Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Tha Sage 12-12-06, 12:36 PM	Setting: Eberron Character Concept: My character fought for Cyre in the Last War as a character who specialized in defeating Magic and Spell Casters. He now works freelance out of Sharn hunting down particularly dangerous Mage criminals and other adventuring work; he is particularly interested in assignments that take him into the Mournland, with hopes that he might discover what destroyed his beloved homeland. The Issue: This is a 10th level campaign, which is pretty much past the melee character's prime. I feel that in order to make him effective against spell casters, he needs to get some magical tricks of his own. This means either some kind of spell casting or Use Magic Device. Also, the other party members are a Ranger/OoBI, Sorcerer and Bard, so I feel kind of 'stuck' as a melee character with lots of HP and Full Plate. Current Build: Ranger 1/Fighter 4/Occult Slayer 5 We changed the flavor of the Occult Slayer to someone who is merely highly trained in combating casters, but does not hate them. The Highly Magical nature of Eberron and The Last War (which my character participated in) seems sufficient to justify the creation of an order of elite "Mage Breakers" Str: 18 Dex: 10 Con: 18 Int: 10 Wis: 10 Cha: 8 Feats: Able Learner[Human] Weapon Focus(Falchion)[1st] Improved Initiative[Fgt 1] Power Attack[Fgt 2] Mage Slayer[3rd] Weapon Specialization(Falchion)[Fgt 4] Improved Critical(Falchion)[6th] Pierce Magical Protection[9th] We recently obtained our 11th level, so I was wondering if you had any ideas on what I could take. Warlock and Rogue seem like the only options to me at the moment because of the reduced caster levels and terrible mental stats. My DM is pretty lax about letting us switch around skills, feats or even ability scores though part of me thinks that I would be better served letting this character die and then rolling a new one than just changing everything. I also have a feeling that all of the good options are in books that I dont have.(ie: Tome of Battle and Magic of Incarnum) Note: Updated to add Races of Destiny. Available Books: Complete Warrior Complete Mage Complete Arcane Complete Divine Complete Adventurer Weapons of Legacy Races of Destiny Arms and Equipment Guide Draconomicon Eberron Campaign Setting Magic of Eberron Savage Species Monster Manual II Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting* Magic of Faerun*
Hanniball 12-12-06, 02:42 PM	With your stats and current setup, the only option I see is UMD. As you mentioned, the caster level hit from the Mage Slayer tree is far too devastating to make a viable caster at this point. That said, you could grab a couple levels of Rogue, Skill Focus: something and Exemplar for 3 or 4 levels. With skill focus under your belt, a few levels of Spymaster maybe... Rgr 1/Ftr 4/Rog 3/OS 5/Exe 3/Spy 4 +17 BAB, saves 10/13/10, +4D6 sneak attack, evasion, take 10 on UMD, slippery mind, and 8+Int mod skills for your final 10 levels. An easy way of sprucing up your skills and guaranteeing no UMD mishaps. Spymaster isn't that strong of a class, but I love slippery mind and it's sticking to the books you own. Chameleon is what immediately came to mind... Either way...just my 2 cp
Arem_K 12-12-06, 03:30 PM	You could dip cleric for a level. Take the magic domain and something else that gives a nice bonus. This will let you use all cleric and wizard spell trigger items. Pick up a wand of polymorph at a reasonably high caster level and you are back in the game again.
Darhelion 12-12-06, 03:37 PM	I do not see Races of Destiny in your list of allowed books, but noted that you took Able Learner as a bonus feat. It may be in another book, but I know that RoDestiny has that feat and a PrC that requires said feat to get into it. Chameleon is a jack-of-all-trades PrC; with your current build, you could use Combat Aptitude on days when you really feel like emphasizing your fighteryness, and the floating feat and the arcane and divine aptitudes would let you either be a spellcaster when you needed it, or let you craft yourself some magic items to UMD when you're not using those aptitudes. Add in floating +6 bonuses to stats, and it could be a solid choice. But it -is- a jack-of-all-trades class, so you won't be nearly as focussed (and thus as powerful) in any one ballywick as you are right now. And the Arcane Aptitude will still require you to shuck your armor unless you can find a way around ASF (Still Spell metamagic rods can help some, here). But since you're considering multiclassing anyways... The biggest problem is still the Mageslayer line's hit to caster level. Perhaps Practiced Spellcaster? It could help offset. In fact, you could pick that up as the floating feat on days you're using the arcane aptitude and are worried about CL.
wingedcoyote 12-12-06, 03:58 PM	If you could talk your DM into letting you swap out a feat for Combat Casting or Track, you could take Wizard 1, Abjurant Champion 5, and Cyran Avenger 4. That'll keep your BAB and HD going nicely and gives you 9th level casting, which isn't that impressive but certainly nice to have. Swift-action dispelling from Abjurant Champion especially fits with the "Mage Breaker" concept, and Cyran Avenger obviously goes perfectly with your background.
