Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Metabubbles 05-21-06, 10:38 PM	Looking to 'optimize' a fighter. Options; we are allowed a level adjustment of 1, rather a template or a race (restriction of NO half-minotaur or half-Ogre). Half-drow has been modified to; +2 dex, Int & chr. -2 to con. NO spell resistance and no light blindness as well, level adjustment of +1. No War Hulk class either...::sigh::... ALL books allowed, except Psionics, we don't own them and may not any time soon (although there is the SRD...). I am torn, I like the Catfolk (+4 dex +2 chr) swashbuckler/duelist (not sure what feats to take; I like improved combat expertise, and elusive target and too many to list, for now). I also like the half-drow swash/duelist. My other option I was thinking of dwarf (+2 con -2 charisma) fighter & adding on the template of Draconic (level adj +1; +2 str, +2 con +2 charisma). Of course going dwarven defender as soon as possible. So please tear me apart, but what is the 'best' +1 level adjustment fighter?
_J_ 05-22-06, 05:15 AM	Mineral warrior from Underdark is a great +1 template, giving you +2 str, +4 con, -2 int, wis and cha, +3 natural armor, damage reduction 8/adamantine and burrow speed. Would work better than Draconic for the dwarf, I think. Goliath from Races of Stone have +1 LA, and make great barbarian/fighters. What level do you start? Is racial HD accepted? As one very, very good tank race is Maug (Fiend folio) with the template Incarnate construct (Savage species). With your -1 reduction to LA, that Maug would have 2 racial HD and no LA for +10 str, +4 dex, +2 int, +2 cha, +7 natural armor, large size and outsider skill points (8+int) for those two racial HD. Very amazing! Duelist isn't very good, by the way, there are better choices for dextrous warriors. Dervish (Complete warrior) is thought to be almost mandatory in such builds by some.
Xeraph 05-22-06, 07:04 AM	Duelist isn't very good, by the way, there are better choices for dextrous warriors. Dervish (Complete warrior) is thought to be almost mandatory in such builds by some.Truth! I suggest Bladedancer for Oriental Adventures or the Weightless Foot from Dragon Magazine 289. Also, a Monk with Kungfu Genius or Carmandine Monk is a great start for a duelist type build. ... oh yeah, and heres a vote for catfolk swashbucklers!!! http://www.minskin.com/albums/album07/Puss_in_Boots_pick.highlight.jpg Princess Fiona: Shrek? Puss-in-Boots: For you, baby, I could be.
Metabubbles 05-22-06, 08:43 AM	Wow, thanks for such a quick reply, I was hoping to post before anybody got a chance!!! Cannot use templates/races with HD levels, + (pretty huge, can't believe I forgot) If I don't use a +1 template or race level adjustment I can 'gestalt' first level. He doesn't want to say 'gestalt' but that is what it is, first level only. I was also thinking of a HUMAN Fighter/Sorcerer so that I can qualify for Dragon Disciple. Point buy 28 points, we are starting from scratch (puss in boots, get it, LOL) we are all 1st level. The dervish looks nice I will have to take her to 20 and see. Keep em coming, THanks!
Kresalak 05-22-06, 12:53 PM	Cobra Strike Monk varient from Unearthed Arcana gives you Dodge and Mobility, two feats you need for Dervish. Take Carmendine Monk and you replace Wis to AC with Int to AC, for more Swashbuckler synergy. Catfolk Swashbuckler 3/Cobra Strike Monk 3/Fighter 4/Dervish 10 is nice. 28 PB, give yourself Str 10, Dex 16, Con 12, Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 8. Racial mods make that Str 10, Dex 20, Con 12, Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 10. Suggested progression Swash 1/Monk 1/Fighter 1/Swash 2/Monk 2/Fighter 2/Swash 3/Dervish x/Monk 1/Fighter 2/Dervish (10-x). I'll use Dervish 5 and 5 for this. Feats Swash 1: Weapon Finesse Level 1: Two-Weapon Fighting Cobra Monk 1: Dodge Level 3: Carmendine Monk Fighter 1: Weapon Focus (Scimitar) Cobra Monk 2: Mobility Fighter 2: Combat Expertise Level 6: Elusive Target Level 9: Improved Two-Weapon Fighting Dervish 3(?): Spring Attack Level 12: Greater Two-Weapon Fighting Fighter 4: Weapon Specialization (Scimitar) Level 15: Melee Weapon Mastery (Slashing) Level 18: Not sure
Metabubbles 05-22-06, 05:16 PM	On paper it always looks nice, but the multi-class penalty will kill me, won't it? The group has a different taste for gestalt out of unearthed, so I am not sure how he would go for the monk, but it never hurts to ask. Thanks again.
Seerow 05-22-06, 05:29 PM	Nope, if you look at the progression no two classes are ever more than one level apart, so there are no Exp penalties. (Note: PrCs don't count towards Exp penalties. Ever.)
Balthanon 05-22-06, 05:43 PM	Point buy 28 points, we are starting from scratch (puss in boots, get it, LOL) we are all 1st level. With a 28 point buy, the extra stats that you can pick up from a +1 template will be appreciated. You might try looking through the links in the sticky--I know there have been a couple of compilations of effective low level adjustments.
Xeraph 05-22-06, 05:45 PM	But isnt the Monk levels still a problem? Like a member of any other class, a monk may be a multiclass character, but multiclass monks face a special restriction. A monk who gains a new class or (if already multiclass) raises another class by a level may never again raise her monk level, though she retains all her monk abilities.
Kresalak 05-22-06, 08:39 PM	You know, I completely forgot about that part. I've been playing without that for so long I forgot it was a rule. Sadly, with that, you'll have to delay access to Dervish. You can make the start swash 3/fighter 2/monk 3, which means no Dervish until level 9 (As opposed to my builds 8). Grab the 4th level of fighter at 12, 15, or 18 (or sooner) to get yourself Melee Weapon Mastery. If you want to use the Drow, and if you can get access to Champion of Corellon Larethian (good drow or reflavored), you can go Swash 3/Fighter 4/Dervish 10/CoCL 2/x1, where x is something. Sadly, that build can't fit in Monk+Carmendine Monk without an XP penalty, but you could always take it at 18th level and only have a few levels of that. Of course, that means only a few levels of Int to AC as well... Wait! Would a Monk's Belt work with Carmendine Monk? That would allow you to drop those nasty medium BAB levels and still get Int to AC.
swanyusd 05-22-06, 08:43 PM	I'm a huge fan of the catfolk, mostly for one reason: that feat 'catfolk pounce'. If you check my sig, there is an example build of what crazy goodness catfolks can be (horrible grammar I know). Its a dex fighter, or stealth fighter as I prefer. Have fun with your new game. -Swany