Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Gru 12-18-06, 09:13 AM	I have a human Cleric of Lathander 8/Morninglord 7 with WIS 26 and CHA 22, and in a few levels I want to multiclass him into either a Ranger or a Bard. The concept is that my character is a lightly armored guy who is heavy on the spellcasting side, with a lot of conseptual feats (Skill Focus: Sense Motive and Negotiator, among others). He is neutral good, exalted, and lately he's been somewhat of a contemplative wandering do-gooder. Our adventuring group lacks both a real good forest-type guy AND a social skill guy. The spellcasting abilities of the Bards and Rangers is not really why I'm considering these classes - it's mainly the choice selection of class skills, skill points, and save boosters. My character has a (very) poor Ref save. In short, I think both Bard and Ranger fit the concept, I just can't choose.
Tomada 12-18-06, 09:34 AM	Hum... BARD: d6 HD 6+int skills a few cantrips bardic music (very limited) bardic knoledge (again, limited) Ref and Will as good saves and a few weapon proficiencies, including the exotic weapon prof, whip. The bard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge (all skills, taken individually) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Speak Language (None), Spellcraft (Int), Swim (Str), Tumble (Dex), and Use Magic Device (Cha). RANGER: d8, HD 6+int skills track martial weap, prof wild empathy favored enemy Fort and Ref as good saves The ranger’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge (dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (geography) (Int), Knowledge (nature) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Search (Int), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), and Use Rope (Dex). now, if you want a party spokesperson, then bard is better, because most interaction skills are cross class for rangers. Now, if you need someone to scout, the ranger is your man, because he get's spot AND listen as class skills and better HD, more weapon profs and track. What do you need more? A forest guy or a skill guy? This should weight your decision...
Bill Bisco: Average Adventurer 12-18-06, 09:38 AM	Hmm, perhaps Bard so that you can go into Fochulan Lyrist, but really, can't you just stay Cleric and grab the Track Feat and perhaps some special thing to get the necessary skills you need? Perhaps Contemplative for the Travel Domain?
Gru 12-18-06, 09:45 AM	Hmm, perhaps Bard so that you can go into Fochulan Lyrist, but really, can't you just stay Cleric and grab the Track Feat and perhaps some special thing to get the necessary skills you need? Perhaps Contemplative for the Travel Domain? I don't get that many feats, and with a multiclass character my choices are limited, since I would want the Practiced Spellcaster feat to get ahead on my Caster Level checks. I won't want to become a Fochluan Lyrist if I get massive XP penalties for multiclassing. And I won't get the Travel domain from Contemplative because that domain isn't a Lathander domain. What I'm stuck on is what skills I need the most. I'm already easily the best scout in the group due to my light armor and good wisdom score. I'm also easily already the best party spokesperson because I'm the only one with a Diplomacy skill totaling over +10.
DaveTheMagicWeasel 12-18-06, 09:53 AM	I think I'd recommend Human Paragon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/racialParagonClasses.htm#humanParagon). That way you can pick the social skills you want, plus survival, and use the bonus feat for Track. It also means you can still advance Cleric casting. What are the rest of your stats and feats?
Gru 12-18-06, 10:14 AM	I think I'd recommend Human Paragon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/racialParagonClasses.htm#humanParagon). (...) What are the rest of your stats and feats? Aww, I'm afraid my DM won't allow this Human Paragon thing in his game. But thanks anyway! My stats are: Str 13, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 12, Wis 26, Cha 22 (this includes boosters). Feats: Combat Casting, Negotiator, Improved Turning, Skill Focus: Sense Motive, Craft Magic Arms & Armor, Sacred Vow, Intuitive Attack (the last two are Exalted feats).
PhoenixInferno 12-18-06, 12:13 PM	Harper Agent (Player's Guide to Faerun)? You've already got Negotiator and you probably meet the skill requirements. And as a pretty high level, good-aligned adventurer, you've likely encountered Harpers once or twice already. The upside is 6+INT skills and 4/5 Cleric spellcasting. I wouldn't worry too much about a weak Reflex save - of the 3, its the one least likely to auto-kill you if you fail it.
Gru 12-19-06, 09:30 AM	I might sound a little difficult now, guys, but I'm not looking for another class to multiclass in. I think it should be Ranger or Bard. I just can't decide which one. For the record I looked up Harper Agent, but it doesn't fit my concept in terms of my character being un-organized by choice and it gives a save boost on the one save I really, really don't need boosted as I already have two classes with Will save as the best save AND a Wis of 26. My poor Ref save has nearly killed me several times over, however... due to few HP (I roll HP like a donkey in a snow storm).
PhoenixInferno 12-19-06, 12:28 PM	My poor Ref save has nearly killed me several times over, however... due to few HP (I roll HP like a donkey in a snow storm).You should get over half your HP from your CON mod alone. If you have less than a 14 at 15th level, you need to fix that ASAP.