BBEG Horde Buffer [Archive] - Wizards Community

BBEG Horde Buffer [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Zog
08-13-04, 08:15 AM I wanted to build a recurring BBEG whose main strength would be getting/buying/bluffing one or many monsters or NPCs into attacking the characters and buffing them as much as possible.

His only abilities would be enhancing the power of whatever he sends (being or not able to buff himself would be secondary). Also, he should be able to do it from a safe place (60ft. distance, invisibility, very good hiding abilities or having buffing abilities with enough duration as to let him cast and go.

He should start being usable at ECL 6. I plan on raising his lvl. to keep him always a single lvl. above party's, so he should also have as much scalability as possible.

I don't even know where to start. Could you please help me?

P.S.: Please excuse my unreadable English. I hope gmail's spell checker works well enough.
SolitudeSeraph
08-13-04, 08:18 AM Look into the Marshall base class from MiniHB or some sort of bard build probably..(don't know much about either so I can't help much)..for good bard builds check the optimization library in my signature...but the Marshall isn't a very popular base class so there isn't a section for it in the library..
Zog
08-13-04, 09:48 AM Originally posted by SolitudeSeraph
Look into the Marshall base class from MiniHB or some sort of bard build probably..(don't know much about either so I can't help much)..for good bard builds check the optimization library in my signature...but the Marshall isn't a very popular base class so there isn't a section for it in the library..
The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :)
EatFlan
08-13-04, 09:56 AM make a custom class man...
SolitudeSeraph
08-13-04, 10:52 AM Have you seen Satori's Bard build? It's quite evil and nothing to be laughed at. I'll see if I can find the link.
Scandal
08-13-04, 10:53 AM The bard is underestimated haha..

Make a bard level 6 and use his bardic music ability + his buff spells that he recieves.. At higher level he get mass buff spells that come in handy + his music....

Or go with a bard that focuses on his music..

Bard 6/ warchanter 8 / warrior skald 6
this IMHO is a very potent combat bard, the abliity to combine songs and use demorilize + recklessness an then using the warrior skalds 6th level song will make all your guys beefy..

Just an idea for a bard that your players might fear a little..

-scan

::[warchanter is from complete warrior and warrior skald is from races of faerun]::
iN.fuSioN
08-13-04, 11:07 AM Originally posted by Zog
The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :)
Bard inspire courage bonus at level 6: +1
Use a horn: another +1, loose save bonuses
Use harmony spell: +2
Song of Heart feat: +1
Total inspire courage bonus to damage and attack: +15
Now add Words of Creation ->
Net total of +10 to attack and damage.

have him come with lots of low level creatures using ranged weapons. Your players will stop laughing very quickly.
SolitudeSeraph
08-13-04, 11:17 AM Here's the build I mentioned earlier..

Satori's Bard (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=283425)

Of course I'm sure you could switch out paladin of justice for something like paladin of tyranny from UA (Not sure how the paladin of justice works out? Never heard of it..)
Scandal
08-13-04, 11:30 AM Originally posted by iN.fuSioN
Bard inspire courage bonus at level 6: +1
Use a horn: another +1, loose save bonuses
Use harmony spell: +2
Song of Heart feat: +1
Total inspire courage bonus to damage and attack: +15
Now add Words of Creation ->
Net total of +10 to attack and damage.

have him come with lots of low level creatures using ranged weapons. Your players will stop laughing very quickly.

Where is song of heart from??

-Scan
Zog
08-13-04, 12:33 PM Originally posted by SolitudeSeraph
Here's the build I mentioned earlier..

Satori's Bard (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=283425)

Of course I'm sure you could switch out paladin of justice for something like paladin of tyranny from UA (Not sure how the paladin of justice works out? Never heard of it..)
Ok, that is quite good. I'll drop the paladin levels and study the warchanter, skald and lyricist to meet the precise requirements that I'm loking for.
Ok, when only a single bard level is used it seems that nice characters arise. :P

I think inspire legion could be quite interesting for a NPC that is usually surrounded by lower level minions but has no equal level companions close, so maybe I'll extend war chanter to lvl 10.

The skald has smaller areas of effect, so maybe I'll drop it. 30 or 20 feet radius is a bit small for a character that will keep away from direct confrontation.

I don't have my draconomicon here, so I'll check the lyricyst later.

Thank you all. :)
El_Machinae
08-13-04, 12:34 PM Make a vampire. Later on, make him a cleric of Erythnul

Considering he can turn 1HD commoners into 4 HD spawn, that's a pretty powerful buff.
Moherajikuyx
08-13-04, 12:39 PM Originally posted by Zog
The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :)

That's exactly the Best Thing in DMing t.m.: their face when they see that the weakling they just laughed about, is kicking their ass to orbit!

