Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Utik 09-30-05, 04:27 PM	..now I need I big update! First of all hello to everyone, it's been a while since my last login in this board and I can see it has grown bigger and with new graphics. I have a few questions so I group them all in this thread. Explanation: I have to retire my PC from my current group because he has some problems with another PC, so I prefer to roleplay him out than kill the other (mainly because the other player can't distinguish very well a in-game hate with real life), so I have to make a substitution character, some kind of damage dealer (now I have a spi :devil: ked chain warrior/disarmer/whirlwind attacker ;) ). The questions are: 1. I see now that the Archer has been far underpowered from the 3.0, no bow and arrow bonus stackable, no more deepwood sniper, am I missing something to do a very good archer? 2. Do there is some way to use divine power and righteous might with 2 or 3 warrior feats and a slightly better-than-cleric BAB? Thinking at a cleric/warrior tank.. (but also at an alternative way to use those 2 powers without going to 9th cleric) 3. Do there is the possibility to do a STRONG swashbuckler/dueler/dervish (or whatever combo you can think at); with STRONG I don't mean the classic first line warrior but not even a simple flanker, I'd like something that can deal quite a lot of damage and take a few also without panicking. IMPORTANT Level: I'm not interested in characters that can kick everyone's ass at 20th level, I'm speaking about something really strong from 8th to 14th level. Books: almost everything official: core, completes, races but nothing too weird ;) p.s. I'm passing my actual character to the master that will use it to kill my friend's one :D :devil:
Medicelious-Melharmonac 09-30-05, 04:47 PM	2. Do there is some way to use divine power and righteous might with 2 or 3 warrior feats and a slightly better-than-cleric BAB? Thinking at a cleric/warrior tank.. (but also at an alternative way to use those 2 powers without going to 9th cleric) IMPORTANT Level: I'm not interested in characters that can kick everyone's ass at 20th level, I'm speaking about something really strong from 8th to 14th level. Books: almost everything official: core, completes, races but nothing too weird ;) Persistent Righteous Might and Divine power would require you to be level 9. You end up with +14 Str, DR/10 evil, -2 Dex, +4 Natural Armor, Fighter BAB You're a better tank then any tank. Planning Domain 1) Extend Spell - Domain Bonus Feat 1) Persistent Spell - 1) Divine Metamagic (Persistent) 3) Extra Turning 6) Extra Turning 9) Power Attack Assuming a Cha of 16 = 6 Turn attempts + 8 from Extra Turning = 2 spells Righteous Might and Divine Power.
UMiskatonic 09-30-05, 05:17 PM	It's true that 3.0 had bow and arrow stacking, but 3.0 also had worse DR issues for archers. Now, with the right ammo, you can generally sail past DR. The buff archer isn't as good with the demise of 3.0 haste and the LONG duration 3.0 2nd level stat bumps, but you can still do okay with a cleric archer. Favored Soul is like a divine sorceror, and if you're only interested in cleric spells to assist archery, it's worth a look. You may want to take a look inside Complete Divine. There's a prestige class, Divine Champion I think, that gives you one domain only, and good fighter-ish abilities. Pick the right domain, and you'll be great. Pious Templar is also pretty good if your god uses a bow. As for the quick-spry-secondary fighter, I like ranger 2/rogue 3/assassin 8/dervish 7. (grab dervish 1 as fast as possible). The assassin spells are VERY cool with the Complete Books, and you'll have decent saves and hit points for most bad guys. If it gets really hairy, spring attack and hide in plain sight. The darkstalker feat from Libris Mortis lets you hide from undead, which is good because you won't be able to do much else without UMD. Monk 2/Swashbuckler 3 is also a solid intro to the above build, if your DM allows the Kung-Fu genius feat. It allows a monk to use INT for WIS. I'd take Combat Reflexes (free) and work toward Karmic Strike for that kung-fu movie feel.
oxybe 09-30-05, 05:18 PM	this is my favorite swashbuckler build. very munchy (5 classes), so you may want to avert your eyes. Elf fighter 2 / Swashbuckler 3 / Ninja3 / Champ of Corellon Larethian 2 / duelist 10 for less munchy, a simple ftr 4 / swash 4 / champ of corellon 2 / duelist 10. you get more feats, but no invis & wis to AC. Pros: int, str + dex to damage int(max 10), dex + wis to AC invisibility for a full round 3+wis/day (this is the good stuff, like greater invis) +19bab decent mobility cons: mad MAD (multiple ability dependency) no armor/sheild only effective with 1 weapon progression - ftr 2/swash 2/ ninja 2 /swash/ninja/champ of corellon 2 / duelist 10 feats 1 combat expertise 1 improved weapon familiarity = ftr bonus 2 mounted combat = ftr bonus 3 weapon focus(elven thinblade) 3 weapon finesse= swash 6 dodge 9 mobility 9 spring attack =champ of corellon bonus 12 Elusive Target 15 filler (improved crit[elven thinblade]) 18 filler (???) stats in importance: dex - int - wis - con - str - cha key items: get bracers of armor & amulet of natural armor. you dont have any real armor, so you need as much backup as possible.
Utik 10-01-05, 05:32 AM	Thank you very much, I was sure to find the right ideas here, the persistent cleric is stunning (I did some kind of rapid cleric in the past), but probably I will do a lighter version, I mean it's not easy to roleplay a 4 metres high human, and I'd like a creation feat (more objects within the money cap), so my idea is go with divine power persistent and righteous might on need, how do you think about it? Also I can't (I never couldn't actually) figure out a cleric archer, can someone clear me out this point? Edit: am I missing something or there isn't a search button for the forum? Does the site search work also inside the forum?
Ithandor 10-01-05, 09:28 AM	The Search function is and has been down for the past while; you can use Google's advanced search, limiting the search to boards1.wizards.com, to get by. I played a Cleric who persisted Divine Power but not RM, because my DM took every opportunity to punish my large size while I had it on. It worked out fine just using RM as needed. As an aside, I replaced persistent RM with persisted Monstrous Regeneration :evillaugh What can't you figure out about the Cleric archer? I'd be happy to answer, I'm just not sure what you mean.... Ithandor
Utik 10-01-05, 11:58 AM	I never thought about a cleric/archer as a powerful combo so I don't have an idea about how can it work, but this morning I looked in the faq so I'll probably try down some builds before asking again about it ;)
Utik 10-01-05, 03:52 PM	You have been so helpful that.. I ask another question! ;) The cleric tank with high strenght and power attack calls for 2-handed weapon, but I don't have feats left to take improved buckler defense (a must-have for all my first-liner), so do you have any suggestion to raise my AC? Protection from evil/caos... is good only against evil/caos.. :rolleyes: , shield of faith doesn't stack with rings, any hints? And also where can I find Monstrous Regeneration?
PhaedrusXY 10-01-05, 04:08 PM	The cleric tank with high strenght and power attack calls for 2-handed weapon, but I don't have feats left to take improved buckler defense (a must-have for all my first-liner), so do you have any suggestion to raise my AC?+1 Animated Shield w/Magic Vestment on it. Get a lesser metamagic rod of quickening. It can help you buff yourself without missing rounds of attacks. Once you get that, I'd just use Shield of Faith instead of Rings of Protection.
Ithandor 10-02-05, 10:53 AM	You have been so helpful that.. I ask another question! ;) The cleric tank with high strenght and power attack calls for 2-handed weapon, but I don't have feats left to take improved buckler defense (a must-have for all my first-liner), so do you have any suggestion to raise my AC? Protection from evil/caos... is good only against evil/caos.. :rolleyes: , shield of faith doesn't stack with rings, any hints? And also where can I find Monstrous Regeneration? As Phaedrus says, Animated Shields are the way to go. Monstrous Regeneration is in Magic of Faerun I think. It's definitely *one* of the FR books anyway. Another way of raising your AC is if you pick up a Domain with Barkskin (Plant is the only one that comes to mind at the minute). Ithandor
Kuroi Kenshi 10-02-05, 03:08 PM	Another (cheesy) way of getting AC is getting armor spikes and blades and make them defending.
X-Codes 10-02-05, 03:45 PM	Riteous Might has been errattaed. It only gives +4 strength, DR 3/evil (6/evil and 9/evil at higher levels), and the size bump with the other normal penalties. It really was way too much compared to Stoneskin.
SigmaJargon 10-02-05, 04:55 PM	Another (cheesy) way of getting AC is getting armor spikes and blades and make them defending.Or perhaps not so very cheesy. +X Defending Armor Spikes or Blade Boots or any other weapon is more expensive than buying an equivalent Amulet of Natural Armor +X or Ring of Protection +X, and much more expensive than enchanting armor. Certainly, if you want that extra edge, you can spend the gold - but generally, it will be more cost effective not to buy defending weapons Some math to back it up: +1 Defending Weapon 8,300 + weapon cost +1 Ring of Protection 2,000 +1 Armor/Shield 1,150 + armor cost +2 Defending Weapon 18,300 + weapon cost +2 Ring of Protection 8,000 +2 Armor/Shield 4,150 + armor cost +3 Defending Weapon 32,300 + weapon cost +3 Ring of Protection 18,000 +3 Armor/Shield 9,150 + armor cost +4 Defending Weapon 50,300 + weapon cost +4 Ring of Protection 32,000 +4 Armor/Shield 16,150 + armor cost +5 Defending Weapon 72,300 + weapon cost +5 Ring of Protection 50,000 +5 Armor/Shield 25,150 + armor cost
Kuroi Kenshi 10-02-05, 06:28 PM	True, it does cost more, but that's what you get for an AC bonus that stacks with anything, including other ehancements of the same kind. It's more for after you've gotten your other items sufficiently enhanced, so you can get your AC to near-unhittable levels.
Ithandor 10-02-05, 06:51 PM	A good way for clerics to make use of Defending weapons is via Greater Magic Weapon and a Bead of Karma. Suddenly that 12th level Cleric's +1 Defending Heavy Mace is +4. Repeat ad nauseum for additional weapons. That's cheesy :) Ithandor