Avioding Dispel Magic [Archive] - Wizards Community

Avioding Dispel Magic [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ballekalle
11-15-04, 02:44 PM Hello.

I have found out that an Cleric / Wizard / Mystic Theurge / Incantantrix can be quite a nice buffer (using Persistant Spell to all buffs making them 24hours duration). Something like Cleric 3 / Wizard 3 / Mystic Theurge 10 / Incantantrix 4 would probably work quite nice. Possibly switching one level Incan towards Monk 1.

The only problem with this is that the character is extremly vulnerable to Dispel Magic and Greater Dispel Magic. The first thing that pops into my mind was, of course, spell immunity, but that only effect spells that allow SR. Then, I had Spell Turning, but because of its high level the enemy could simply use his area on dispel magic instead. Also, since Spell Turning is high level, the enemy will probably have more Dispel Magic or Greater Dispel Magic then I have Spell Turning.

Any ideas how to fix this? If it was to be fixed, I belive this build could be quite the monster. :D
UMiskatonic
11-15-04, 02:50 PM 1-ring of counterspells

2-take the counterspell feats yourself, and dispel his dispelling.

3-take the leadership feat, and take a archer cohort with a seeking bow whose purpose in life is to disrupt casters as they cast.

4-take divine metamagic-persistent spell. Then, heighten all your buff spells to give them a higher caster level, and use divine metamagic to make them persistent.

5-accept the fact that there is no unbeatable strategy.

Cheers,
Umiskatonic
ballekalle
11-15-04, 02:56 PM 4-take divine metamagic-persistent spell. Then, heighten all your buff spells to give them a higher caster level, and use divine metamagic to make them persistent.

Why would I want to do that?

I prefere not to counter his Dispel Magic's since I have such low caster level on most of my buff spells (CL 17 Wizard, CL 13 Cleric). I could use that carma bed wich raise my CL on divine spells by 2. I could also take a level in AcM and spell power to get +1 caster level on all spellcasting classes, but it's not worth it. I rather find a solution that stops the dispels.. Perhaps I could use Ring of Spell Turning, but is it worth 50k to buy it?
Rod Howard
11-15-04, 03:19 PM Why would I want to do that?

I prefere not to counter his Dispel Magic's since I have such low caster level on most of my buff spells (CL 17 Wizard, CL 13 Cleric). I could use that carma bed wich raise my CL on divine spells by 2. I could also take a level in AcM and spell power to get +1 caster level on all spellcasting classes, but it's not worth it. I rather find a solution that stops the dispels.. Perhaps I could use Ring of Spell Turning, but is it worth 50k to buy it?

Also, it doesn't stop spell-like abilities.
lupo58570
11-15-04, 05:00 PM if you want to stop targeted dispel, go with the Spellbane enchantment for your weapon from the Players Guide to Ferun. It is the best you are going to get for your $$ in terms of avoiding dispels. It does not help against area dispels, but they can only get one spell at a time, the targeted ones are much more dangerous.
Tealgorthian
11-15-04, 05:06 PM By the time you can blow 50K gold on a ring, you'll be more worried about MJD anyway.
Andaran
11-15-04, 06:14 PM Little correction to lupo58570: it's called "Spellblade" (page 120, 6000 gold).

Additionylly you also could take a familiar, cast a Dispel Magic spell and let your familiar hold it. If needed your familiar counters one Dispel Magic. So with Spellblade you have the chance to avoid 1 dispel/turn (and throw it back in the next turn) and with your familiar you get an additional chance to avoid one dispel try.

Now cast Spell Turning and they'll hate you.

1-2 dispel tries get turned with Spell Turning, after that 1 try/round get absorbed and thrown back one round later and if they try to dispel two times/round they get one back and one absorbed.
Guess after that they'll give it up. :D
carnivore
11-15-04, 06:21 PM mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry.

dispel and greater dispel magic work differently...they are compared to the caster level+11 of the spell to be dispelled. so if you want to boost you spells resistance to dispells ....boost your caster level:

create magic tatoo:+1 caster lvl
orange ioun stone:+1 caster lvl
bead of karma:+4 caster lvl(only 10 min, but thats when you cast all your buffs anyway)
candle of invocation:+2 caster lvl for all aspects including spells of a higher level than you normally have access to.