:D
Zog
08-13-04, 12:52 PM Originally posted by Moherajikuyx
That's exactly the Best Thing in DMing t.m.: their face when they see that the weakling they just laughed about, is kicking their ass to orbit!
:D
Actually it's a little worse than that.

The characters finally find the hiding place of the BBEG; a tavern. He escapes through a window and everyone starts running after him. They finally reach him as he's speaking to a bunch of thugs in the street.

The weakling drops a bag of money in the thug leader (fighter lvl 1) and shouts a couple of commands. As the characters aproach, the weakling shouts a couple more commands and starts retreating. When the combat fights, the weakling shouts a poem mixed with an inspired pun and runs away.

The characters spend five rounds fighting what seems to be the hardest street thugs they've ever seen while the BBEG's voice (still chanting) fades away in the distance. :D
Zubon
08-13-04, 01:12 PM Originally posted by El_Machinae
Make a vampire. Later on, make him a cleric of Erythnul

Considering he can turn 1HD commoners into 4 HD spawn, that's a pretty powerful buff.
Now there is an idea... Vampire Thrallherd. You can eat as many believers as you want, and they will be replaced for free the next day. How many spawn can you keep?

Evil thing: as I recall, a cohort is not worth xp apart from the main character, any more than summoned monsters are worth xp (I could be wrong on this). This makes Leadership or a Thrallherd fun, especially when the Thrallherd has an infinitely regenerating supply of drones. I can even see why this might not be worth xp: if you are not striking against the Thrallherd himself, you are not overcoming the problem in any way. You can kill every believer he has, and that will not affect how many he has tomorrow. As I said, that is just being cruel to PCs, though.

I do like the idea of mass-producing spawn, and the Thrallherd gets a good supply of spawns-to-be and food for them.
iN.fuSioN
08-13-04, 02:24 PM Originally posted by Scandal
Where is song of heart from??

-Scan
Eberron CS
Ranthanas
08-13-04, 05:09 PM Originally posted by Zog
The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :)

