Advice on Fighter [Archive] - Wizards Community

Advice on Fighter [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
HiQKid
03-20-05, 12:30 AM Right now I've got a level 2 fighter going into level three, (Human) and I wanted some advice on what direction to head in as far as feats or multiclass/PrCs.

Right now it's a spkied chain weilding, chainmail wearer with the following feats:

Combat Expertise
Imp Trip
Imp Disarm
Exotic Weapon Profficeincy (Spiked Chain)

Books available: PHB , DMG , CA , CW , Draconomicon (These are what I own, however other things might be allowed.). Psionics are not allowed in this campaign. None-phb core classes aren't usually allowed, but PrC's + feats aren't usually a problem.

Any general advice would be appreciated.
Kintara
03-20-05, 01:02 AM Oops, forgot. Chain does not equal spiked chain.

Still, Snow Savant's build (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=163005) has some good ideas in it.

Edit: Taking two levels of Exotic Weapon Master (Flurry and Trip Attack) from Complete Warrior, is a common option in a build like this.

Edit2: Maybe a Human Paragon 2/Fighter 6/Exotic Weapon Master 2/Warmind 10 (not necessarily in that order)? The Warmind is in the Expanded Psionics Handbook, and the Human Paragon is in Unearthed Arcana.
PhaedrusXY
03-20-05, 01:39 AM What books are available? What general direction are you looking to go? If Unearthed Arcana and/or Unapproachable East is available, take a couple levels of barbarian. Use the Wolf totem variant from UA, and take the Wolf Berzerker Lodge feat from UE. ;)
Kuroi Kenshi
03-20-05, 02:06 AM Aren't the lodge feats lv1 only, since they're regional feats?

Anyway, don't get anymore fighter levels. Two is all you need. Other classes will in nearly all cases serve you better. Hell, using UA stuff like wizard with fighter bonus feats, human paragon, and certain PrCs, you can get as many feats as a fighter10 in 10 levels while getting lots of other perks.

To maximize the spiked chain tripper route, snow's build does it, though there are other feats you might want to go for that came out in splatbooks after she made the build. You definetly must get combat reflexes, dodge, mobility, karmic strike, and side step though. But, like PhaedrusXY, I'd like to know more info before giving specific advice.
PhaedrusXY
03-20-05, 04:46 AM Aren't the lodge feats lv1 only, since they're regional feats?I don't think they are restricted to level 1 characters. It talks about gaining them with characters above level 1 on page 40 of UE, but that is specifically for charactes with an LA or racial hit dice, so it's debateable still.

You could choose regional feats after level 1 in 3.0. (See page 28 of the FRCS.) UE was written just before 3.5 came out, so it's kind of "in between" as far as versions go, and the regional feats in it aren't as powerful as those in PGtF, anyway. So I think they should be available after 1st level. Are they limited to first level only in PGtF? (I don't own it.)
Tiax returns
03-20-05, 05:10 AM Yes, regional feats are limited to first level in PGtF. Also, you can only have one, even if you're human. According to PGtF, beserker lodge feats are not regional feats, but your home region must be Rasheman in order to take them (making them kinda psuedo-regional feats).

Domino Rush ability from the Shock Trooper tactical feat works nicely with Improved Trip. Also, Combat Brute works great with Shock Trooper. If you have the dex, another nice one to combine with Improved Trip is Elusive Target. Those three combined let you pull all sorts of tricks, so that your enemies never quite know what to expect, even if they've seen you figh. Also, your power attack bonus when charging is sweet. Power Attack also goes well with Improved Trip, because the attack penalty doesn't matter so much. This kind of tactical fighter is feat-intensive though.
HiQKid
03-20-05, 11:19 PM Here's one possible build.

Fighter1 (Exotic Weapon Profficeincy, Combat Expertise, Imp Trip)
Fighter2 (Imp Disarm)
Fighter3 (Power Attack)
Fighter4 (Cleave)
Fighter4/Barbarian1
Fighter4/Barbarian2 (Destructive Rage)
Fighter4/Barbarian3
Fighter4/Barbarian4
Fighter4/Barbarian5 (Intimidating Rage)
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker1
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker2
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker3 (Weapon Focus)
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker4
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker5
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker6 (Imp Sunder)
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker7
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker8
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker9 (Combat Brute)
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker10
Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker10/Exotic Weapon Master1 (Flurry)

Strength: 22
Strength While Raging and Frenzied: 36
Attack Bonuses: 20/15/10/5
Flurry Attack Bonuses: 18/18/13/8/3
Frenzied Attack Bonuses: 20/20/15/10/5
Frenzied Flurry Attack Bonuses: 18/18/18/13/8/3
I saw an item some where that allows you to make a full attack while charging... use that, of course.