MT has a nice buffing ability if you mainly use your divine Buff spells(they are usually better anyway)

try it :D
epchristi
11-15-04, 07:41 PM On top of the other items listed before, I would like to add an additional
ring of counter spell. (Two rings of counter spell.) One with dispel magic, the other with greater dispel magic.

That at least saves you one round and helps you identify who did it.
(have a good spellcraft skill check)

Ring of spell turning is the only one that has a "lasting effect"..
and at least you can replace the dispel magic or greater dispel
in the ring should it get used up.
Kessalin Talira
11-15-04, 08:16 PM mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry.

By the spell description, MDJ doesn't ask for a will save from the PC, it goes right past him and hits all his gear. You make a will save for each piece of magical equipment you have, or it's disjoined. Granted, it gets to use your save modifier if that one's higher, but there's still a LOT more than one save per PC involved.

It's not THAT weak, or it'd be unusable.

If you want to protect against dispel effects, I would suggest the Spellblade enhancement set to greater dispel magic, and a ring of counterspells with dispel magic in it. The ring you can refill with a wand, and you won't have enough 7th level slots to pack a bunch of greater dispels to recharge a ring set to that, so eliminate the problem with a spellblade.
ballekalle
11-16-04, 09:55 AM Ty for all replies! :D

I think going Spellblade and using Ring of Counterspells would be worth it. Not that expensive, and they work well. Also, I don't need thatr much equipment since I got spells to buff me up anyways.

As I said, ty all for the nice replies! :D
iN.fuSioN
11-16-04, 01:21 PM You can use a Ring of Greater Counterspelling to avoid MDJ. It costs 16k and works like a standard ring of counterspelling, except that it counterspells area effects too, making you protected against mords. This ring is also very good when you are targeted with a (Greater) Dispelling Screen.

Contingency is also a good way to avoid a dispel magic.

Spellblade and ring of counterspelling also work great, as stated by other replies.

You should also realize that as long as you try to avoid being seen as a powerful spellcaster (or one buffed up the wazoo) the enemy spellcasters will avoid dispelling you and targeting the dispel on a more obvious target. Dressing like a ranger, for instance, could aid you. Otherwise, the enemy spellcasters will have to wait for one round or two to realize you are a powerful spellcaster or have a detect magic/arcane sight on to see that you have multiple auras on yourself.
Agitator1
11-16-04, 06:29 PM What book is the Ring of Greater Counterspelling and bead of karma in?
epchristi
11-16-04, 10:37 PM What book is the Ring of Greater Counterspelling and bead of karma in?

The "bead of karma" is found in the DMG as a "strand of prayer beads.".. page 267 DMG 3.5.

Ring of counterspells is on page 231 of the DMG. It allows up to 6th level spells to be countered. (I haven't seen a ring of greater counterspelling..)
Snicker-Snack
11-16-04, 10:48 PM Ring of counterspells is on page 231 of the DMG. It allows up to 6th level spells to be countered. (I haven't seen a ring of greater counterspelling..)

IIRC, The Ring of Greater Counterspelling is from A&EG. It also has the benefit of allowing spells of higher than 6th level to be stored.
Sildrin
11-19-04, 10:14 AM mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry.

dispel and greater dispel magic work differently...they are compared to the caster level+11 of the spell to be dispelled. so if you want to boost you spells resistance to dispells ....boost your caster level:

create magic tatoo:+1 caster lvl
orange ioun stone:+1 caster lvl
bead of karma:+4 caster lvl(only 10 min, but thats when you cast all your buffs anyway)
candle of invocation:+2 caster lvl for all aspects including spells of a higher level than you normally have access to.

MT has a nice buffing ability if you mainly use your divine Buff spells(they are usually better anyway)

try it :D

Hello,
where do I find the "candle of invocation"?
Sildrin

Updated: Found it already =)
I love crystalkeep.com. Its really a help to have so many pdfs listing the useful informations.
Somehow I guess my MT should take a "create" feat. I jst dont have so much gold to buy all those shiny items I want to have =)

Sildrin
carnivore
11-19-04, 10:19 AM look here in the SRD

http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/magicItemsWI.html

Candle of Invocation: Each of these special tapers is dedicated to one of the nine alignments. Simply burning the candle generates a favorable aura for the individual so doing if the candle’s alignment matches that of the character. Characters of the same alignment as the burning candle add a +2 morale bonus on attack rolls, saving throws, and skill checks while within 30 feet of the flame.

