Attack bonus optimization [Archive] - Wizards Community

Attack bonus optimization [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
endersdouble
01-06-07, 01:52 PM So, for a build I'm playing around with, I want to obtain an attack bonus (at level 20) of 150+, if possible. I don't need to have this 24/7, but the longer I can sustain it, the better. Is this feasible? Ideally, I'd like to do it without:
3.0
Setting-specific material
custom magic items
Psionics
FriendlyFrog
01-06-07, 02:00 PM Is there a specific reason you want it that high? It's a lot easier to make a character that can ignore armor, shield, natural armor, dexterity and dodge bonuses the enemy has, making hitting a childs play.
endersdouble
01-06-07, 02:03 PM Avalanche of blades. I need to pull off 25+ hits/use. In this case, I can assume a relatively low AC to begin with, so that's not a problem--but every four points of AB gives me another attack, so, well...
fricot_1
01-06-07, 02:15 PM isn't there a way to lower your AC to gain a higher AB?
Abulafia
01-06-07, 02:29 PM isn't there a way to lower your AC to gain a higher AB?
Combat expertise in reverse?
artaxerxes
01-06-07, 03:04 PM Shock Trooper allows this IIRC, AC for to hit bonuses.
Abulafia
01-06-07, 03:10 PM Shock Trooper allows this IIRC, AC for to hit bonuses.
Nope -- the AC penalty goes to damage, not to attack. Essentially, the feat lets you swap out the to-hit penalty for Power Attack to your AC.
DaveTheMagicWeasel
01-06-07, 03:19 PM Probably a gish build, for True Strike (unless you need it for all your attacks rather than just one), combined with Arcane Duelist (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20030224a) for Dexterous Attack would be a good place to start.

Then you can also Polymorph for a massive boost to your Strength. And if you use a Wu Jen base Giant Size can get your Strength even higher for more AB.

Or some sort of Hive-esque trick with Aid Another maybe?
Abulafia
01-06-07, 03:40 PM Then you can also Polymorph for a massive boost to your Strength. And if you use a Wu Jen base Giant Size can get your Strength even higher for more AB.
. . . and the accompanying size penalty.

Would it work better to P-morph into something smaller? Fine creatures have a +8 to attack, and the dex increases for small creatures mirror the str increases for big ones -- weapon finesse can help here.
fricot_1
01-06-07, 08:47 PM Still! I could swear theres something that works the opposite of Combat Expertise. Maybe it was in a Frenzied Berzerker build, they would lower their AC to improve their AB, which would be lowered in turn for massive damage output?
Im going to look for it and get back to you. Maybe I'm on crack though.
fricot_1
01-06-07, 08:56 PM does Shock Trooper fit the bill?
JaronK
01-06-07, 09:49 PM No, already mentioned and answered.

Polymorphing sounds like a good bet, along with Wraithstrike, both accessable to Gishes... but can you be a Gish and still access that manuever? And what about Sadism/Masochism?

JaronK
X-Codes
01-06-07, 10:12 PM Shock Trooper only works on a charge, and you can't charge and use Avalanche of Blades.

+150 is highly unlikely without obscene multiclassing, and big stuff like True Strike and Aid Another won't work for your purposes since they only affect a single attack.

Seriously, Nanobots could easily produce a roll in the high hundreds if not thousands, but only one such roll each round.

Why do you need to do 25+ attacks, anyway?
Caelic
01-06-07, 11:22 PM I believe you're thinking of the Warchanter's Inspire Recklessness ability.
Rathmun
01-06-07, 11:41 PM you can't get the full effect by level 20, but 'blood in the water' and 'aura of perfect order' coupled with the 'iron power' ability of the disciple of dissipater and improved critical will net you a cumulative +1 AB with every attack you make. (a 9-20 crit is obtainable, and with the aura making every roll an 11... well, you do the math.)

anyway, once you have that you can just keep spamming Avalanche of Blades and your AB will go up sickeningly round after round.

(a less potent version is possible by 20, but you can't have two stances without warblade 20.)

