Post/Author/DateTime	Post
NHdjinn 10-16-03, 03:19 PM	Just a "fun" thread. After getting past the fact that 25 pt buy eats.....I have been wondering what is the best build available for lets say... Archer Melee Mage Other spellcaster And your "ideal" PC out of this? I am not saying anything is best...just what would you build inside these rules? And why? Come one come all...amaze us with your builds..... NHdjinn
NHdjinn 10-16-03, 06:54 PM	NO challengers??? May the curse of the LOG fall upon you.
JosephKell 10-16-03, 07:19 PM	Core 3.5 only.. Since you neglected to say what level I will assume first (since this is the hardest to min/max). off the top of my head: BEST (read most useful) Archer: Elven Ranger Str 10, Dex 16, Con 12, Int 13, Wis 14, Cha 8 Way I got this: 14, 16, 14, 13, 10, 8 Advantages: Skills (Hide, Listen, Move Silently, Spot, Survival, plus 2 more), Track, feat: Point Blank Shot (it was hard not taking Alertness) One Drawback: Wild Empathy Racial Advantage: +2 Dex, +2 to Listen, Search, and Spot. Reasons: Many (I almost said, "Most") posters on this board ignore the usefulness of skills to combat. If you detect your enemy before you are detected (or you avoid detection longer) you control combat. Melee: Human Fighter: Str 14, Dex 10, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 13, Cha 8 Advantages: +2 to all combat attributes, +1 Wisdom modifier gives a slightly (+1) better chance of resisting Will Saves starting out. Intellegence isn't all that important. Feats: Improved Intiative, Power Attack, Cleave Mage: Too easy, just load up Intelligence for Wizard or Charisma for Sorcerer and don't try anything stupid like melee. Sorcerer Feat: Eschew Materials Wizard Feat: wizards bite yo. Other Spellcaster: Half-Elf Bard: The Face and the Fop Str 10, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 13, Wis 10, Cha 14 Advantages: Half-Elves get +2 to Diplomacy. This character should probably consider using a rapier. Feat: Skill Focus (Diplomacy, or Bluff) Additional recommendations: GET EXPENSIVE THINGS! Fancy clothes, shiney weapons, this guy is a Fop. That means someone that drinks and lives on everyone else's coin. Bards are better than people think. (Edit: Made the Fighter the way I think is best in the long run)
NHdjinn 10-16-03, 07:41 PM	Very good builds. I like the Fop idea. My Dm has this idea for a character. A sorc of some type. This sorc is very self loathing because all he does is mind control etc. Turns the BBEG on his minions, takes advantage of the Bar girls, convinces shopkeepers they should GIVE him the stuff he wants, makes the local guards beat people on the head when they make him mad etc. Problem is the guy has a conscience, and hates himself for it. Very funny stuff. NHdjinn
JosephKell 10-16-03, 10:24 PM	Originally posted by NHdjinn Very good builds. I like the Fop idea. My Dm has this idea for a character. A sorc of some type. This sorc is very self loathing because all he does is mind control etc. Turns the BBEG on his minions, takes advantage of the Bar girls, convinces shopkeepers they should GIVE him the stuff he wants, makes the local guards beat people on the head when they make him mad etc. Problem is the guy has a conscience, and hates himself for it. Very funny stuff. NHdjinn So this Sorcerer is like a Paladin that can force people to become better... Scary...
Ithilorien 10-16-03, 10:30 PM	I contest the placing of an odd score in the intelligence slot. Skill points are not retroactive, so keeping it at 13 rather than 14 or 12 is a waste of a point, at least from my perspective. Better to put odd-numbered scores in any of the other abilities as you still gain their full effect when later enhancing them.
JosephKell 10-16-03, 10:33 PM	Originally posted by Ithilorien I contest the placing of an odd score in the intelligence slot. Skill points are not retroactive, so keeping it at 13 rather than 14 or 12 is a waste of a point, at least from my perspective. Better to put odd-numbered scores in any of the other abilities as you still gain their full effect when later enhancing them. Or if the 13 Intellegence isn't there with the intent to raise later but to qualify for a feat like Combat Expertise. There is a reason why feats that require a certain attribute only require ODD attributes, so that there is a reason to have an odd score.