First round: Activate Frenzy and rage, power attack (-4 to hit and +16 to damage), charge (-2 AC, +2 Hit), Sunder, Sundering Cleave, Sunder (And cleave)Again if opponent is weilding two weapons or a sheild, Trip, attack 2 or three times.
Attack at 18/18/9/3 if sundering twice or 18/13/9/3 if once. Adjusted for strength is 31/31/22/16 or 31/26/22/16. 4d4 + 76 strength damage + 64 damage from power attack.

Between 144 and 156 damage.

Second Round: Flurry, Power Attack (-8 to hit and +24 to damage [+40 because of momentum swing?],
Attack at 10/10/10/5/0/-5. Adjusted by strength is +23/+23/+23/+18/+13/+8. Opponent gets -4 AC for being prone. 12d4 + 114 damage from strength + 240 damage from power attack.

Between 366 and 402 damage. Relies on 1 magic item to charge.

Total of two rounds of attack: Between 510 and 558 damage, plus leaving my opponent weaponless, sheild less, and on the ground if all goes well...

Any thoughts?
Kuroi Kenshi
03-21-05, 12:31 AM Something to consider:

01 Ftr1 (Exotic Weapon Profficeincy, Combat Expertise, Imp Trip)
02 Ftr2 (Imp Disarm)
03 Ftr2/Barb1 (Intimidating Rage)
04 Ftr2/Barb2
05 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar1 (Power Attack)
06 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar2 (Destructive rage, Cleave)
07 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3
08 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1
09 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1/Bear Warrior1 (Extra Rage)
10 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1/Bear Warrior1/Warshaper1
11 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1/Bear Warrior1/Warshaper2
12 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB2/Bear Warrior1/Warshaper2 (Improved Sunder)
Finish FB from there - 15 = combat brute, 18 = free feat