The only problem here is that DoD is 3.0, BOVD to be precise. I'm not sure how rigid the no 3.0 rule is but here's my :twocents: for what it's worth.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
endersdouble 01-06-07, 01:52 PM	So, for a build I'm playing around with, I want to obtain an attack bonus (at level 20) of 150+, if possible. I don't need to have this 24/7, but the longer I can sustain it, the better. Is this feasible? Ideally, I'd like to do it without: 3.0 Setting-specific material custom magic items Psionics
FriendlyFrog 01-06-07, 02:00 PM	Is there a specific reason you want it that high? It's a lot easier to make a character that can ignore armor, shield, natural armor, dexterity and dodge bonuses the enemy has, making hitting a childs play.
endersdouble 01-06-07, 02:03 PM	Avalanche of blades. I need to pull off 25+ hits/use. In this case, I can assume a relatively low AC to begin with, so that's not a problem--but every four points of AB gives me another attack, so, well...
fricot_1 01-06-07, 02:15 PM	isn't there a way to lower your AC to gain a higher AB?
Abulafia 01-06-07, 02:29 PM	isn't there a way to lower your AC to gain a higher AB? Combat expertise in reverse?
artaxerxes 01-06-07, 03:04 PM	Shock Trooper allows this IIRC, AC for to hit bonuses.
Abulafia 01-06-07, 03:10 PM	Shock Trooper allows this IIRC, AC for to hit bonuses. Nope -- the AC penalty goes to damage, not to attack. Essentially, the feat lets you swap out the to-hit penalty for Power Attack to your AC.
DaveTheMagicWeasel 01-06-07, 03:19 PM	Probably a gish build, for True Strike (unless you need it for all your attacks rather than just one), combined with Arcane Duelist (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20030224a) for Dexterous Attack would be a good place to start. Then you can also Polymorph for a massive boost to your Strength. And if you use a Wu Jen base Giant Size can get your Strength even higher for more AB. Or some sort of Hive-esque trick with Aid Another maybe?
Abulafia 01-06-07, 03:40 PM	Then you can also Polymorph for a massive boost to your Strength. And if you use a Wu Jen base Giant Size can get your Strength even higher for more AB. . . . and the accompanying size penalty. Would it work better to P-morph into something smaller? Fine creatures have a +8 to attack, and the dex increases for small creatures mirror the str increases for big ones -- weapon finesse can help here.
fricot_1 01-06-07, 08:47 PM	Still! I could swear theres something that works the opposite of Combat Expertise. Maybe it was in a Frenzied Berzerker build, they would lower their AC to improve their AB, which would be lowered in turn for massive damage output? Im going to look for it and get back to you. Maybe I'm on crack though.
fricot_1 01-06-07, 08:56 PM	does Shock Trooper fit the bill?
JaronK 01-06-07, 09:49 PM	No, already mentioned and answered. Polymorphing sounds like a good bet, along with Wraithstrike, both accessable to Gishes... but can you be a Gish and still access that manuever? And what about Sadism/Masochism? JaronK
X-Codes 01-06-07, 10:12 PM	Shock Trooper only works on a charge, and you can't charge and use Avalanche of Blades. +150 is highly unlikely without obscene multiclassing, and big stuff like True Strike and Aid Another won't work for your purposes since they only affect a single attack. Seriously, Nanobots could easily produce a roll in the high hundreds if not thousands, but only one such roll each round. Why do you need to do 25+ attacks, anyway?
Caelic 01-06-07, 11:22 PM	I believe you're thinking of the Warchanter's Inspire Recklessness ability.
Rathmun 01-06-07, 11:41 PM	you can't get the full effect by level 20, but 'blood in the water' and 'aura of perfect order' coupled with the 'iron power' ability of the disciple of dissipater and improved critical will net you a cumulative +1 AB with every attack you make. (a 9-20 crit is obtainable, and with the aura making every roll an 11... well, you do the math.) anyway, once you have that you can just keep spamming Avalanche of Blades and your AB will go up sickeningly round after round. (a less potent version is possible by 20, but you can't have two stances without warblade 20.) The only problem here is that DoD is 3.0, BOVD to be precise. I'm not sure how rigid the no 3.0 rule is but here's my :twocents: for what it's worth.