Post/Author/DateTime	Post
EvilVegan 07-08-06, 04:03 AM	Gnome (obviously) Beguiler 14/Mindbender 1/Shadowcraft Mage 5 Mindbender taken at 6th or 7th level to delay the "Advanced learning" feature offered by Beguiler, to take any shadow spell of 4th level, my preference being shadow well from spell compendium. built as party face, controller, and eventually shadow blaster/summoner (mostly blaster and self summons like phantom steed) 36 Point buy S 6 D 10 C 16 I 18 W 10 C 16 Feats 1 Spell focus (Illusion) 3 Spell Focus (Enchantment) 5 Silent spell 6 Greater spell focus (Enchantment) 8 Heighten Spell (to raise my figments to emulate higher level conj/evocs, and to raise charm dcs) 12 Extraordinary concentration 15 Greater spell focus (Illusion) 16 Still spell 18 (Who knows?) Um . . . Thats my base so far. Any suggestions/play tips would be useful. After 11th level its basically a war mage with almost all enchantment, evocations, conjurations, and illusions, plus several nice buffs and debuffs like Dispel magic and mage armor. . .
prototype00 07-08-06, 06:52 AM	Errrm, is there a reason you aren't taking earth sense and earth spell? I mean, if you've got the book the shadowcraft mage is in, then it stands to reason that you've also got access to these two feats. They basically give you (well earth spell does at any rate, but you need earth sense to get it.) free caster level increases when you heighten spells and on top of that allow you to emulate 9th level evocation and conjuration spells (normally you can't heighten spells up to 10th level). Furthermore, if you take them early, you can get into the Shadowcraft mage starting 7th level and be done with it by 12th. (You could then take mindbender, of course.) Also, what are you planning to do with extraordinary concentration? I used to like it as well, but I found this spell called sonorous hum in the spell compendium which basically does the same thing but without the need for a concentration check. (Of course you could have the feat and cast the spell to keep three concentration dependent spells going, but that takes at least three rounds.) I like putting sonorous hum into a contingency that goes off when I'm casting the specific concentration dependent spell. SF and GSF enchantment are okay I guess... But don't put off SF and GSF illusion, your blasting potential depends on it. Well, thats what I've got up to now, read the shadowcraft mage handbook for more insight, I suppose. prototype00
EvilVegan 07-08-06, 11:17 AM	Errrm, is there a reason you aren't taking earth sense and earth spell? I mean, if you've got the book the shadowcraft mage is in, then it stands to reason that you've also got access to these two feats. It WOULD stand to reason, but I forgot about it. :) Also, what are you planning to do with extraordinary concentration? I don't thikn I can get sonorous hum as a beguiler (is it enchantment or illusion?) But I was getting it to make my figment and rainbow pattern spells last forever. . . like walking down the street I have a rainbow pattern following me, or I have a major image around me all the time that I can shape to various effects, such as describing things with actual images and using them to tactical advantage without having to cast them over and over. Like if we needed a wall there'd be one, if we needed a small army there'd be one, all with the casting of one spell. SF and GSF enchantment are okay I guess... But don't put off SF and GSF illusion, your blasting potential depends on it. Well with Gnome racial bonus and beguiler bonus my DCs are going to be great anyway, but the reason I put it off until after I had GSF enchantment is that I wanted my save DCs to be equal for a few levels So. . . If I can drop Extraordinary concentration I should move enchantment focus til later levels and put heighten and earth sense/spell lower down, or drop greater focus and move regular focus up. I mainly got focus because I couldn't remember any feats that specifically worked well with this build (I was thinking the heighten to 9th level shadow evoc/conj only worked with incantatrix). BUT anyway, thank you very much for the suggestion, I'll rework it in.
prototype00 07-08-06, 12:36 PM	I don't thikn I can get sonorous hum as a beguiler (is it enchantment or illusion?) Its evocation. So you are right when you say that beguilers don't get it. But shadowcraft mages can cast it just fine. But I was getting it to make my figment and rainbow pattern spells last forever. . . like walking down the street I have a rainbow pattern following me, or I have a major image around me all the time that I can shape to various effects, such as describing things with actual images and using them to tactical advantage without having to cast them over and over. Like if we needed a wall there'd be one, if we needed a small army there'd be one, all with the casting of one spell. I'm not so sure whether silent image or major image works that way... Anyway, the only spell that you need is silent image anyway. Just sew a piece of fleece into your glove and its there whenever you want it. Well with Gnome racial bonus and beguiler bonus my DCs are going to be great anyway, but the reason I put it off until after I had GSF enchantment is that I wanted my save DCs to be equal for a few levels Okay... Personally I would want the boost to power with SF Illusion and GSF illusion as soon as possible (most games I've been in don't last that long), but whatever you want. I mainly got focus because I couldn't remember any feats that specifically worked well with this build (I was thinking the heighten to 9th level shadow evoc/conj only worked with incantatrix). Arcane thesis (silent image) and extend spell don't work too badly together. Almost all your evocation and conjuration effects with durations will last for 4 times as long. There is also practical metamagic (need to be dragonborn though) to boost your 1st-8th level spells. Arcane mastery means never failing a caster level check. Hmm, mindsight isn't bad considering the fact that you have telepathy as a mindbender, its like 100ft blindsense. But then again, I guess you could do worse than SF and GSF enchantment. prototype00
EvilVegan 07-08-06, 01:42 PM	Its evocation. So you are right when you say that beguilers don't get it. But shadowcraft mages can cast it just fine.Shadowcraft mages can cast it just fine if they're based on sorcerer or wizard, but they just add 1 level to my previous arcane class, so I'll never get it. I'm not so sure whether silent image or major image works that way... Anyway, the only spell that you need is silent image anyway. Just sew a piece of fleece into your glove and its there whenever you want it.I don't see how they wouldn't work that way, they're shapable to anything I can visualize with a duration of concentration. Arcane thesis (silent image) and extend spell don't work too badly together. Almost all your evocation and conjuration effects with durations will last for 4 times as long. There is also practical metamagic (need to be dragonborn though) to boost your 1st-8th level spells. Arcane mastery means never failing a caster level check. Hmm, mindsight isn't bad considering the fact that you have telepathy as a mindbender, its like 100ft blindsense. But then again, I guess you could do worse than SF and GSF enchantment. prototype00 Well if I get earth spell/sense I won't have the feats available for SF and GSF enchantment, so I dropped them in favor of illusions, which was going to be my forte anyway. What book/s is/are arcane thesis and mindsight in? (I have too many books.)
Caelic 07-08-06, 02:04 PM	Couldn't you theoretically use Shadow Evocation to cast Sonorous Hum?
ed209 07-08-06, 07:32 PM	... read the shadowcraft mage handbook for more insight, ... Shadowcraft Mage Handbook
EvilVegan 07-09-06, 12:13 AM	Couldn't you theoretically use Shadow Evocation to cast Sonorous Hum? Once again you're the smartest man EVER.
prototype00 07-09-06, 05:52 AM	Now that you know how to use sonorous hum even though it isn't technically on your spell list, you should take a look at create magical tattoo. It normally costs 100gp, but remember, shadow conjurations and evocations are free. prototype00
JaronK 07-09-06, 08:09 AM	Shadowcraft mages can cast it just fine if they're based on sorcerer or wizard, but they just add 1 level to my previous arcane class, so I'll never get it. Huh? Shadowcraft mage always gives you Sorcerer/Wizard Evocations and Conjurations, so all Shadowcraft Mages can cast it. The feats I generally use for SCMs are: 1: Spell Focus: Illusion 3: Earth Sense 6: Earth Spell 9: Heighten Spell 12: Easy Metamagic (Heighten Spell) 15: Arcane Thesis (Silent Image) 18: Metamagic of your choice If it's based on Illusionist Wizard, just throw in some more metamagics. This means all your shadow spells are +3 Caster Level and Extended, usually with one extra metamagic thrown on. If you want to be cheesy, your 18th level feat should be Arcane Disciple (Luck Domain) for the Exp free illusionary miracles. JaronK
EvilVegan 07-10-06, 12:31 PM	Would heighten spell used on legion of sentinels (a shadow spell) allow me to qualify for shadowcraft mage?
NineInchNall 07-10-06, 01:57 PM	In short, yes.