DaveTheMagicWeasel 12-12-06, 04:11 PM	Its gotta be Chameleon with that character. Its in Races of Destiny tho, which unfortunately isn't on your list. Fortunately, its in a web preview (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20041210b). Depending on your skills, or a DM willing to let you move a few points round, you could enter it next level. Because its caster level is double your Chameleon levels, its the best way of dealing with the hit to your caster level from Mage Slayer.
Rusher 12-12-06, 04:47 PM	Depends how much magic use you need/want really and whether the character is already made but, Arcane Schooling Feat: lets you use magic items as a 1st lvl Sorc or Wizard (your choice). There you would have full access to a slew of magic items. 1st level feat. Its in one of the Faerun books but I don't know which. At least you don't have to dip into another class to get it. If you want to compete on a magical level you need to go the gish route.
Tha Sage 12-12-06, 04:54 PM	Concerning Mage Slayer Feats: While flavorful, they really have not done much for me so far. Most of the time they can just take a five foot step and then cast normally. Does anything restrict you from taking ranks in UMD as a cross class skill? I thought that there was, but I cant find anything about it now. I think Ive figured out what I want to do, I just need to figure out the best way to do it. Objectives: Qualify for Occult Slayer at level 5. Take all 5 levels of Occult Slayer. I am absolutely loathe to lose the Blank Thoughts ability. Qualify for Exemplar at level 10. As high of a UMD check as possible. The most obvious way to do this that I can see is: Hexblade 5/Occult Slayer 5/Exemplar 1 However, 5 levels of Hexblade hardly seems ideal with my current stats. Edit: Ok! I think Ive got it. Hexblade 1/Fighter 4/Occult Slayer 5/Exemplar 1 Skill Distribution: 1st: Knowledge(Arcana) 4, Spellcraft 4, Diplomacy 4 2nd: K(Arcana) 4, Spellcraft 5, Diplomacy 5, UMD 1 5th: K(Arcana) 4, Spellcraft 8, Diplomacy 8, UMD 4 7th: K(Arcana) 8, Spellcraft 10, Diplomacy 8, UMD 5 9th: K(Arcana) 11, Spellcraft 12, Diplomacy 8, UMD 6 10th: K(Arcana) 13, Spellcraft 13, Diplomacy 8, UMD 6 11th: K(Arcana) 14, Spellcraft 13, Diplomacy 8, UMD 14 Suddenly Im doubting that Skill Mastery lets me Take 10 on Use Magic Device. : \
Darhelion 12-12-06, 06:47 PM	Concerning Mage Slayer Feats: While flavorful, they really have not done much for me so far. Most of the time they can just take a five foot step and then cast normally. May I suggest picking up a Spiked Chain or getting a means of obtaining Large size? This will give you a 10 ft. reach, and thus, when you move adjacent to the mage in question, he has to move 10 ft. (and provoke an AoO for so doing) to get out of your reach and avoid making himself vulnerable to AoOs when spellcasting. Failing anything else, a Ring of Spell Storing with Enlarge Person stuffed in by your friendly party caster, or a wand of Enlarge Person UMD'd on yourself, will give you large size if you have time to spring it out. Does anything restrict you from taking ranks in UMD as a cross class skill? I thought that there was, but I cant find anything about it now. Other than the usual rules for cross-class skills (with Able Learner, the only one that applies is that your skill rank cap is (HD+3)/2), there is nothing restricting your access to UMD as a cross-class skill.
Tha Sage 12-12-06, 07:03 PM	May I suggest picking up a Spiked Chain or getting a means of obtaining Large size? This will give you a 10 ft. reach, and thus, when you move adjacent to the mage in question, he has to move 10 ft. (and provoke an AoO for so doing) to get out of your reach and avoid making himself vulnerable to AoOs when spellcasting. Actually, I have a Phylactery of Change from The Arms and Equipment Guide which means that there is a decent chance that I will be a Troll during combat. Forcing a caster to take one AoO seems like a somewhat hollow victory if I could be forcing them to not be able to cast at all by somehow keeping them in range.
Darhelion 12-12-06, 07:21 PM	Forcing a caster to take one AoO seems like a somewhat hollow victory if I could be forcing them to not be able to cast at all by somehow keeping them in range. Good point. Check out Stand Still, a [GENERAL] feat printed in the XPH and available in the SRD here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#standStill Now, he cannot get away from standing right next to you.
Rathmun 12-12-06, 07:33 PM	Actually, if you have the ability to become large, your DM might let you take "Large and in Charge" and restrict use of it to when you are large. it works a lot like stand still, but it shoves the target back into the square they started the round in. Now they can't get away at all.