nikademus 10-17-03, 04:28 AM	Hello perhaps a Dwarf Cleric Str 14 / Int 10 / Wis 13 / Dex 12 / Con 14 / Cha 10 with racial mods Str 14 / Int 10 / Wis 13 / Dex 12 / Con 16 / Cha 8 raises Wis at 4 level has decent HP and decent armor class. Nikademus
WCrawford 10-17-03, 06:35 AM	I personally like the Human Cleric melee guy. At 1st level: STR: 13 DEX: 10 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS: 15 CHA: 10 Domains: War and Chaos/Evil/Good/Law Feats: Power Attack & Cleave Bonus Feat: Martial Weapon Proficiency & Weapon Focus With this character, prepare summon monster I spells and summon a creature appropriate to the alignment domain you've chosen (extra combatants for 2 rounds never hurts) and attack.
nikademus 10-17-03, 06:46 AM	Hello WCrawford, but with 3.5 rules the dwarf race is very strong with their boni, darkvision and move ability. I do not like cleave and power attack for clerics. There are better feats (Extend spell for example) Nikademus
WCrawford 10-17-03, 07:10 AM	Originally posted by nikademus Hello WCrawford, but with 3.5 rules the dwarf race is very strong with their boni, darkvision and move ability. I do not like cleave and power attack for clerics. There are better feats (Extend spell for example) Nikademus I totally agree that dwarves are very good in 3.5, but I tend to like more feats and skill points with my characters, so I tend to build humans. :) As a first level character, there is absolutley no meta-magic feat worth taking, IMO. Extend Spell, while a great feat, isn't really very useful until a spellcaster is between 3rd and 6th levels. So why not take it at those levels? I understand that Power Attack is useless for a level 1 Cleric (BAB of +0), but Cleave can be very useful when fighting creatures at CR 1 or less. However, it was difficult not to choose Improved Initiative. List some other feats you'd take for a 1st level melee cleric build. I'd be interested in seeing your choices (no matter what race). :)
nikademus 10-17-03, 08:08 AM	Hello WCrawford, my preferred cleric feats (not all possible with 25 point buy, we play 32 point buy) with 3.5 core rules Melee Cleric Dodge, Mobility, Spring attack , extend spell Human Cleric 01) Dodge, Mobility 03) extend spell 06) spring attack Dwarf gets spring attack at 9. Level Archer Cleric (i prefer these) Elf or Human with MW Bow PBS,Precise shot,Rapid shot, extend spell. I like to be mobile with the cleric and spring attack helps to avoid full attacks and gives opportunities to cast in the next round. Or another idea is to buy exotic weapon prof spiked chain as a human cleric. Nikademus
WCrawford 10-17-03, 08:45 AM	Nikademus, I'll have to experiment with your feat selection sometime. :) Now, for 'another spellcaster'. This is a monster summoning build. Human Cleric STR: 11 DEX: 12 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS:14 CHA: 12 Domains: Chaos/Law and Good/Evil Feats: 1st - Spell Focus (Conjuration) & Augment Summoning 3rd - Extend Spell 6th - Skill Focus (Concentration) I really thing that the cleric is a superior creature summoner because of the +1 to caster level with the Domains (and if the summoned creature corresponds to both its +2). Extend Spell at 3rd level could net 10 rounds out of a single Summon Monster I spell, and Skill Focus (Concentration) at 6th helps to overcome those pesky Concentration checks when the enemy decides to shoot you full of arrow/bolts or magic missiles. :) An added side effect is that with Spell Focus (Conjuration) any 'Cure' spells that the character uses against undead are slightly more difficult to resist, but if it wasn't a prerequisite for Augment Summoning, it would not have been included.
HammerFist 10-19-03, 04:29 PM	Originally posted by NHdjinn After getting past the fact that 25 pt buy eats.....I have been wondering what is the best build available for lets say... Archer Melee Mage Other spellcaster And your "ideal" PC out of this? I am not saying anything is best...just what would you build inside these rules? And why? Assuming PHB only: Archer: Elf Ranger (Archery feat chain) STR 14 DEX 16 CON 12 INT 10 WIS 13 (you'll need it for spells later) CHA 8 Archer (v2): Elf Fighter STR 14 DEX 19 CON 12 INT 8 WIS 8 CHA 8 I like the Ranger version better for the skills. Melee: Dwarf Fighter STR 16 DEX 13 CON 18 INT 8 WIS 8 CHA 6 Mage: Gnome Wizard STR 7 DEX 14 CON 16 INT 16 WIS 8 CHA 10 Other Spellcaster: Human Cleric STR 10 DEX 10 CON 14 INT 8 WIS 15 CHA 14
LordArkan 10-19-03, 07:51 PM	I'm going to throw this one into the mix, out of spite. Bob, lv1 Human Commoner STR 13 DEX 10 CON 14 INT 16 WIS 9 CHA 9 Feats: Simple Weapon Proficiency (Scythe), Skill Focus (Profession: Farming) Oh yeah. +10 to profession: farming checks! :D