Bard's combat position [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bard's combat position [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Arminel
04-17-06, 07:51 PM Race: Gray Elf
Class: Bard
Level: 5

Str: 10
Dex: 20
Con: 8
Int: 18
Wis: 16
Cha: 19 (21)
Hp: 25 (I got damn lucky here)
Ac: 20

Skills: (All maxed except for two)
Bluff
Hide
Listen
Move Silently
Perform (Lute)
Search
Sense Motive
Sleight of Hand (5 ranks)
Spellcraft (5 ranks)
Spot
Tumble
Use Magic Device

Feats:
Point Blank Shot
Weapon Finesse

Spells Known:
Level-0: Ghost Sound, Detect Magic, Lullaby, Songbird, Prestigidation, Resistance
Level-1: Identify, Comprehend Languages Sleep, Improvisation (modified a bit by DM, but its cool)
Level-2: Invisibility, Sound Burst, Alter Self

Notable Gear:
Rapier of Spell-Storing
Mw Comp. Longbow
Wand of Cure Light Wounds (45/50c)
Masterwork Lute
Amulet of Protection +1 (works like the Ring)
Ring of Feather Fall
Glamor Cloak of Charisma +2 (Shiny gold with a purple note on it, turns normal when you put it on)
Mw Studded Leather Armor
Darkwood Buckler
2 Bags of Caltrops
3 Bags of Marbles
2 Scrolls of Inspirational Boost
2 Scrolls of Locate Object (Party-owned)
2 Scrolls of Mount (Party-owned)
2 Scrolls of Grease
3 Alchemist's Fire
3 Anti-Toxin Vials (I don't trust the group's Rogue)
~500gp

Basically my Bard's current position is Archer + Singing + Sleep/Sound Burst. The Grease scrolls have been well used to keep annoying characters off their feet and the Alchemist's Fire for making Grease-covered characters look like Fire Elementals xD.

Now the thing is due to the storyline I'll get to change my skills, feats, and spells. I also get a feat next level which I want to be Disguise Spell. Any suggestions? I thought about replacing Weapon Finesse with Precise Shot, Spellcraft with Diplomacy, and take some ranks out of some and get Gather Information. I don't want the +2 Knowledge (History) bonus for Bardic Knowledge, but what spells could make me more useful? I was thinking of replacing Sound Burst with Major Image for fun (especially when our Sorcerer has a Wand of Acid Arrow and 4 Scorching Rays per day).
PhoenixInferno
04-17-06, 08:17 PM Looks like a good plan, although why in the WORLD do you not want the Know(History) synergy bonus to Bardic Knowledge?
X-Codes
04-17-06, 08:28 PM Your character has 10 skill ranks more than the maximum he could possibly have at this level.
Saion2014
04-17-06, 08:30 PM Yeah, you have your position about right; bards aren't meant to be arcane arsenals (particularly if you have a trigger-happy dragonblood with you). If you want bardic empowerment, there are several interesting spells in the Complete Adventurer. Go with illusions and charms. Out of third level spells, Glibness will probably be very useful to you. Also, Ventriloquism can be pretty handy; if you place it far enough away, then all of the spells that you cast are effectively Silent for its duration (particularly useful during infiltration). Finally, Shatter is an infinitely useful spell.

P.S. By placing the Ventriloquism hint in my post, I am in no way claiming that it is my own creation. Some other person came up with it, and I thought it relevant for your character.
ravenkith
04-17-06, 09:07 PM Bard + combat position?

:heehee :rofl:
= :ghosted:
thorian
04-17-06, 11:06 PM You may want to consider taking the Faerie Mysteries Initiate feat (Dragon #319). It will allow you to apply your INT mod instead of your CON mod to your HP. That doubles your current HP at this time, and nets you 5 extra HP per level based on your present attributes.
DM_Greatness
04-17-06, 11:44 PM Oddly enough I have a Bard player in my Campaign. Although she is only 2nd level, she has already started to notice the joy of using the Grease spell, and then following it up with Alchy Fire....

