"I see that" [Archive] - Wizards Community

"I see that" [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
djinni
06-29-06, 05:27 PM taking the exemplar PrC to gain the super spot/listen/search skills
and the horizon walker for tremorsense at 5th level, I need a way to gain an (Ex) ability for blindsight.
our GM keeps ambushing us because "we didn't make our spot checks." I need to find a way around needing to actually make one, anything will do but I definately need an EX way to deal with it because he's hit me with antimagic ray to cancel my combat control abilities.
any wotc material is acceptable and anytihng d20 OGL.
can you help me to fight back against the oppressive nature of the GM!
(he's not that bad a GM it's just the same tactic for the monsters is getting boring, and I need a way to force him out of his rut)
Surreal
06-29-06, 06:28 PM cut'n'paste from the list I have...

Blindsight
- combat awareness, feat, PHB2
- Eye of Gruumsh 5 (ecl 11), PrC, Complete Warrior
- Henshin Mystic, PrC, Oriental Adventures
- Shade Hunter 10 (ecl 15) , PrC, Champions of Ruin
- Slime Lord, PrC, Player's Guide to Faerun

Blindsighted, weapon enhancement, Underdark

Blindsense
- glaring eye, graft, Races of the Dragon
- Scout 10 (blindsense), class, CV
- blindsense, wild feat, CV
Tleilaxu_Ghola
06-29-06, 06:43 PM Don't forget mind sight from Lords of Madness. Mix this feat with a single level dip in mindbender to gain an effective blindsight w/ a 100' radius.

The feat is found in the Tochar section, IIRC.
Wolfman1987
06-30-06, 01:35 PM A 14th level druid with embrace the wild (any of the whales from MM) gains blindsight out to 120 feet. You could put it in an item, but that would be really expensive. If you are at a high enough level, your druid might be able to just cast it several times per day and have it on most of the time.
_Eleazar_
06-30-06, 01:45 PM I don't believe embrace of the wild work in an antimagic field. Does wildshape even work in an antimagic field? I think it does. In that case what is to stop you from just wildshaping into a form with it? You could also take the shapechanging variant in the PHB2. If you still want to keep your current class and progression I would go with the other suggestions.
Khan the Destroyer
06-30-06, 01:57 PM Your GM needs to reconsider his tactic. Spot and Listen are reactionary skills. If someone is hiding, from you, he needs to ask you for a spot check. Unless you are blind, no one automatically succeeds at hiding. Even invisible opponents only get a bonus to hide. A large one, but still, not an auto success.

I'm sure he'd be pretty annoyed if you made a spot check every 30 seconds just to be sure.

Anyways, I don't know of a way to get Blindsense/sight as an extraordinary ability. I think the Mindbender/Mindsight trick might not work in AMF. If the Mindbender's telepathy is Su, it will go off in the field.
AramilWindwalker
06-30-06, 02:11 PM as khan said, the dm is supposed to ask for a spot/listen check whenever something is approaching/trying to hide/move quietly. because it's assumed the PC's character is always surveying his surroundings, just as he's always dodging and weaving and lashing out during combat, not just standing there with his finger up his heiny whenever he isn't actively doing something determined by the player.

tell your DM that he's supposed to tell you to make reactionary spot/listen checks, and not just nail you with antimagic crap because you didn't see the 7ft beholder you didn't actively look for.
Pellanor
06-30-06, 02:29 PM I'm going to work on the assumption that when you said "Didn't make your spot check" you meant that you didn't roll high enough, and not that you forgot to roll.

So now you have two options, iether pimping your spot check up the wazzo, or, as you said, making it so that you don't need to make spot checks.

Blindsight/sense is a good step towards that, but there's a feat in Lords of Madness called Darkstalker (or something like that) which allows a character to hide from creatures with blindsight/sense.

I would really suggest the Mind Bender(1) with Mind Sight trick. Sure it's not an (ex) ability, but you'll know when it goes away. That should be a good sign that you may get ambushed, so just ready an action. "As soon as my Mindsight stops working, every round I ready an action to attack the first agressive creature that I see." That way, even if you do get ambushed, you have an action to do something with. And regardless of how high a hide check you opponent has, the moment they no longer have cover, concealment or hide in plain sight, you should automatically see them.

Of course if your opponets all just snipe you from range, you're hosed.
Khan the Destroyer
06-30-06, 02:42 PM I'm going to work on the assumption that when you said "Didn't make your spot check" you meant that you didn't roll high enough, and not that you forgot to roll.
Wow, good call. I probably misinterpreted that.