A cleric whose alignment matches the candle’s operates as if two levels higher for purposes of determining spells per day if he burns the candle during or just prior to his spell preparation time. He can even cast spells normally unavailable to him, as if he were of that higher level, but only so long as the candle continues to burn. Except in special cases (see below), a candle burns for 4 hours.

In addition, burning a candle also allows the owner to cast a gate spell, the respondent being of the same alignment as the candle, but the taper is immediately consumed in the process. It is possible to extinguish the candle simply by blowing it out, so users often place it in a lantern to protect it from drafts and the like. Doing this doesn’t interfere with its magical properties.

Strong conjuration; CL 17th; Craft Wondrous Item, gate, creator must be same alignment as candle created; Price 8,400 gp;Weight 1/2 lb.

:D
JosephKell
11-19-04, 12:32 PM 5-accept the fact that there is no unbeatable strategy.There is an unbeatable strategy: Play smart, be lucky, don't be afraid to run away screaming like a five year old child.
carnivore
11-19-04, 12:43 PM that was my battle cry "run awayyyyyyy" ;)
Kayerloth
11-19-04, 12:44 PM It is in the A&EG. Potent item ... it counterspells the spell it contains anytime it is cast within, IIRC, 90 feet of it. The drawback is this means you and other members of your party can get counterspelled by the Ring making it difficult for you to use Disjunction as well (or whatever you have stored in the Ring).

Kayerloth
Iku Rex
11-19-04, 03:28 PM Hello.

I have found out that an Cleric / Wizard / Mystic Theurge / Incantantrix can be quite a nice buffer (using Persistant Spell to all buffs making them 24hours duration). Something like Cleric 3 / Wizard 3 / Mystic Theurge 10 / Incantantrix 4 would probably work quite nice. Possibly switching one level Incan towards Monk 1. Great minds think alike. :eek: (Check the contest thread in a few hours/a day at the most.) Only don't waste a level on monk.

One good way to avoid targetted dispels is to be invisible. If they can't see you, they can't target you.
iN.fuSioN
11-19-04, 03:55 PM Why bother with protecting yourself against dispel? CA brought a new feat that when making a melee attack against someone you can ignore ALL magical bonuses to AC and dispel them if you do damage. Btw, no chance to ever avoid that (except if the attacker rolls 1).

Beautiful sense of balance, really.
PhaedrusXY
11-19-04, 03:58 PM mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry.Sorry if I'm hijacking a bit, but MDJ only allows a Will save for seeing if it destroys your items or not. It automatically ends all ongoing spell effects within it's area. No save, no caster check, no nothing. spells and spell-like effects are separated into their individual components (ending the effect as a dispel magic spell does), and each permanent magic item must make a successful Will save or be turned into a normal item. Also notice the save line says: Will negates (object).

So yeah, it is alot tougher to protect yourself vs. MDJ rather than Greater Dispel. You basically need contingencies or just to make it so they can't see you (tough when at that level almost everyone runs around with True Seeing).
carnivore
11-19-04, 05:06 PM thank you PhaedrusXY, i stand corrected :embarrass

oh well

to keep people from seeing you,...Hide works great :P
xerofire
11-19-04, 05:14 PM So yeah, it is alot tougher to protect yourself vs. MDJ rather than Greater Dispel. You basically need contingencies or just to make it so they can't see you (tough when at that level almost everyone runs around with True Seeing).

not if you run around with mind blank! :D True seeing is divination that reveals where you are, i think that qualifies as gathering information on where you are. And since MindBlank (one of the BEST spells EVER) protects against anyone ever learning stuff about you you are invisible to people with improved invis (or stalking spell...) and invisible to divination with mind blank, so together you become..... SUPER INVISIBLE!!!! Blasts away with impunity and Improved blink yourself or ghost for just for added insult, you can't target me with a dispel if I'm hiding invisible behind a rock wall on the ethreal plane.......And you wont be affected by a lucky MDJ unless they took that transdimensional spell meta feat....

or rather than blinky/ghostness Lutzaens frequent jaunt is fun to keep poping around unexpectedly
Go Doctrine Mobility and Stealth