It must be something about the bard class that attracts them to fire :mage:

She's a human bard, as opposed to Elvish like yours. Short bows will never match the power of your recurve Long bow, so she relies on her Whip from the back row for Tripping, Disarming, and Lashing characters.

The only items of note that this bard has are
- Studded Leather
- Brass Tipped Weighted Whip (damage as a whip-dagger, 1d6)
- Wand of Magic Missiles at 3rd level, Slight of Handed off of her Magic Teacher (has to roll a 20 on UMD)
- 2 scrolls of Cure light wounds, that were Scribed from the party's cleric

And most of the time she really prefers to float in the back of the party. Here is what I've seen so far.
- She will Daze people far stronger than her, gladly giving up her turn to take theirs away
- Assist the front row with Whip lashing/Trips/Disarms
- Draw the longsword and 'yelp' for help when engaged in melee
- Grease when it seems to be good. I already know she is willing to Grease right where she is at, and hoping her Reflexs will carry her though, and hoping clumsy people in heavy armor will fall
- Smash people with Oil whenever the party seems to be clear out of the slash radius
- Sing her little heart out from the back
- Perform as a set of eyes and ears, and back up healer

Her stats aren't as high as yours, because we use the 25 point buy, and I tend to run a much magic lower game than most others, but so far, the Bard really is pulling her own weight in the combats. It is an amazing class.

In one of the fights she was already in a tree plinking at a bear with her wee shortbow, and then when the bear started to climb up the tree to eat a Bard Sandwich, she whiped the branch of another tree, swung away, and then climbed up her whip into that different tree. It had a nice feeling to it; Like something that I could almost do myself in my backyard.

I almost think that the whip is the true calling card to the Bard's melee combat. Not so much for you, but for setting up AoO for the rest of your party, and really protecting your party from the ammont the damage they would take in a round

The class seems endlessly fun because my Bard PC has to juggle using her Singing, Longsword, Whip, Wand, Oil, Tumbling, Spells, and soon to come instrument (When she gets one that is better in effect than just singing). Honest to God, that bard needs to take a cold, hard look at the Quick Draw feat.

Something I was considering, becaus she has to take Alchemy as a skill in order to get her Smokesticks, and Flaming Oil, is boosting the Oil damage to 1d8 instead of 1d6 to reflect her skill in Alchemy. You might want to talk to your DM and see if he would work with you in the same manner.

Something else I was considering was allowing one whip attack during the casting of Sound Burst when she gets high enough level. The Bard is lots of fun and support, but is still a little low on the Damage Output side (and the should be). However, I think have a Huge Thunderbooming crack of the whip, doing the 1d6 damage of the whip if it hit, plus the Sound Burst effect centered on the target of the whip, isn't unbalancing at all, and would be great fun for the game.
Arminel
04-18-06, 02:24 AM Yeah, you have your position about right; bards aren't meant to be arcane arsenals (particularly if you have a trigger-happy dragonblood with you). If you want bardic empowerment, there are several interesting spells in the Complete Adventurer. Go with illusions and charms. Out of third level spells, Glibness will probably be very useful to you. Also, Ventriloquism can be pretty handy; if you place it far enough away, then all of the spells that you cast are effectively Silent for its duration (particularly useful during infiltration). Finally, Shatter is an infinitely useful spell.

P.S. By placing the Ventriloquism hint in my post, I am in no way claiming that it is my own creation. Some other person came up with it, and I thought it relevant for your character.

Great suggestion, and Glibness will be my best friend. I thought Brew Potion would be fun to take, making potions of Invisibility, Improvisation (doubtful), Glibness, Alter Self (predetermined), and then for those I don't like Sleep and Sound Burst :eek:. I've looked in the Complete Adventurer and very much liked what I saw. I heard with the Lute I can play one bardic song while I sing another (from my DM, so it is permittable) which would be cool. Inspire Courage + Countersong = Fighter's Best Friend.

What about Weapon Finesse? Because my DM says that Weapon Finesse applies to all weapons you are proficient with because he argues that you're not proficient with using one weapon with grace but rather a style of fighting all-together that implements it. Would Precise Shot be needed with the whip? And would Point Blank Shot work? Because it is a Ranged Melee weapon >.>

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Arminel 04-17-06, 07:51 PM	Race: Gray Elf Class: Bard Level: 5 Str: 10 Dex: 20 Con: 8 Int: 18 Wis: 16 Cha: 19 (21) Hp: 25 (I got damn lucky here) Ac: 20 Skills: (All maxed except for two) Bluff Hide Listen Move Silently Perform (Lute) Search Sense Motive Sleight of Hand (5 ranks) Spellcraft (5 ranks) Spot Tumble Use Magic Device Feats: Point Blank Shot Weapon Finesse Spells Known: Level-0: Ghost Sound, Detect Magic, Lullaby, Songbird, Prestigidation, Resistance Level-1: Identify, Comprehend Languages Sleep, Improvisation (modified a bit by DM, but its cool) Level-2: Invisibility, Sound Burst, Alter Self Notable Gear: Rapier of Spell-Storing Mw Comp. Longbow Wand of Cure Light Wounds (45/50c) Masterwork Lute Amulet of Protection +1 (works like the Ring) Ring of Feather Fall Glamor Cloak of Charisma +2 (Shiny gold with a purple note on it, turns normal when you put it on) Mw Studded Leather Armor Darkwood Buckler 2 Bags of Caltrops 3 Bags of Marbles 2 Scrolls of Inspirational Boost 2 Scrolls of Locate Object (Party-owned) 2 Scrolls of Mount (Party-owned) 2 Scrolls of Grease 3 Alchemist's Fire 3 Anti-Toxin Vials (I don't trust the group's Rogue) ~500gp Basically my Bard's current position is Archer + Singing + Sleep/Sound Burst. The Grease scrolls have been well used to keep annoying characters off their feet and the Alchemist's Fire for making Grease-covered characters look like Fire Elementals xD. Now the thing is due to the storyline I'll get to change my skills, feats, and spells. I also get a feat next level which I want to be Disguise Spell. Any suggestions? I thought about replacing Weapon Finesse with Precise Shot, Spellcraft with Diplomacy, and take some ranks out of some and get Gather Information. I don't want the +2 Knowledge (History) bonus for Bardic Knowledge, but what spells could make me more useful? I was thinking of replacing Sound Burst with Major Image for fun (especially when our Sorcerer has a Wand of Acid Arrow and 4 Scorching Rays per day).
PhoenixInferno 04-17-06, 08:17 PM	Looks like a good plan, although why in the WORLD do you not want the Know(History) synergy bonus to Bardic Knowledge?
X-Codes 04-17-06, 08:28 PM	Your character has 10 skill ranks more than the maximum he could possibly have at this level.
Saion2014 04-17-06, 08:30 PM	Yeah, you have your position about right; bards aren't meant to be arcane arsenals (particularly if you have a trigger-happy dragonblood with you). If you want bardic empowerment, there are several interesting spells in the Complete Adventurer. Go with illusions and charms. Out of third level spells, Glibness will probably be very useful to you. Also, Ventriloquism can be pretty handy; if you place it far enough away, then all of the spells that you cast are effectively Silent for its duration (particularly useful during infiltration). Finally, Shatter is an infinitely useful spell. P.S. By placing the Ventriloquism hint in my post, I am in no way claiming that it is my own creation. Some other person came up with it, and I thought it relevant for your character.
ravenkith 04-17-06, 09:07 PM	Bard + combat position? :heehee :rofl: = :ghosted:
thorian 04-17-06, 11:06 PM	You may want to consider taking the Faerie Mysteries Initiate feat (Dragon #319). It will allow you to apply your INT mod instead of your CON mod to your HP. That doubles your current HP at this time, and nets you 5 extra HP per level based on your present attributes.
DM_Greatness 04-17-06, 11:44 PM	Oddly enough I have a Bard player in my Campaign. Although she is only 2nd level, she has already started to notice the joy of using the Grease spell, and then following it up with Alchy Fire.... It must be something about the bard class that attracts them to fire :mage: She's a human bard, as opposed to Elvish like yours. Short bows will never match the power of your recurve Long bow, so she relies on her Whip from the back row for Tripping, Disarming, and Lashing characters. The only items of note that this bard has are - Studded Leather - Brass Tipped Weighted Whip (damage as a whip-dagger, 1d6) - Wand of Magic Missiles at 3rd level, Slight of Handed off of her Magic Teacher (has to roll a 20 on UMD) - 2 scrolls of Cure light wounds, that were Scribed from the party's cleric And most of the time she really prefers to float in the back of the party. Here is what I've seen so far. - She will Daze people far stronger than her, gladly giving up her turn to take theirs away - Assist the front row with Whip lashing/Trips/Disarms - Draw the longsword and 'yelp' for help when engaged in melee - Grease when it seems to be good. I already know she is willing to Grease right where she is at, and hoping her Reflexs will carry her though, and hoping clumsy people in heavy armor will fall - Smash people with Oil whenever the party seems to be clear out of the slash radius - Sing her little heart out from the back - Perform as a set of eyes and ears, and back up healer Her stats aren't as high as yours, because we use the 25 point buy, and I tend to run a much magic lower game than most others, but so far, the Bard really is pulling her own weight in the combats. It is an amazing class. In one of the fights she was already in a tree plinking at a bear with her wee shortbow, and then when the bear started to climb up the tree to eat a Bard Sandwich, she whiped the branch of another tree, swung away, and then climbed up her whip into that different tree. It had a nice feeling to it; Like something that I could almost do myself in my backyard. I almost think that the whip is the true calling card to the Bard's melee combat. Not so much for you, but for setting up AoO for the rest of your party, and really protecting your party from the ammont the damage they would take in a round The class seems endlessly fun because my Bard PC has to juggle using her Singing, Longsword, Whip, Wand, Oil, Tumbling, Spells, and soon to come instrument (When she gets one that is better in effect than just singing). Honest to God, that bard needs to take a cold, hard look at the Quick Draw feat. Something I was considering, becaus she has to take Alchemy as a skill in order to get her Smokesticks, and Flaming Oil, is boosting the Oil damage to 1d8 instead of 1d6 to reflect her skill in Alchemy. You might want to talk to your DM and see if he would work with you in the same manner. Something else I was considering was allowing one whip attack during the casting of Sound Burst when she gets high enough level. The Bard is lots of fun and support, but is still a little low on the Damage Output side (and the should be). However, I think have a Huge Thunderbooming crack of the whip, doing the 1d6 damage of the whip if it hit, plus the Sound Burst effect centered on the target of the whip, isn't unbalancing at all, and would be great fun for the game.
Arminel 04-18-06, 02:24 AM	Yeah, you have your position about right; bards aren't meant to be arcane arsenals (particularly if you have a trigger-happy dragonblood with you). If you want bardic empowerment, there are several interesting spells in the Complete Adventurer. Go with illusions and charms. Out of third level spells, Glibness will probably be very useful to you. Also, Ventriloquism can be pretty handy; if you place it far enough away, then all of the spells that you cast are effectively Silent for its duration (particularly useful during infiltration). Finally, Shatter is an infinitely useful spell. P.S. By placing the Ventriloquism hint in my post, I am in no way claiming that it is my own creation. Some other person came up with it, and I thought it relevant for your character. Great suggestion, and Glibness will be my best friend. I thought Brew Potion would be fun to take, making potions of Invisibility, Improvisation (doubtful), Glibness, Alter Self (predetermined), and then for those I don't like Sleep and Sound Burst :eek:. I've looked in the Complete Adventurer and very much liked what I saw. I heard with the Lute I can play one bardic song while I sing another (from my DM, so it is permittable) which would be cool. Inspire Courage + Countersong = Fighter's Best Friend. What about Weapon Finesse? Because my DM says that Weapon Finesse applies to all weapons you are proficient with because he argues that you're not proficient with using one weapon with grace but rather a style of fighting all-together that implements it. Would Precise Shot be needed with the whip? And would Point Blank Shot work? Because it is a Ranged Melee weapon >.>