You gain +4 strength & con, immunity to crits and stun, a bonus feat, a freed up feat (for extra rage), some power points (bear form and expansion would combo nicely with morphic weapons), and the ability to morph into a bear for +8 str, +2 dex, +4 con. You lose 2 BAB, a little HD, 1 rage/day, but those three are all more than compensated for by the gains. You definitely lose imp. uncanny dodge, trap sense +1, and flurry.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
HiQKid 03-20-05, 12:30 AM	Right now I've got a level 2 fighter going into level three, (Human) and I wanted some advice on what direction to head in as far as feats or multiclass/PrCs. Right now it's a spkied chain weilding, chainmail wearer with the following feats: Combat Expertise Imp Trip Imp Disarm Exotic Weapon Profficeincy (Spiked Chain) Books available: PHB , DMG , CA , CW , Draconomicon (These are what I own, however other things might be allowed.). Psionics are not allowed in this campaign. None-phb core classes aren't usually allowed, but PrC's + feats aren't usually a problem. Any general advice would be appreciated.
Kintara 03-20-05, 01:02 AM	Oops, forgot. Chain does not equal spiked chain. Still, Snow Savant's build (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=163005) has some good ideas in it. Edit: Taking two levels of Exotic Weapon Master (Flurry and Trip Attack) from Complete Warrior, is a common option in a build like this. Edit2: Maybe a Human Paragon 2/Fighter 6/Exotic Weapon Master 2/Warmind 10 (not necessarily in that order)? The Warmind is in the Expanded Psionics Handbook, and the Human Paragon is in Unearthed Arcana.
PhaedrusXY 03-20-05, 01:39 AM	What books are available? What general direction are you looking to go? If Unearthed Arcana and/or Unapproachable East is available, take a couple levels of barbarian. Use the Wolf totem variant from UA, and take the Wolf Berzerker Lodge feat from UE. ;)
Kuroi Kenshi 03-20-05, 02:06 AM	Aren't the lodge feats lv1 only, since they're regional feats? Anyway, don't get anymore fighter levels. Two is all you need. Other classes will in nearly all cases serve you better. Hell, using UA stuff like wizard with fighter bonus feats, human paragon, and certain PrCs, you can get as many feats as a fighter10 in 10 levels while getting lots of other perks. To maximize the spiked chain tripper route, snow's build does it, though there are other feats you might want to go for that came out in splatbooks after she made the build. You definetly must get combat reflexes, dodge, mobility, karmic strike, and side step though. But, like PhaedrusXY, I'd like to know more info before giving specific advice.
PhaedrusXY 03-20-05, 04:46 AM	Aren't the lodge feats lv1 only, since they're regional feats?I don't think they are restricted to level 1 characters. It talks about gaining them with characters above level 1 on page 40 of UE, but that is specifically for charactes with an LA or racial hit dice, so it's debateable still. You could choose regional feats after level 1 in 3.0. (See page 28 of the FRCS.) UE was written just before 3.5 came out, so it's kind of "in between" as far as versions go, and the regional feats in it aren't as powerful as those in PGtF, anyway. So I think they should be available after 1st level. Are they limited to first level only in PGtF? (I don't own it.)
Tiax returns 03-20-05, 05:10 AM	Yes, regional feats are limited to first level in PGtF. Also, you can only have one, even if you're human. According to PGtF, beserker lodge feats are not regional feats, but your home region must be Rasheman in order to take them (making them kinda psuedo-regional feats). Domino Rush ability from the Shock Trooper tactical feat works nicely with Improved Trip. Also, Combat Brute works great with Shock Trooper. If you have the dex, another nice one to combine with Improved Trip is Elusive Target. Those three combined let you pull all sorts of tricks, so that your enemies never quite know what to expect, even if they've seen you figh. Also, your power attack bonus when charging is sweet. Power Attack also goes well with Improved Trip, because the attack penalty doesn't matter so much. This kind of tactical fighter is feat-intensive though.
HiQKid 03-20-05, 11:19 PM	Here's one possible build. Fighter1 (Exotic Weapon Profficeincy, Combat Expertise, Imp Trip) Fighter2 (Imp Disarm) Fighter3 (Power Attack) Fighter4 (Cleave) Fighter4/Barbarian1 Fighter4/Barbarian2 (Destructive Rage) Fighter4/Barbarian3 Fighter4/Barbarian4 Fighter4/Barbarian5 (Intimidating Rage) Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker1 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker2 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker3 (Weapon Focus) Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker4 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker5 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker6 (Imp Sunder) Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker7 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker8 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker9 (Combat Brute) Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker10 Fighter4/Barbarian5/Frenzied Berserker10/Exotic Weapon Master1 (Flurry) Strength: 22 Strength While Raging and Frenzied: 36 Attack Bonuses: 20/15/10/5 Flurry Attack Bonuses: 18/18/13/8/3 Frenzied Attack Bonuses: 20/20/15/10/5 Frenzied Flurry Attack Bonuses: 18/18/18/13/8/3 I saw an item some where that allows you to make a full attack while charging... use that, of course. First round: Activate Frenzy and rage, power attack (-4 to hit and +16 to damage), charge (-2 AC, +2 Hit), Sunder, Sundering Cleave, Sunder (And cleave)Again if opponent is weilding two weapons or a sheild, Trip, attack 2 or three times. Attack at 18/18/9/3 if sundering twice or 18/13/9/3 if once. Adjusted for strength is 31/31/22/16 or 31/26/22/16. 4d4 + 76 strength damage + 64 damage from power attack. Between 144 and 156 damage. Second Round: Flurry, Power Attack (-8 to hit and +24 to damage [+40 because of momentum swing?], Attack at 10/10/10/5/0/-5. Adjusted by strength is +23/+23/+23/+18/+13/+8. Opponent gets -4 AC for being prone. 12d4 + 114 damage from strength + 240 damage from power attack. Between 366 and 402 damage. Relies on 1 magic item to charge. Total of two rounds of attack: Between 510 and 558 damage, plus leaving my opponent weaponless, sheild less, and on the ground if all goes well... Any thoughts?
Kuroi Kenshi 03-21-05, 12:31 AM	Something to consider: 01 Ftr1 (Exotic Weapon Profficeincy, Combat Expertise, Imp Trip) 02 Ftr2 (Imp Disarm) 03 Ftr2/Barb1 (Intimidating Rage) 04 Ftr2/Barb2 05 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar1 (Power Attack) 06 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar2 (Destructive rage, Cleave) 07 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3 08 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1 09 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1/Bear Warrior1 (Extra Rage) 10 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1/Bear Warrior1/Warshaper1 11 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB1/Bear Warrior1/Warshaper2 12 Ftr2/Barb2/Psywar3/FB2/Bear Warrior1/Warshaper2 (Improved Sunder) Finish FB from there - 15 = combat brute, 18 = free feat You gain +4 strength & con, immunity to crits and stun, a bonus feat, a freed up feat (for extra rage), some power points (bear form and expansion would combo nicely with morphic weapons), and the ability to morph into a bear for +8 str, +2 dex, +4 con. You lose 2 BAB, a little HD, 1 rage/day, but those three are all more than compensated for by the gains. You definitely lose imp. uncanny dodge, trap sense +1, and flurry.