Why? And why would you tell them he was a bard? (Go trawl the old articles in Redgar's for my The Lore of the Bard thread to see a list of possible bardic archetypes)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Zog 08-13-04, 08:15 AM	I wanted to build a recurring BBEG whose main strength would be getting/buying/bluffing one or many monsters or NPCs into attacking the characters and buffing them as much as possible. His only abilities would be enhancing the power of whatever he sends (being or not able to buff himself would be secondary). Also, he should be able to do it from a safe place (60ft. distance, invisibility, very good hiding abilities or having buffing abilities with enough duration as to let him cast and go. He should start being usable at ECL 6. I plan on raising his lvl. to keep him always a single lvl. above party's, so he should also have as much scalability as possible. I don't even know where to start. Could you please help me? P.S.: Please excuse my unreadable English. I hope gmail's spell checker works well enough.
SolitudeSeraph 08-13-04, 08:18 AM	Look into the Marshall base class from MiniHB or some sort of bard build probably..(don't know much about either so I can't help much)..for good bard builds check the optimization library in my signature...but the Marshall isn't a very popular base class so there isn't a section for it in the library..
Zog 08-13-04, 09:48 AM	Originally posted by SolitudeSeraph Look into the Marshall base class from MiniHB or some sort of bard build probably..(don't know much about either so I can't help much)..for good bard builds check the optimization library in my signature...but the Marshall isn't a very popular base class so there isn't a section for it in the library.. The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :)
EatFlan 08-13-04, 09:56 AM	make a custom class man...
SolitudeSeraph 08-13-04, 10:52 AM	Have you seen Satori's Bard build? It's quite evil and nothing to be laughed at. I'll see if I can find the link.
Scandal 08-13-04, 10:53 AM	The bard is underestimated haha.. Make a bard level 6 and use his bardic music ability + his buff spells that he recieves.. At higher level he get mass buff spells that come in handy + his music.... Or go with a bard that focuses on his music.. Bard 6/ warchanter 8 / warrior skald 6 this IMHO is a very potent combat bard, the abliity to combine songs and use demorilize + recklessness an then using the warrior skalds 6th level song will make all your guys beefy.. Just an idea for a bard that your players might fear a little.. -scan ::[warchanter is from complete warrior and warrior skald is from races of faerun]::
iN.fuSioN 08-13-04, 11:07 AM	Originally posted by Zog The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :) Bard inspire courage bonus at level 6: +1 Use a horn: another +1, loose save bonuses Use harmony spell: +2 Song of Heart feat: +1 Total inspire courage bonus to damage and attack: +15 Now add Words of Creation -> Net total of +10 to attack and damage. have him come with lots of low level creatures using ranged weapons. Your players will stop laughing very quickly.
SolitudeSeraph 08-13-04, 11:17 AM	Here's the build I mentioned earlier.. Satori's Bard (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=283425) Of course I'm sure you could switch out paladin of justice for something like paladin of tyranny from UA (Not sure how the paladin of justice works out? Never heard of it..)
Scandal 08-13-04, 11:30 AM	Originally posted by iN.fuSioN Bard inspire courage bonus at level 6: +1 Use a horn: another +1, loose save bonuses Use harmony spell: +2 Song of Heart feat: +1 Total inspire courage bonus to damage and attack: +15 Now add Words of Creation -> Net total of +10 to attack and damage. have him come with lots of low level creatures using ranged weapons. Your players will stop laughing very quickly. Where is song of heart from?? -Scan
Zog 08-13-04, 12:33 PM	Originally posted by SolitudeSeraph Here's the build I mentioned earlier.. Satori's Bard (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=283425) Of course I'm sure you could switch out paladin of justice for something like paladin of tyranny from UA (Not sure how the paladin of justice works out? Never heard of it..) Ok, that is quite good. I'll drop the paladin levels and study the warchanter, skald and lyricist to meet the precise requirements that I'm loking for. Ok, when only a single bard level is used it seems that nice characters arise. :P I think inspire legion could be quite interesting for a NPC that is usually surrounded by lower level minions but has no equal level companions close, so maybe I'll extend war chanter to lvl 10. The skald has smaller areas of effect, so maybe I'll drop it. 30 or 20 feet radius is a bit small for a character that will keep away from direct confrontation. I don't have my draconomicon here, so I'll check the lyricyst later. Thank you all. :)
El_Machinae 08-13-04, 12:34 PM	Make a vampire. Later on, make him a cleric of Erythnul Considering he can turn 1HD commoners into 4 HD spawn, that's a pretty powerful buff.
Moherajikuyx 08-13-04, 12:39 PM	Originally posted by Zog The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :) That's exactly the Best Thing in DMing t.m.: their face when they see that the weakling they just laughed about, is kicking their ass to orbit! :D
Zog 08-13-04, 12:52 PM	Originally posted by Moherajikuyx That's exactly the Best Thing in DMing t.m.: their face when they see that the weakling they just laughed about, is kicking their ass to orbit! :D Actually it's a little worse than that. The characters finally find the hiding place of the BBEG; a tavern. He escapes through a window and everyone starts running after him. They finally reach him as he's speaking to a bunch of thugs in the street. The weakling drops a bag of money in the thug leader (fighter lvl 1) and shouts a couple of commands. As the characters aproach, the weakling shouts a couple more commands and starts retreating. When the combat fights, the weakling shouts a poem mixed with an inspired pun and runs away. The characters spend five rounds fighting what seems to be the hardest street thugs they've ever seen while the BBEG's voice (still chanting) fades away in the distance. :D
Zubon 08-13-04, 01:12 PM	Originally posted by El_Machinae Make a vampire. Later on, make him a cleric of Erythnul Considering he can turn 1HD commoners into 4 HD spawn, that's a pretty powerful buff. Now there is an idea... Vampire Thrallherd. You can eat as many believers as you want, and they will be replaced for free the next day. How many spawn can you keep? Evil thing: as I recall, a cohort is not worth xp apart from the main character, any more than summoned monsters are worth xp (I could be wrong on this). This makes Leadership or a Thrallherd fun, especially when the Thrallherd has an infinitely regenerating supply of drones. I can even see why this might not be worth xp: if you are not striking against the Thrallherd himself, you are not overcoming the problem in any way. You can kill every believer he has, and that will not affect how many he has tomorrow. As I said, that is just being cruel to PCs, though. I do like the idea of mass-producing spawn, and the Thrallherd gets a good supply of spawns-to-be and food for them.
iN.fuSioN 08-13-04, 02:24 PM	Originally posted by Scandal Where is song of heart from?? -Scan Eberron CS
Ranthanas 08-13-04, 05:09 PM	Originally posted by Zog The marshall is exactly what I was looking for, but it's too weak. And my players would laugh if the recurring BBEG was a bard. :) Why? And why would you tell them he was a bard? (Go trawl the old articles in Redgar's for my The Lore of the Bard thread to see a list of possible bardic archetypes)