::EDIT:I wish the posting program had a spell check option.....::: :rolleyes:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ballekalle 11-15-04, 02:44 PM	Hello. I have found out that an Cleric / Wizard / Mystic Theurge / Incantantrix can be quite a nice buffer (using Persistant Spell to all buffs making them 24hours duration). Something like Cleric 3 / Wizard 3 / Mystic Theurge 10 / Incantantrix 4 would probably work quite nice. Possibly switching one level Incan towards Monk 1. The only problem with this is that the character is extremly vulnerable to Dispel Magic and Greater Dispel Magic. The first thing that pops into my mind was, of course, spell immunity, but that only effect spells that allow SR. Then, I had Spell Turning, but because of its high level the enemy could simply use his area on dispel magic instead. Also, since Spell Turning is high level, the enemy will probably have more Dispel Magic or Greater Dispel Magic then I have Spell Turning. Any ideas how to fix this? If it was to be fixed, I belive this build could be quite the monster. :D
UMiskatonic 11-15-04, 02:50 PM	1-ring of counterspells 2-take the counterspell feats yourself, and dispel his dispelling. 3-take the leadership feat, and take a archer cohort with a seeking bow whose purpose in life is to disrupt casters as they cast. 4-take divine metamagic-persistent spell. Then, heighten all your buff spells to give them a higher caster level, and use divine metamagic to make them persistent. 5-accept the fact that there is no unbeatable strategy. Cheers, Umiskatonic
ballekalle 11-15-04, 02:56 PM	4-take divine metamagic-persistent spell. Then, heighten all your buff spells to give them a higher caster level, and use divine metamagic to make them persistent. Why would I want to do that? I prefere not to counter his Dispel Magic's since I have such low caster level on most of my buff spells (CL 17 Wizard, CL 13 Cleric). I could use that carma bed wich raise my CL on divine spells by 2. I could also take a level in AcM and spell power to get +1 caster level on all spellcasting classes, but it's not worth it. I rather find a solution that stops the dispels.. Perhaps I could use Ring of Spell Turning, but is it worth 50k to buy it?
Rod Howard 11-15-04, 03:19 PM	Why would I want to do that? I prefere not to counter his Dispel Magic's since I have such low caster level on most of my buff spells (CL 17 Wizard, CL 13 Cleric). I could use that carma bed wich raise my CL on divine spells by 2. I could also take a level in AcM and spell power to get +1 caster level on all spellcasting classes, but it's not worth it. I rather find a solution that stops the dispels.. Perhaps I could use Ring of Spell Turning, but is it worth 50k to buy it? Also, it doesn't stop spell-like abilities.
lupo58570 11-15-04, 05:00 PM	if you want to stop targeted dispel, go with the Spellbane enchantment for your weapon from the Players Guide to Ferun. It is the best you are going to get for your $$ in terms of avoiding dispels. It does not help against area dispels, but they can only get one spell at a time, the targeted ones are much more dangerous.
Tealgorthian 11-15-04, 05:06 PM	By the time you can blow 50K gold on a ring, you'll be more worried about MJD anyway.
Andaran 11-15-04, 06:14 PM	Little correction to lupo58570: it's called "Spellblade" (page 120, 6000 gold). Additionylly you also could take a familiar, cast a Dispel Magic spell and let your familiar hold it. If needed your familiar counters one Dispel Magic. So with Spellblade you have the chance to avoid 1 dispel/turn (and throw it back in the next turn) and with your familiar you get an additional chance to avoid one dispel try. Now cast Spell Turning and they'll hate you. 1-2 dispel tries get turned with Spell Turning, after that 1 try/round get absorbed and thrown back one round later and if they try to dispel two times/round they get one back and one absorbed. Guess after that they'll give it up. :D
carnivore 11-15-04, 06:21 PM	mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry. dispel and greater dispel magic work differently...they are compared to the caster level+11 of the spell to be dispelled. so if you want to boost you spells resistance to dispells ....boost your caster level: create magic tatoo:+1 caster lvl orange ioun stone:+1 caster lvl bead of karma:+4 caster lvl(only 10 min, but thats when you cast all your buffs anyway) candle of invocation:+2 caster lvl for all aspects including spells of a higher level than you normally have access to. MT has a nice buffing ability if you mainly use your divine Buff spells(they are usually better anyway) try it :D
epchristi 11-15-04, 07:41 PM	On top of the other items listed before, I would like to add an additional ring of counter spell. (Two rings of counter spell.) One with dispel magic, the other with greater dispel magic. That at least saves you one round and helps you identify who did it. (have a good spellcraft skill check) Ring of spell turning is the only one that has a "lasting effect".. and at least you can replace the dispel magic or greater dispel in the ring should it get used up.
Kessalin Talira 11-15-04, 08:16 PM	mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry. By the spell description, MDJ doesn't ask for a will save from the PC, it goes right past him and hits all his gear. You make a will save for each piece of magical equipment you have, or it's disjoined. Granted, it gets to use your save modifier if that one's higher, but there's still a LOT more than one save per PC involved. It's not THAT weak, or it'd be unusable. If you want to protect against dispel effects, I would suggest the Spellblade enhancement set to greater dispel magic, and a ring of counterspells with dispel magic in it. The ring you can refill with a wand, and you won't have enough 7th level slots to pack a bunch of greater dispels to recharge a ring set to that, so eliminate the problem with a spellblade.
ballekalle 11-16-04, 09:55 AM	Ty for all replies! :D I think going Spellblade and using Ring of Counterspells would be worth it. Not that expensive, and they work well. Also, I don't need thatr much equipment since I got spells to buff me up anyways. As I said, ty all for the nice replies! :D
iN.fuSioN 11-16-04, 01:21 PM	You can use a Ring of Greater Counterspelling to avoid MDJ. It costs 16k and works like a standard ring of counterspelling, except that it counterspells area effects too, making you protected against mords. This ring is also very good when you are targeted with a (Greater) Dispelling Screen. Contingency is also a good way to avoid a dispel magic. Spellblade and ring of counterspelling also work great, as stated by other replies. You should also realize that as long as you try to avoid being seen as a powerful spellcaster (or one buffed up the wazoo) the enemy spellcasters will avoid dispelling you and targeting the dispel on a more obvious target. Dressing like a ranger, for instance, could aid you. Otherwise, the enemy spellcasters will have to wait for one round or two to realize you are a powerful spellcaster or have a detect magic/arcane sight on to see that you have multiple auras on yourself.
Agitator1 11-16-04, 06:29 PM	What book is the Ring of Greater Counterspelling and bead of karma in?
epchristi 11-16-04, 10:37 PM	What book is the Ring of Greater Counterspelling and bead of karma in? The "bead of karma" is found in the DMG as a "strand of prayer beads.".. page 267 DMG 3.5. Ring of counterspells is on page 231 of the DMG. It allows up to 6th level spells to be countered. (I haven't seen a ring of greater counterspelling..)
Snicker-Snack 11-16-04, 10:48 PM	Ring of counterspells is on page 231 of the DMG. It allows up to 6th level spells to be countered. (I haven't seen a ring of greater counterspelling..) IIRC, The Ring of Greater Counterspelling is from A&EG. It also has the benefit of allowing spells of higher than 6th level to be stored.
Sildrin 11-19-04, 10:14 AM	mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry. dispel and greater dispel magic work differently...they are compared to the caster level+11 of the spell to be dispelled. so if you want to boost you spells resistance to dispells ....boost your caster level: create magic tatoo:+1 caster lvl orange ioun stone:+1 caster lvl bead of karma:+4 caster lvl(only 10 min, but thats when you cast all your buffs anyway) candle of invocation:+2 caster lvl for all aspects including spells of a higher level than you normally have access to. MT has a nice buffing ability if you mainly use your divine Buff spells(they are usually better anyway) try it :D Hello, where do I find the "candle of invocation"? Sildrin Updated: Found it already =) I love crystalkeep.com. Its really a help to have so many pdfs listing the useful informations. Somehow I guess my MT should take a "create" feat. I jst dont have so much gold to buy all those shiny items I want to have =) Sildrin
