bracers; Price 1,000 gp (+1), 4,000 gp (+2), 9,000 gp (+3), 16,000 gp (+4), 25,000 gp (+5), 36,000 gp (+6), 49,000 gp (+7), 64,000 gp (+8);Weight 1 lb. Bracers provide an armor bonus. DOES NOT STACK WITH ARMOR
DDogwood 06-03-05, 11:13 AM	I would go for Dragonslayer, and take Still Spell. Remember that there are several spells you can cast in armor without penalty, including Blindness/Deafness, Blur, Charm Monster (Mass), Contact Other Plane, Darkness, Dimension Door, Displacement, Feather Fall, Flesh to Stone, Geas (Lesser), Geas/Quest, Hold Portal, Otto's Irresistable Dance, Knock, Light, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Phase Door, Power Word: Blind, Power Word: Kill, Power Word: Stun, Prismatic Sphere, Shout, Suggestion, Suggestion (Mass), Teleport, Teleport (Object), Teleport (Greater), Teleportation Circle, Time Stop, Tongues, True Strike, Ventriloquism, Wail of the Banshee, and Wish, because they have no Somatic components.
Bonzai 06-03-05, 12:12 PM	Unfortunatly, most prc's that offer armor proficiency and reduced ASF tend to make you loose caster lvls. The ones that come to mind are Warmage, Spellsword, and Palemaster. However, I would recomend that you take either the battle caster feat, or save up for a mythril buckler, and get the animated enhancement on it. This way you get the AC, no penalty, and your hands are free for casting.
Critical Mass 06-03-05, 04:37 PM	The +5 is an enhancement bonus to the armor's armor bonus, not an enhancement bonus directly to your AC. Brain fart, so to speak. I still want to try playing a Runecaster though.
Mommy was an Orc 06-03-05, 06:31 PM	Not to mention that technically, there is no such thing as a Rod of Still Spell - or at least the designers consider it a really bad idea(as they left it out of DMG...) ... If you're gonna be wasting that much money on metamagic rods, especially greater ones, you may as well just buy braces of armor +8 and wear a suit of light armor with no ASF and a +5 enhancement.
MechaboyDos 06-03-05, 10:07 PM	The +5 is an enhancement bonus to the armor's armor bonus, not an enhancement bonus directly to your AC. Brain fart, so to speak. I still want to try playing a Runecaster though. Yeah, what he said... It's a +5 enhancement to armor bonus. So basically you have Full Plate that's extra strong and durable thanks to special magical preparations and treatments and the like... It's a suit of Full Plate that grants +13 armor bonus instead of the normal +8, it's not +8 armor bonus and +5 base. You'd need something enchanting you in order for the base to increase.
Solais 06-04-05, 10:33 PM	There's always the Pale master from libris mortis... insane prc. reduced ASF, added buffs from being partially undead, immunities, str bonus... costing 1 CL. quite nice. Where is blended quartz from?
catharz 06-05-05, 04:32 AM	OK, Bracers of Armor provide an Armor Bonus to AC. Armor provides an Armor Bonus AC. Two Armor Bonuses to AC don't stack. Rather, you use the higher of the two Armor Bonuses as the occasion warrants. So a character wearing Bracers of Armor +2 and a Breastplate will use the Breastplate against standard weapon attacks, but the Bracers against touch attacks. According to the SRD, "Magic armor bonuses are enhancement bonuses, never rise above +5 [pre-Epic], and stack with regular armor bonuses (and with shield and magic shield enhancement bonuses)." From that, it appears that Magic Armor Bonuses stack with regular Armor Bonuses as per normal stacking rules. That is, with whatever Armor Bonus is currently being used. So using the above example, if the Chainmail was +2 Chainmail, the character defending against a touch attack would effectively be wearing +2 Bracers of Armor +2 (= +4). However, according to the SRD, "Both bracers must be worn for the magic to be effective." And if this means that Bracers of Armor provide a Magic Armor Bonus, then it is a Magic Armor Bonus, which is therefore an Enhancement Bonus, and won't stack with the +2. However, if the Bracers of Armor did provide a Magic Armor Bonus, they would (1) be limited to +5 and would (2) stack with regular armor bonuses. Either way you win out: One option is that +1 Platemail and +8 Bracers will net you +16 AC, the other is that +5 Leather Armor and +8 Bracers will net you +13 AC. That is all very well and good in argument. But if all you want is usefulness from wearing both Bracers and Armor without fuss, just make the Armor +N and the Bracers +Special (= Fortification, Soulfire, whatever). Or vice-versa.
ronyon 06-06-05, 02:33 AM	Did he even mention heavy armor...lets see...nope. Isnt there Thistledown armor with no Arcane Spell Failure, in the Races of the Wild ?
Gothic Rose 06-06-05, 02:56 AM	Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Dragonlance War Mage 4/XXXX 10 That lets you ignore 20 percent ASF. Get Mythral Full Plate with the Twilight quality, and you have no ASF. Toss on a mythral buckler, and your ac is nice. Ultimately, I'd say the best way to go with the above is with 10 levels of Eldritch Knight - you lose 1 more caster level, but you gain a total BaB of +16, which means 4 attacks per round, and a caster level of 18.
Baneslayer 06-06-05, 03:05 AM	From that, it appears that Magic Armor Bonuses stack with regular Armor Bonuses as per normal stacking rules. That is, with whatever Armor Bonus is currently being used. No, not quite. As stated earlier, Armor Bonus enchantments affect the specific armor directly. So +1 Fullplate = Armor Bonus +9. The Enchantment and the Armor add together to give the stated Armor Bonus. Bracers of Armor give an Armor Bonus of AC 2 to AC 8. So wearing the Bracers +8 with +1 Fullplate sets two non-stacking Armor Bonuses onto the character. The AC 9 bonus will override the AC 8 bonus in all cases except for one - Incorporial Touch Attacks. A character gets One Armor Bonus, One Deflection Bonus, One Natural Armor Bonus (though there are a couple of PrCs and feats that will provide a stacking Natural Armor bonus, these exceptions specifically are stated in their descriptions - not all NA bonuses stack), and as many Dodge Bonuses and Unnamed Bonuses they can manage. Now if you had AC 8 bracers and +1 Leather that also had other special abilities, like Resistances and Invulnerability, the Leather's special abilities would still be usable even though the Armor Bonus was overridden by the bracers. And just so you know I'm not making this up on my own, go check out the Official Rules FAQ, first question on the top of page 18. http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Main35FAQv05272005.zip
Iaimeki 06-06-05, 03:54 AM	Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Dragonlance War Mage 4/XXXX 10 That lets you ignore 20 percent ASF. Get Mythral Full Plate with the Twilight quality, and you have no ASF. Toss on a mythral buckler, and your ac is nice. Ultimately, I'd say the best way to go with the above is with 10 levels of Eldritch Knight - you lose 1 more caster level, but you gain a total BaB of +16, which means 4 attacks per round, and a caster level of 18. Couldn't you add spellsword to that instead of an eldritch knight level, to get -30% ASF, and ditch the twilight property?
Gothic Rose 06-06-05, 04:01 AM	Gah! I really should proofread :P The build should be Fighter 1/Wizard 5/War Wizard 4/Spellsword 1/XXXXX 9 Heh, sorry about that :P
catharz 06-06-05, 04:05 AM	http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Main35FAQv05272005.zip Thanks for the link. I should know by now to check the FAQ first. Sigh