Arcane Hierophant optimization [Archive] - Wizards Community

Arcane Hierophant optimization [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Patryn
04-12-05, 11:54 PM Hey, I'm starting a new campaign at level 4, and I wanted to play a druid. I was considering a Master of Many Forms character, but I decided I didn't like the loss of spell casting. Now I'd like to play an Arcane Hierophant, but I dont' know how I should go about making him playable in a min/max campaign. Help, please?
Patryn
04-13-05, 12:15 AM I was thinking something along the lines of druid4/wizard4/arcane hierophant 10/human paragon 2. The only feat I'm really set on is Natural Spell. Any suggestions are welcome.
Patryn
04-13-05, 12:19 AM I just realized that my posted build only nets me a caster levels of 14 and 15, which barely nets me 8th level spells, to say nothing of 9th level. I'll think about it.
Marcus Majarra
04-13-05, 12:21 AM Optimizing the Arcane Hierophant isn't difficult. It's just a matter of selecting the right feats.

Basically, you go Wiz3/Drd3/MysticTheurge4/ArcaneHierophant10. You get CL 17th in both arcane and divine casting, the wildshape ability of a 13th-level druid, and a few other nifty abilities.
Patryn
04-13-05, 12:24 AM Optimizing the Arcane Hierophant isn't difficult. It's just a matter of selecting the right feats.

Basically, you go Wiz3/Drd3/MysticTheurge4/ArcaneHierophant10. You get CL 17th in both arcane and divine casting, the wildshape ability of a 13th-level druid, and a few other nifty abilities.

Handy, but Druids don't gain wild shape untill 5th level, and Arcane Hierophant doesn't grant it if you don't have it.
Talen Lee
04-13-05, 12:37 AM Shhhh! They might hear you!

Seriously. The rules section there is muddy. I agree with you - that it shouldn't by the RAW - but the example contradicts. The example is really, really dumb, though, so I try not to give it too much credence.
PhoenixInferno
04-13-05, 12:38 AM Handy, but Druids don't gain wild shape untill 5th level, and Arcane Hierophant doesn't grant it if you don't have it.
But if you look at the sample character, it doesn't have Wild Shape before it takes levels of Arcane Heirophant, but it still winds up getting Wild Shape. I think the strange wording of the Wild Shape advancement is to preclude classes that didn't normally get Wild Shape from getting it through Arcane Heirophant (ie Rangers)
Patryn
04-13-05, 12:41 AM But if you look at the sample character, it doesn't have Wild Shape before it takes levels of Arcane Heirophant, but it still winds up getting Wild Shape. I think the strange wording of the Wild Shape advancement is to preclude classes that didn't normally get Wild Shape from getting it through Arcane Heirophant (ie Rangers)

EDIT: I'm playing human, or strongheart halfling if I can remember where it is.

Hmm.. I see what you mean. I'll discuss it with my DM. Thanks for the help. Any feat suggestions? Like I said previously, Natural Spell is a must, but I've no idea where to go from there.
Talen Lee
04-13-05, 12:57 AM Precocious Apprentice? :P

Augment Summoning and Greenbond Summoner are both good (as is Rashemi Elemental Summoning), but they don't improve your personal combat ability - and when you can turn into a bear, you usually really want to wade into melee yourself. Quick Wildshape from the Complete Divine is good, Improved Initiative is never bad, and Empower Spell can net you a large number of very good summons if you opt to use greenbond and augment.
RogerWilco
04-16-05, 09:58 PM Customer Support Discussion Thread
--------------------------------------------------
Response (Sam S.) 03/29/2005 03:37 PM
Thank you for contacting us,

The Druid3/Wiz4/ArcHei2 does qualify for Master of Many Forms.

The temporary Alertness feat does not let you qualify for MoMF.

The MoMF does stack with previous wildshape abilities for duration and Hit Dice.