carnivore 11-19-04, 10:19 AM	look here in the SRD http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/magicItemsWI.html Candle of Invocation: Each of these special tapers is dedicated to one of the nine alignments. Simply burning the candle generates a favorable aura for the individual so doing if the candle’s alignment matches that of the character. Characters of the same alignment as the burning candle add a +2 morale bonus on attack rolls, saving throws, and skill checks while within 30 feet of the flame. A cleric whose alignment matches the candle’s operates as if two levels higher for purposes of determining spells per day if he burns the candle during or just prior to his spell preparation time. He can even cast spells normally unavailable to him, as if he were of that higher level, but only so long as the candle continues to burn. Except in special cases (see below), a candle burns for 4 hours. In addition, burning a candle also allows the owner to cast a gate spell, the respondent being of the same alignment as the candle, but the taper is immediately consumed in the process. It is possible to extinguish the candle simply by blowing it out, so users often place it in a lantern to protect it from drafts and the like. Doing this doesn’t interfere with its magical properties. Strong conjuration; CL 17th; Craft Wondrous Item, gate, creator must be same alignment as candle created; Price 8,400 gp;Weight 1/2 lb. :D
JosephKell 11-19-04, 12:32 PM	5-accept the fact that there is no unbeatable strategy.There is an unbeatable strategy: Play smart, be lucky, don't be afraid to run away screaming like a five year old child.
carnivore 11-19-04, 12:43 PM	that was my battle cry "run awayyyyyyy" ;)
Kayerloth 11-19-04, 12:44 PM	It is in the A&EG. Potent item ... it counterspells the spell it contains anytime it is cast within, IIRC, 90 feet of it. The drawback is this means you and other members of your party can get counterspelled by the Ring making it difficult for you to use Disjunction as well (or whatever you have stored in the Ring). Kayerloth
Iku Rex 11-19-04, 03:28 PM	Hello. I have found out that an Cleric / Wizard / Mystic Theurge / Incantantrix can be quite a nice buffer (using Persistant Spell to all buffs making them 24hours duration). Something like Cleric 3 / Wizard 3 / Mystic Theurge 10 / Incantantrix 4 would probably work quite nice. Possibly switching one level Incan towards Monk 1. Great minds think alike. :eek: (Check the contest thread in a few hours/a day at the most.) Only don't waste a level on monk. One good way to avoid targetted dispels is to be invisible. If they can't see you, they can't target you.
iN.fuSioN 11-19-04, 03:55 PM	Why bother with protecting yourself against dispel? CA brought a new feat that when making a melee attack against someone you can ignore ALL magical bonuses to AC and dispel them if you do damage. Btw, no chance to ever avoid that (except if the attacker rolls 1). Beautiful sense of balance, really.
PhaedrusXY 11-19-04, 03:58 PM	mrod disjunction is actually a weak effect compared to greater dispel, from this perspective..........MDJ allows a will save to negate, at this level there are lots of things you can do to make your will save..if you make yours so do all the items you carry.Sorry if I'm hijacking a bit, but MDJ only allows a Will save for seeing if it destroys your items or not. It automatically ends all ongoing spell effects within it's area. No save, no caster check, no nothing. spells and spell-like effects are separated into their individual components (ending the effect as a dispel magic spell does), and each permanent magic item must make a successful Will save or be turned into a normal item. Also notice the save line says: Will negates (object). So yeah, it is alot tougher to protect yourself vs. MDJ rather than Greater Dispel. You basically need contingencies or just to make it so they can't see you (tough when at that level almost everyone runs around with True Seeing).
carnivore 11-19-04, 05:06 PM	thank you PhaedrusXY, i stand corrected :embarrass oh well to keep people from seeing you,...Hide works great :P
xerofire 11-19-04, 05:14 PM	So yeah, it is alot tougher to protect yourself vs. MDJ rather than Greater Dispel. You basically need contingencies or just to make it so they can't see you (tough when at that level almost everyone runs around with True Seeing). not if you run around with mind blank! :D True seeing is divination that reveals where you are, i think that qualifies as gathering information on where you are. And since MindBlank (one of the BEST spells EVER) protects against anyone ever learning stuff about you you are invisible to people with improved invis (or stalking spell...) and invisible to divination with mind blank, so together you become..... SUPER INVISIBLE!!!! Blasts away with impunity and Improved blink yourself or ghost for just for added insult, you can't target me with a dispel if I'm hiding invisible behind a rock wall on the ethreal plane.......And you wont be affected by a lucky MDJ unless they took that transdimensional spell meta feat.... or rather than blinky/ghostness Lutzaens frequent jaunt is fun to keep poping around unexpectedly Go Doctrine Mobility and Stealth ::EDIT:I wish the posting program had a spell check option.....::: :rolleyes: