ArchMage Opinion and Build [Archive] - Wizards Community

ArchMage Opinion and Build [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Potlok
03-26-04, 04:37 AM I just saw various posts about the archmages high arcana, and only 1 person mentioned the mastery of counterspell. I don't know if I didn't read well the description of this high arcana but I think is AWESOME combining it with reactive counterspell is just great! think of the 15th Level Wizard NPC who wants to cast destintegrate on you and you counter it and the spell is turned to him! I really think is the best high arcana.

Please if Imisread the concepto tell me because I'm preparing a Wiz5/Inc8/Arch2 to play this week and I want to know if I'm wrong.

Also some advice would be great for a build

Race: Human

My feats are

Improved initiative, Spell Focus (Abjuration), Spell focus (trans), Skill Focus (Spellcraft), Iron Will, Improved counterspell, Reactive Counterspell. Persistent spell, and Enlarge Spell.

And the high arcana I would choose is Mastery on Counterspell and Spell-like ability

So any criticism would be great

(Sorry for any mistype, but i'm at work and i don't have much time lol)
Galeon Sirtan
03-26-04, 07:30 AM mhm, i like your concept as the antimage concept i need

but one thing dont works: persistant spell, as you need extend spell before you can take persistant spell
Potlok
03-26-04, 07:36 AM Sorry that was an error, I know the spanish names of feats, but I didn't know at that moment the exact name of the metamagic fear prereq for persistent spell.
gorion
03-26-04, 07:45 AM If you want to counterspell with some success be sure to be a sorcerer. You'll have many more slots and you could toss out greater dispels over and over
Sisyfos
03-26-04, 07:53 AM Sorcerer/archmage counterspeller (add any other PrCs to suit your tastes)

Cantrips from all different schools
Heighten spell
Improved init
Improved counterspell
Reactive counterspell
Mastery of counterspelling

What you have here is a spellcaster who can reactively turn back any spell she sees without needing to have the right spell or right school spells prepared and ready an action to do it.

Wizards are just that much worse in counterspelling that it isn't even funny (I should know as I am playing a wizard who is specialized in counterspelling...). Specialists are even worse off as they do not have spells of certain schools and can try to counter those ONLY through the uncertain means of casting dispel magics + greater dispels.

Sisyfos
Potlok
03-26-04, 07:56 AM My objective is not only to counterspell, and with improved counbterspelling i can use whichever spell I want from one level above than the one i'm counterspelling so tehre's no problem there.
I prefer a wizard cause I have only had one and in low levels and I wanted to try Incantatrix at high level.

Edit: I have the important ones to counterspell: trans, evoc and conj.
Sisyfos
03-26-04, 07:59 AM What ever you say. I have no more advice to give than the one I just gave.
TinManFan
03-26-04, 06:46 PM If you pick up some other counterspell feats, pick the one up that lets you burn a higher level spell of the same school or a same level of the same school (Too many counterspelling feats that do basicly the same thing... Rrrrrrr...) Then, learn some universal spells! Always fun. For 300 XP, lim wish can counter anything lower than it. Always nice.

Thankfully my DM hates casting magic in battle so I never have to worry about anything but a Mords Disj coming in at me.Of course I DO have to worry about a lv 30 fighter with all the oversized weapon feats smackin me 4X a round...
Diabolic Doppelganger
03-26-04, 10:47 PM Sisyfos, I have seen many times that you advocate the use of heighten spell with a cantrip, but how does it work?

The way I see it, he starts to cast, you find out what it is, then you start to apply a metamagic feat to it (which takes a full round action)... :censored:... please, how does it work?
TaisharMalkier
03-27-04, 12:30 AM Zug Zug.

"Sisyfos, I have seen many times that you advocate the use of heighten spell with a cantrip, but how does it work?

The way I see it, he starts to cast, you find out what it is, then you start to apply a metamagic feat to it (which takes a full round action)... ... please, how does it work?"

With reactive counterspell, you spend a FRA next round to cast heightened cantrip.

Cheers
Sisyfos
03-27-04, 01:07 AM Originally posted by Diabolic Doppelganger
Sisyfos, I have seen many times that you advocate the use of heighten spell with a cantrip, but how does it work?

The way I see it, he starts to cast, you find out what it is, then you start to apply a metamagic feat to it (which takes a full round action)... :censored:... please, how does it work?

TaisharMalkier is right. Reactive counterspell allows one to use the heighten spelled cantrip anyhow the round they see the attacking spell and suffer the full round action the next round. Sorcs can easily have cantrips from all the schools. Thus if they have not used all their spells and are not outclassed (example: opponent casting 7th level spells, when the sorc can only yet cast 6th level) they can always counterspell any spell with this combo.

The legality of this practice has been verified by Sage who actually even was the one recommending it in Dragon magazine I think. This was also mentioned in one of the various FAQs at Wizards site.

Sisyfos
sparkster4242
03-27-04, 03:45 AM at one time the 3.0 FAQ included the Sage's ruling; he believed that the counter-a-spell action was always a standard action, and did not depend on the casting time of the spell involved. personally, i tend to agree.

i believe that ruling was reversed later on, by someone who believes it takes as long to counter a spell as it does to cast it. under this ruling, there wouldnt be enough time to Heighten a spell and use it to spontaneously counter with it.

by the way, being able to counter spells is nice ... but _casting_ spells instead can often end a fight faster :P
Sisyfos
03-27-04, 04:14 AM Counterspell is an option. If you do not want to counter a spell you can always cast one. Also, we are talking about reactive countering combined with archmages mastery of counterspelling here, which turns the spell back at its caster.

Why take a disintegrate and cast one when you can turn your opponent's disintegrate back at him without taking one?

Sisyfos

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Potlok 03-26-04, 04:37 AM	I just saw various posts about the archmages high arcana, and only 1 person mentioned the mastery of counterspell. I don't know if I didn't read well the description of this high arcana but I think is AWESOME combining it with reactive counterspell is just great! think of the 15th Level Wizard NPC who wants to cast destintegrate on you and you counter it and the spell is turned to him! I really think is the best high arcana. Please if Imisread the concepto tell me because I'm preparing a Wiz5/Inc8/Arch2 to play this week and I want to know if I'm wrong. Also some advice would be great for a build Race: Human My feats are Improved initiative, Spell Focus (Abjuration), Spell focus (trans), Skill Focus (Spellcraft), Iron Will, Improved counterspell, Reactive Counterspell. Persistent spell, and Enlarge Spell. And the high arcana I would choose is Mastery on Counterspell and Spell-like ability So any criticism would be great (Sorry for any mistype, but i'm at work and i don't have much time lol)
Galeon Sirtan 03-26-04, 07:30 AM	mhm, i like your concept as the antimage concept i need but one thing dont works: persistant spell, as you need extend spell before you can take persistant spell
Potlok 03-26-04, 07:36 AM	Sorry that was an error, I know the spanish names of feats, but I didn't know at that moment the exact name of the metamagic fear prereq for persistent spell.
gorion 03-26-04, 07:45 AM	If you want to counterspell with some success be sure to be a sorcerer. You'll have many more slots and you could toss out greater dispels over and over
Sisyfos 03-26-04, 07:53 AM	Sorcerer/archmage counterspeller (add any other PrCs to suit your tastes) Cantrips from all different schools Heighten spell Improved init Improved counterspell Reactive counterspell Mastery of counterspelling What you have here is a spellcaster who can reactively turn back any spell she sees without needing to have the right spell or right school spells prepared and ready an action to do it. Wizards are just that much worse in counterspelling that it isn't even funny (I should know as I am playing a wizard who is specialized in counterspelling...). Specialists are even worse off as they do not have spells of certain schools and can try to counter those ONLY through the uncertain means of casting dispel magics + greater dispels. Sisyfos
Potlok 03-26-04, 07:56 AM	My objective is not only to counterspell, and with improved counbterspelling i can use whichever spell I want from one level above than the one i'm counterspelling so tehre's no problem there. I prefer a wizard cause I have only had one and in low levels and I wanted to try Incantatrix at high level. Edit: I have the important ones to counterspell: trans, evoc and conj.
Sisyfos 03-26-04, 07:59 AM	What ever you say. I have no more advice to give than the one I just gave.
TinManFan 03-26-04, 06:46 PM	If you pick up some other counterspell feats, pick the one up that lets you burn a higher level spell of the same school or a same level of the same school (Too many counterspelling feats that do basicly the same thing... Rrrrrrr...) Then, learn some universal spells! Always fun. For 300 XP, lim wish can counter anything lower than it. Always nice. Thankfully my DM hates casting magic in battle so I never have to worry about anything but a Mords Disj coming in at me.Of course I DO have to worry about a lv 30 fighter with all the oversized weapon feats smackin me 4X a round...
Diabolic Doppelganger 03-26-04, 10:47 PM	Sisyfos, I have seen many times that you advocate the use of heighten spell with a cantrip, but how does it work? The way I see it, he starts to cast, you find out what it is, then you start to apply a metamagic feat to it (which takes a full round action)... :censored:... please, how does it work?
TaisharMalkier 03-27-04, 12:30 AM	Zug Zug. "Sisyfos, I have seen many times that you advocate the use of heighten spell with a cantrip, but how does it work? The way I see it, he starts to cast, you find out what it is, then you start to apply a metamagic feat to it (which takes a full round action)... ... please, how does it work?" With reactive counterspell, you spend a FRA next round to cast heightened cantrip. Cheers
Sisyfos 03-27-04, 01:07 AM	Originally posted by Diabolic Doppelganger Sisyfos, I have seen many times that you advocate the use of heighten spell with a cantrip, but how does it work? The way I see it, he starts to cast, you find out what it is, then you start to apply a metamagic feat to it (which takes a full round action)... :censored:... please, how does it work? TaisharMalkier is right. Reactive counterspell allows one to use the heighten spelled cantrip anyhow the round they see the attacking spell and suffer the full round action the next round. Sorcs can easily have cantrips from all the schools. Thus if they have not used all their spells and are not outclassed (example: opponent casting 7th level spells, when the sorc can only yet cast 6th level) they can always counterspell any spell with this combo. The legality of this practice has been verified by Sage who actually even was the one recommending it in Dragon magazine I think. This was also mentioned in one of the various FAQs at Wizards site. Sisyfos
sparkster4242 03-27-04, 03:45 AM	at one time the 3.0 FAQ included the Sage's ruling; he believed that the counter-a-spell action was always a standard action, and did not depend on the casting time of the spell involved. personally, i tend to agree. i believe that ruling was reversed later on, by someone who believes it takes as long to counter a spell as it does to cast it. under this ruling, there wouldnt be enough time to Heighten a spell and use it to spontaneously counter with it. by the way, being able to counter spells is nice ... but _casting_ spells instead can often end a fight faster :P
Sisyfos 03-27-04, 04:14 AM	Counterspell is an option. If you do not want to counter a spell you can always cast one. Also, we are talking about reactive countering combined with archmages mastery of counterspelling here, which turns the spell back at its caster. Why take a disintegrate and cast one when you can turn your opponent's disintegrate back at him without taking one? Sisyfos