In that case, maybe focus more on listen than spot. Grab Hear the Unseen in Complate Adventurer. This makes the DC a flat 25 to pinpoint the location of any creature in 30 ft. (so no matter how high their hide/move silently check is, you only need a 25 listen check to pinpoint them). Then you can take Keen-Eared Scout in Player's Handbook 2 to learn more information based off the roll you get (according to the 25 DC). Though Keen-Eared Scout isn't really needed.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
djinni 06-29-06, 05:27 PM	taking the exemplar PrC to gain the super spot/listen/search skills and the horizon walker for tremorsense at 5th level, I need a way to gain an (Ex) ability for blindsight. our GM keeps ambushing us because "we didn't make our spot checks." I need to find a way around needing to actually make one, anything will do but I definately need an EX way to deal with it because he's hit me with antimagic ray to cancel my combat control abilities. any wotc material is acceptable and anytihng d20 OGL. can you help me to fight back against the oppressive nature of the GM! (he's not that bad a GM it's just the same tactic for the monsters is getting boring, and I need a way to force him out of his rut)
Surreal 06-29-06, 06:28 PM	cut'n'paste from the list I have... Blindsight - combat awareness, feat, PHB2 - Eye of Gruumsh 5 (ecl 11), PrC, Complete Warrior - Henshin Mystic, PrC, Oriental Adventures - Shade Hunter 10 (ecl 15) , PrC, Champions of Ruin - Slime Lord, PrC, Player's Guide to Faerun Blindsighted, weapon enhancement, Underdark Blindsense - glaring eye, graft, Races of the Dragon - Scout 10 (blindsense), class, CV - blindsense, wild feat, CV
Tleilaxu_Ghola 06-29-06, 06:43 PM	Don't forget mind sight from Lords of Madness. Mix this feat with a single level dip in mindbender to gain an effective blindsight w/ a 100' radius. The feat is found in the Tochar section, IIRC.
Wolfman1987 06-30-06, 01:35 PM	A 14th level druid with embrace the wild (any of the whales from MM) gains blindsight out to 120 feet. You could put it in an item, but that would be really expensive. If you are at a high enough level, your druid might be able to just cast it several times per day and have it on most of the time.
_Eleazar_ 06-30-06, 01:45 PM	I don't believe embrace of the wild work in an antimagic field. Does wildshape even work in an antimagic field? I think it does. In that case what is to stop you from just wildshaping into a form with it? You could also take the shapechanging variant in the PHB2. If you still want to keep your current class and progression I would go with the other suggestions.
Khan the Destroyer 06-30-06, 01:57 PM	Your GM needs to reconsider his tactic. Spot and Listen are reactionary skills. If someone is hiding, from you, he needs to ask you for a spot check. Unless you are blind, no one automatically succeeds at hiding. Even invisible opponents only get a bonus to hide. A large one, but still, not an auto success. I'm sure he'd be pretty annoyed if you made a spot check every 30 seconds just to be sure. Anyways, I don't know of a way to get Blindsense/sight as an extraordinary ability. I think the Mindbender/Mindsight trick might not work in AMF. If the Mindbender's telepathy is Su, it will go off in the field.
AramilWindwalker 06-30-06, 02:11 PM	as khan said, the dm is supposed to ask for a spot/listen check whenever something is approaching/trying to hide/move quietly. because it's assumed the PC's character is always surveying his surroundings, just as he's always dodging and weaving and lashing out during combat, not just standing there with his finger up his heiny whenever he isn't actively doing something determined by the player. tell your DM that he's supposed to tell you to make reactionary spot/listen checks, and not just nail you with antimagic crap because you didn't see the 7ft beholder you didn't actively look for.
Pellanor 06-30-06, 02:29 PM	I'm going to work on the assumption that when you said "Didn't make your spot check" you meant that you didn't roll high enough, and not that you forgot to roll. So now you have two options, iether pimping your spot check up the wazzo, or, as you said, making it so that you don't need to make spot checks. Blindsight/sense is a good step towards that, but there's a feat in Lords of Madness called Darkstalker (or something like that) which allows a character to hide from creatures with blindsight/sense. I would really suggest the Mind Bender(1) with Mind Sight trick. Sure it's not an (ex) ability, but you'll know when it goes away. That should be a good sign that you may get ambushed, so just ready an action. "As soon as my Mindsight stops working, every round I ready an action to attack the first agressive creature that I see." That way, even if you do get ambushed, you have an action to do something with. And regardless of how high a hide check you opponent has, the moment they no longer have cover, concealment or hide in plain sight, you should automatically see them. Of course if your opponets all just snipe you from range, you're hosed.
Khan the Destroyer 06-30-06, 02:42 PM	I'm going to work on the assumption that when you said "Didn't make your spot check" you meant that you didn't roll high enough, and not that you forgot to roll. Wow, good call. I probably misinterpreted that. In that case, maybe focus more on listen than spot. Grab Hear the Unseen in Complate Adventurer. This makes the DC a flat 25 to pinpoint the location of any creature in 30 ft. (so no matter how high their hide/move silently check is, you only need a 25 listen check to pinpoint them). Then you can take Keen-Eared Scout in Player's Handbook 2 to learn more information based off the roll you get (according to the 25 DC). Though Keen-Eared Scout isn't really needed.