Keep in mind that druid levels do not stack with MoMF for wildshape unless you have enough druid levels to get the wildshape ability (level 5).

Good Gaming!

To login to your account, or update your question please click here.

Sam S.

Customer Service Representative
Wizards of the Coast
1-800-324-6496 (US and Canada)
425-204-8069 (From all other countries)
Monday-Friday 7am-6pm PST / 10am-9pm EST
Customer (----) 03/29/2005 12:06 PM
Dear customer service/ Chris,

The Arcane Hierophant can be found on page 108-113 of the "Races of the Wild" Dungeons and Dragons gaming acessory by Skip Williams ISBN 0-7869-3438-7.

P.S. Why do I need to make another account in adition to the WotC boards/forums account, and secondly why do you need my birthdate, if you didn't need it last week?

On 28 Mar 2005 at 10:44, Wizards Customer Service wrote:
>
> Game rules question - Dungeons & Dragons/Forgotten Realms/Eberron
> Feedback
> From: (User ID RogerWilco on the forums/boards)
>
> I have just bought Complete Adventurer and Races of the Wild and have four
> questions pertaining to combinations of the Arcane Hierophant and Master
> of Many Forms:
>
> - Does a druid3/Wiz4/ArcaneHierophant2 with Alertness and Endurance
> qualify for the MoMF?
>
> -Actually no, since they don't have the wild shape class feature (unless
> provided by the arcane hierophant).
>
> - Would the Alertness granted by the Wizard Familiar/ ArcaneHierophant
> Companion Familiar be sufficient to qualify for MoMF?
>
> -Actually no, you'd have to devote a slot to the actual feat.
>
> - Can a Druid8/MoMF1 take the form of Large Humanoid of 9 HD, can a
> Druid15/MoMF3 take the form of a Huge Giant of 18HD? in other words: do
> maximum HD stack and the ability to change into Large/Tiny/Huge transfer
> between Druid/MoMF
>
> -To turn into a form that is only supported by the MoMF PrC, you would
> have to achieve the level where that size is available on the PrC
> advancement. For example the Druid8/MoMF1 could turn into a large
> animal, or a medium humanoid.
>
> - Messages from customer service posted on the boards seem to indicate
> that wildshape HD maximum and duration should stack between Druid and
> MoMF, does this include the levels granted by Arcane Hierophant, or is
> this invalid and do these not stack?
>
> -If you could provide a book title and page number for the arcane
> hierophant, I'd be happy to assist you further with this. Thank you for
> your patience. Good gaming!
>
> *Please quote this email in any reply.*
> **************************************** *****
> Chris
> Customer Service Department
> Wizards of the Coast
> 1-800-324-6496
> **************************************** *****
nachtmeister
04-17-05, 05:03 AM just go

Druid 3
Wizard3
MT 2
AH 10
MT 2

take a duskwood falchion ( for spikes )
as feats :

power attack
Combat expertise
natural spell
Timespike
04-17-05, 10:46 AM Here's how I'd personally do an arcane hierophant:

Race: Killoren
Alignment: NG

Level 1 Druid 1 Track
Level 2 Druid 2
Level 3 Wizard 1 [Scribe Scroll] Practiced Spellcaster (wizard)
Level 4 Druid 3
Level 5 Druid 4
Level 6 Druid 5 Natural Spell
Level 7 Wizard 2
Level 8 Druid 6
Level 9 Wizard 3 Lion's Pounce
Level 10 Druid 7
Level 11 Arcane Hierophant 1
Level 12 Arcane Hierophant 2 Exalted Wildshape
Level 13 Arcane Hierophant 3
Level 14 Arcane Hierophant 4
Level 15 Arcane Hierophant 5 Exalted Companion
Level 16 Arcane Hierophant 6
Level 17 Arcane Hierophant 7
Level 18 Arcane Hierophant 8 Killoren Destroyer
Level 19 Arcane Hierophant 9
Level 20 Arcane Hierophant 10

Were the graft flesh prerequisites lower, I'd have some other stuff that would be both effective and creepy to show off, but as it is, I have some serious build revision to do. :ahem:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Patryn 04-12-05, 11:54 PM	Hey, I'm starting a new campaign at level 4, and I wanted to play a druid. I was considering a Master of Many Forms character, but I decided I didn't like the loss of spell casting. Now I'd like to play an Arcane Hierophant, but I dont' know how I should go about making him playable in a min/max campaign. Help, please?
Patryn 04-13-05, 12:15 AM	I was thinking something along the lines of druid4/wizard4/arcane hierophant 10/human paragon 2. The only feat I'm really set on is Natural Spell. Any suggestions are welcome.
Patryn 04-13-05, 12:19 AM	I just realized that my posted build only nets me a caster levels of 14 and 15, which barely nets me 8th level spells, to say nothing of 9th level. I'll think about it.
Marcus Majarra 04-13-05, 12:21 AM	Optimizing the Arcane Hierophant isn't difficult. It's just a matter of selecting the right feats. Basically, you go Wiz3/Drd3/MysticTheurge4/ArcaneHierophant10. You get CL 17th in both arcane and divine casting, the wildshape ability of a 13th-level druid, and a few other nifty abilities.
Patryn 04-13-05, 12:24 AM	Optimizing the Arcane Hierophant isn't difficult. It's just a matter of selecting the right feats. Basically, you go Wiz3/Drd3/MysticTheurge4/ArcaneHierophant10. You get CL 17th in both arcane and divine casting, the wildshape ability of a 13th-level druid, and a few other nifty abilities. Handy, but Druids don't gain wild shape untill 5th level, and Arcane Hierophant doesn't grant it if you don't have it.
Talen Lee 04-13-05, 12:37 AM	Shhhh! They might hear you! Seriously. The rules section there is muddy. I agree with you - that it shouldn't by the RAW - but the example contradicts. The example is really, really dumb, though, so I try not to give it too much credence.
PhoenixInferno 04-13-05, 12:38 AM	Handy, but Druids don't gain wild shape untill 5th level, and Arcane Hierophant doesn't grant it if you don't have it. But if you look at the sample character, it doesn't have Wild Shape before it takes levels of Arcane Heirophant, but it still winds up getting Wild Shape. I think the strange wording of the Wild Shape advancement is to preclude classes that didn't normally get Wild Shape from getting it through Arcane Heirophant (ie Rangers)
Patryn 04-13-05, 12:41 AM	But if you look at the sample character, it doesn't have Wild Shape before it takes levels of Arcane Heirophant, but it still winds up getting Wild Shape. I think the strange wording of the Wild Shape advancement is to preclude classes that didn't normally get Wild Shape from getting it through Arcane Heirophant (ie Rangers) EDIT: I'm playing human, or strongheart halfling if I can remember where it is. Hmm.. I see what you mean. I'll discuss it with my DM. Thanks for the help. Any feat suggestions? Like I said previously, Natural Spell is a must, but I've no idea where to go from there.
Talen Lee 04-13-05, 12:57 AM	Precocious Apprentice? :P Augment Summoning and Greenbond Summoner are both good (as is Rashemi Elemental Summoning), but they don't improve your personal combat ability - and when you can turn into a bear, you usually really want to wade into melee yourself. Quick Wildshape from the Complete Divine is good, Improved Initiative is never bad, and Empower Spell can net you a large number of very good summons if you opt to use greenbond and augment.
RogerWilco 04-16-05, 09:58 PM	Customer Support Discussion Thread -------------------------------------------------- Response (Sam S.) 03/29/2005 03:37 PM Thank you for contacting us, The Druid3/Wiz4/ArcHei2 does qualify for Master of Many Forms. The temporary Alertness feat does not let you qualify for MoMF. The MoMF does stack with previous wildshape abilities for duration and Hit Dice. Keep in mind that druid levels do not stack with MoMF for wildshape unless you have enough druid levels to get the wildshape ability (level 5). Good Gaming! To login to your account, or update your question please click here. Sam S. Customer Service Representative Wizards of the Coast 1-800-324-6496 (US and Canada) 425-204-8069 (From all other countries) Monday-Friday 7am-6pm PST / 10am-9pm EST Customer (----) 03/29/2005 12:06 PM Dear customer service/ Chris, The Arcane Hierophant can be found on page 108-113 of the "Races of the Wild" Dungeons and Dragons gaming acessory by Skip Williams ISBN 0-7869-3438-7. P.S. Why do I need to make another account in adition to the WotC boards/forums account, and secondly why do you need my birthdate, if you didn't need it last week? On 28 Mar 2005 at 10:44, Wizards Customer Service wrote: > > Game rules question - Dungeons & Dragons/Forgotten Realms/Eberron > Feedback > From: (User ID RogerWilco on the forums/boards) > > I have just bought Complete Adventurer and Races of the Wild and have four > questions pertaining to combinations of the Arcane Hierophant and Master > of Many Forms: > > - Does a druid3/Wiz4/ArcaneHierophant2 with Alertness and Endurance > qualify for the MoMF? > > -Actually no, since they don't have the wild shape class feature (unless > provided by the arcane hierophant). > > - Would the Alertness granted by the Wizard Familiar/ ArcaneHierophant > Companion Familiar be sufficient to qualify for MoMF? > > -Actually no, you'd have to devote a slot to the actual feat. > > - Can a Druid8/MoMF1 take the form of Large Humanoid of 9 HD, can a > Druid15/MoMF3 take the form of a Huge Giant of 18HD? in other words: do > maximum HD stack and the ability to change into Large/Tiny/Huge transfer > between Druid/MoMF > > -To turn into a form that is only supported by the MoMF PrC, you would > have to achieve the level where that size is available on the PrC > advancement. For example the Druid8/MoMF1 could turn into a large > animal, or a medium humanoid. > > - Messages from customer service posted on the boards seem to indicate > that wildshape HD maximum and duration should stack between Druid and > MoMF, does this include the levels granted by Arcane Hierophant, or is > this invalid and do these not stack? > > -If you could provide a book title and page number for the arcane > hierophant, I'd be happy to assist you further with this. Thank you for > your patience. Good gaming! > > Please quote this email in any reply. > ************************************** * > Chris > Customer Service Department > Wizards of the Coast > 1-800-324-6496 > ************************************ ***
nachtmeister 04-17-05, 05:03 AM	just go Druid 3 Wizard3 MT 2 AH 10 MT 2 take a duskwood falchion ( for spikes ) as feats : power attack Combat expertise natural spell
Timespike 04-17-05, 10:46 AM	Here's how I'd personally do an arcane hierophant: Race: Killoren Alignment: NG Level 1 Druid 1 Track Level 2 Druid 2 Level 3 Wizard 1 [Scribe Scroll] Practiced Spellcaster (wizard) Level 4 Druid 3 Level 5 Druid 4 Level 6 Druid 5 Natural Spell Level 7 Wizard 2 Level 8 Druid 6 Level 9 Wizard 3 Lion's Pounce Level 10 Druid 7 Level 11 Arcane Hierophant 1 Level 12 Arcane Hierophant 2 Exalted Wildshape Level 13 Arcane Hierophant 3 Level 14 Arcane Hierophant 4 Level 15 Arcane Hierophant 5 Exalted Companion Level 16 Arcane Hierophant 6 Level 17 Arcane Hierophant 7 Level 18 Arcane Hierophant 8 Killoren Destroyer Level 19 Arcane Hierophant 9 Level 20 Arcane Hierophant 10 Were the graft flesh prerequisites lower, I'd have some other stuff that would be both effective and creepy to show off, but as it is, I have some serious build revision to do. :ahem: