Post/Author/DateTime	Post
SimiD 07-30-06, 10:39 PM	DM wants to try something different. What would be the best build if you're going at it alone (ie not part of a party - sort of like Morrowind/Oblivion)? Here's what I know so far: 38-point buy. Core books only (PHB, DMG & Complete books). Startingat level 1. Adventures will run the spectrum, including urban, wilderness, dungeon, and challenges will include combat, tricks & traps, negotiation, environment, etc... Anyone ever tried to play something like this before? What do you think? So far I'm thinking druid (flexbility & power) or rogue (skills!). I had also given some thought to a Bard (somewhat weak but flexible) or monk (hard to catch/kill) but have played both fairly recently.
CubeKnight 07-30-06, 10:57 PM	Scout 1/Druid 19 with Able Learner. Focus on Wis, Int, and Con. If you're expecting a lot of combat, Make it a Scout 1/Druid 17/Nature's Warrior 2, and pick up DR or +3 to Damage. You can also take Rogue instead of Scout, but Scout goes with the theme of outdoors and all that, and Skirmish sinergizes with the Pouncing shapes you can take, or the Lion's Pounce spell/wild feat. If you are facing a lot of enemies, that's what you have SNA for. I'd also pick either Initiate of Malar, the HalfOrc sub level, or just suck up the req feat and get SF(Conj)/Augment Summoning. I'm fairly sure a Cleric could also do well, but most likely worse than the Druid.
fil kearney 07-31-06, 12:54 AM	If unearthed arcana is allowed, request gestalt rules-- this will make you much more self reliant. I"d consider human spellthief/fighter. level class / class 01 spellthief 1 / fighter 1 02 spellthief 2 / fighter 2 03 spellthief 3 / fighter 3 04 spellthief 4 / fighter 4 05 spellthief 5 / eldritch master 1 06 spellthief 6 / eldritch master 2 07 spellthief 7 / eldritch master 3 08 spellthief 8 / eldritch master 4 09 spellthief 9 / eldritch master 5 10 spellthief 10 / eldritch master 6 11 spellthief 11 / eldritch master 7 12 spellthief 12 / eldritch master 8 13 spellthief 13 / eldritch master 9 14 spellthief 14 / eldritch master 10 15 -- from here on, you've got lots of options. now, I'm not quite the authority that others here have proven over time, but... the spelltheif mixed with eldritch master from dragon mag will allow for a wide range of spell access maxing at 6th level instead of 4th, and I'd really consider taking ranger and cleric spell lists as add ons for incredible buffing and healing. the spell theif will in time allow you to disable almost any annoying ability oponents have. take away thier spells, and then know their full spell list options at lvl 13, take spell resistance from them, immunities of your choice, so you can focus on energy type spells with confidence, and steal things like regeneration from oponents.. healing yourself while swiping their power to do so. very self reliant class when played well. I didn't go with any feat list because you can take any feats you want based on flavor... if this is what you want to do then we can look at style of play and make the selections from there. all spells will be cha based, as is UMD, so you only need to focus on cha, con and a combat stat... either str or dex. I'd go with str 14, dex 16. con 14, int 14, wis 12, cha 14 with 9 skill points each level, you can focus on diplomacy, sense motive, arcane kno, spellcraft, concentrate, spot, listen, hide, move silently. thi should allow you to cover nearly all the bases. If you want to do more skullduggery, switch out the cha skills... but as a solo adventure, you'll probably use diplomacy and sense motive often. the eldritch master has a role playing requirement that you be taught the class by something already in it that is mighty... that is a good motivation for your character to follow orders in a solo campaign. giving the DM permission to push you around a little makes them feel more secure that you won't stray too far from the plan. my .02 for what it's worth. Push gestalt. It will greatly expand your survivability.
the_taken 07-31-06, 01:07 AM	Don't need to be gestalt. A gish would be helpful though. But if you're realy out for the cheese be a human wizard that focuses on grappeling. At lvl1 you don't need spells, and you only need three stat; STR, CON and INT. Later on, melt spells like Polymorph for all their cheesyness. @ lvl10, anything near your CR is totaly pwnd in a grapple. Actual build aside, hire merceneries during the game. For a few sp a day, that's a steal. Make sure to take leadership get a cohort too. A chain of cohorts can go a long way.
PhaedrusXY 07-31-06, 01:11 AM	A kobold cloistered cleric. The kobold domain gives him Trapfinding as a rogue and Disable Device as a class skill. Take Trickery as your other domain, and you should be a decent skill-monkey, as well as being a full cleric. Rely on hiding alot at the lower levels, and your spells at the higher ones. Here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=665757) is a thread where this was discussed. And the best part is... you could roleplay him like Yoda. He is short, green, wise, and knowledgeable. Wear some brown robes, talk in backwards sentences all the time, and get a Brilliant Energy Sword and you'll have it. :D Edit: Ah crap. I just noticed the Core + Completes only. That makes it a bit more difficult. A human wizard with one level of rogue and able learner would work. Eventually, go with a Daggerspell Mage and/or Arcane Trickster based build.
Osedox 07-31-06, 01:27 AM	BeguilerX/LoremasterX/ArchmageX, max Int and Cha, get the highest possible ranks in UMD. If gestalt is available consider Monk with Kung Fu Genuis of course, for the other side and Arcane strike alot. BTW you dont have to beat monsters to get Xp for them, in fact if you are doing solo then most of your tactics should involve hiding, sniping, and tricking. That doesent leave alot of room for beat downs, so your Dm should allow you to gain Xp for avoiding encounters as much as facing them head on.
runestar 07-31-06, 01:36 AM	A druid would be nice, your animal companion would tank for you while you stand back and support with spells and summons. Scribe scroll is a must to expand your meagre repertoire of spell slots. A cleric might also be doable. I was thinking a fighter1 multiclassed to wizard. Eventually entering EK and spellsword.
ShneekeyTheLost 07-31-06, 02:11 AM	To be honest? Straight Druid. You have heals, you have pets, you have shapeshifting for melee, you can summon more allies as needed spontaniously, and you have okay nukes. Cherry Pick 2 levels of Rogue for Evasion, Trapfinding, and skillpoints. Congratulations, you're a solo-machine.
Zendu 07-31-06, 02:34 AM	rogue is more than doable if you pour into ranged combat quickly(or hire a tank) cleric/druid are both great choices, depends on if your facing undead, or simply like thespell repiotoire of cleric better. Bard is a horrible choice unless you plan on almost no fighting. A bard is a party monkey, making everyone better at what to do, and filling in niches, not for BEING the party.
Khan the Destroyer 07-31-06, 04:00 AM	A bard is a party monkey, making everyone better at what to do, and filling in niches, not for BEING the party. This is mostly true... I think. But, a bard does have the skill points to be stealthy, as well as the skill points influence NPC's and enemies with Bluff/Diplomacy. A half-elf bard can even end any encounter before it begins. EDIT: But for the record, I second Druid (probably with a Rogue dip and Able Learner). But if you had a larger book list, I might say Artificer.
WackyOne 07-31-06, 04:23 AM	I would second Rogue 1/Druid the rest (actually Ninja 1/Druid X, but that's the idea) if you can push Able Learner. If you can't, you could do it the same, but taking only Search, Disable Device, Open Locks, Spot & Listen as skills (Human with 12 Int). If you don't care about the "hidden" part of the campaign (so you can go without Search and Open Locks), pure Druid (will the animal companion be more useful than PrC goodies? I don't know) is really doable. It's the "most powerful" class in the game (Eberron excluded), after all! If you have any idea how to give trapfinding to your companion, you could try and use his skills for that... but I think it's unfeasible (maybe with Incarnum...)
Gargantuan_Ninja 07-31-06, 05:11 AM	2 levels of rogue/ninja to start, (Evasion/Invisibility @ 2nd lv, plenty of skill points, trapfinding, sneak att/sudden strikel) if you start rogue, druid would be good to go on with. Animal companion is great asset. or if you start Ninja, go cleric with magic domain..... lets you cast arcane wands/scrolls(no UMD for ninjas)... will give you a few more offensive options.dont forget the healing too! High Dex and Wisdom are important for both those options, Ninja'll let you add your Wis to AC, no need for armour. Int for more skill points, strength not that important, if you can rely on ranged attacks, although as your going solo, you might end up fighting a lot in melee, so it might come in handy! just dont make Charisma your dump stat, you'll need it for the negotiations!
SimiD 07-31-06, 06:06 PM	Wow. Thanks for all the suggestions. It looks like a consensus is forming for Rogue/Ninja moving into Druid /Cleric. I was thinking about this at work today, specifically considering Rogue with a two level Ranger dip to get some ranged combat ability and outdoorsey-type skills, then maybe a level or two of Fighter for some new feet(s), but it was taking way too long to get anywhere. I think Rogue-Druid is better. But maybe Cleric instead of Druid to get the Magic domain and some DMM-Persistant buffs. Leadership at L6 seems like a must - but last time I took it my cohort was always hopelessly overmatched, so I'm hesitant (different DM though). Sorry 'bout the brain dump. Its really hard for me to look ahead and identify what will be strong and what won't without knowing more about what I'll be needing to do. Keep those suggestions coming! Thanks again.
Riodrian 07-31-06, 09:12 PM	Monk/Druid and move into Sacred Fist.
tiercel 07-31-06, 09:16 PM	Honestly, I'm not so sure that you need Rogue to make Druid work as a solo character -- as far as traps go, that's what summon nature's ally is for :P Early on, you can use your summons as ... er, scouts. (Definitely NOT trapspringers. Only a callous druid would use the allies from nature to spring traps that will carve them into tiny, nugget-sized wolf chunks while sparing your own, more important PC flesh ;) ) Note that SNA II can get you a small elemental -- a little earth elemental can go earth gliding ahead to check for traps hidden in the wall/ceiling/doorframe without necessarily being a trapspringer. (Probably can do your "Disable Device" effectively by smashing up any devices from within the rock.) Yeah, it's not the same as being able to Search all the time, but let's be honest -- unless you are playing Tomb of Horrors, you aren't going to be Searching every 5'x5' square anyway. If you need a door or chest opened badly enough, you can use physical force or wood shape or stone shape. (If absolutely necessary, you can even use rusting grasp, though that's starting to get over the top most of the time.) There is a fair extent to which a Druid can "out-Rogue" the Rogue, especially in mid-levels and above. Early on you might not be able to handle the dungeon crawl quite as effectively in terms of stealth/trapfinding/lockpicking, but you will have many other tools at your disposal to make main force a viable option. Evasion is very nice and your saves are helped out by a couple Rogue levels, but I'm not sure if they are worth giving up a whole spell level for. Druid casting is quite good, and even better if you can use Spell Compendium -- but even the Complete books will help a fair bit. (Use those vigor-line spells from Complete Divine a lot -- they are about as efficient as healing gets, and don't lag behind cleric like the cure line does. It's out of combat healing, but much of healing is anyhow.) Also, the sooner you get to Druid 5-6 the sooner you can ignore your Str and Dex scores. Play like a mage-type spellcaster hiding behind your animal companion for the first few levels and you can pretty much afford to pour your point buy into Wis and then Con, with Int to taste. (This is one of the arguably unfair advantages of the Druid -- needing few ability scores. Of course, if you are using the unerrated wildshape, you don't even need Con -- Wis is the only score that really matters much once you hit the wildshaping levels. Without errata, there is an excellent case to be made that you should age your character for +mental -physical stats, since your physical stats don't matter when wildshaped.) -------- Now... this is if you are going to be playing a "normal" style campaign, just solo style. If I were going to be playing a solo game, though, I would be tempted to play a Rogue or Bard just because it would let me do the things with those characters that I couldn't do so much in a regular party. Let's face it -- you can only spend so much time sneaking or conniving in a normal D&D game because you tend to be operating on your own, leaving the other players out of the spotlight. So you tend to be limited a bit in the abilities you are best at. In a solo campaign, though, these types of characters could really shine -- a full-on stealth and/or intrigue game. I think such a game would be a lot of fun, but it depends how willing your DM is to run a game that is, to some extent, tailored to what your character is going to want to do (either of these characters would be much more urban creatures than "normal" for most PC parties) versus whether you are trying to make a character to survive the widest variety of challenges common to a generic game, only scaled down in CR appropriately. Yes... I know that there will be a spectrum of challenges no matter what. But if the DM doesn't have a preset railroad lined up for this solo campaign, it should be significantly different for a solo druid game versus a solo bard game.
Sang-Drax 07-31-06, 10:10 PM	I second the druid... they're easily the most versatile around. For extra versatility, a Ninja 1/Druid 7/Daggerspell Shaper 10/Contemplative 2 would be simply awesome. Divine Caster, Skill Monkey, Arcane Caster (just grab the Spell domain and the Domain Versatility feat), and high AC Tank all in one package! Honestly, though, I don't think DSShaper is as good as DSMage. It's just that you have to burn precious feat slots on feats you wouldn't pick otherwise. But it does mean versatility. On the other hand, I've just noted you're not allowed to use Spell Compendium (for the Spell domain)... that's too bad. A Bard gish wouldn't be all that bad either. Sure, you'd suffer on earlier levels, and it would only be good if you were starting at higher levels. A plain Bard 8/Paladin 2/Sublime Chord 2/Sacred Exorcist 4/Spellsword 1/Eldritch Knight 3 is a melee machine with 9th level spells and 10 levels of skill monkey. Just make sure you pick Devoted Performer, Divine Might, and Snowflake Wardance (but this one's from Frostburn). Clerics are always a nice choice. If you can, try to pick Cloistered Cleric (UA, but it's open game license IIRC and can be found in the net) for nifty skill points. Seeker of the Misty Isle is also a great boost to your skills and Ref save, with no loss of caster levels for the first 4 levels. Dweomerkeeper is also quite nice, but you'd need a FR feat or pick a level of Wizard.
FiestFan 07-31-06, 10:22 PM	Monk 1/Druid 9/Sacred Fist 10 Rogue 2/Warlock 8/Daggerspell Mage 10 Both are viable in a stand-up fight (the first somewhat more than the second) and highly survivable. They're also epic-ready, if you're into that sort of thing. ;)
jstorrie 07-31-06, 10:40 PM	Artificer 20.
Gerdreg 08-01-06, 08:19 AM	Are the "Races of" books available for use? Many people group them with the "Completes" when speaking about Core Rules (as they are on the Core list in the product section). If so, this may be a job for the Chameleon. If not, it's hard to ignore Cleric 20. You get Find Traps and can make a Find Traps Wonderous Item at level 3 if you have the rssources. It will let you Find Traps as a Rogue but not Disarm magical traps, but then again Dispel Magic or a simple cure spell may be more efficient for bypassing traps anyway.
jameswilliamogle 08-01-06, 10:42 AM	I vote Rogue 2 (Feat variant) / Druid 18, or Expert 2 / Druid 18 (although you aren't really supposed to combine generic and normal classes). Generic Spellcaster / Arcane Trickster could be nice, w/ no loss of caster levels (gotta pick Able Learner to do it, though). The beuty of this one is that you can pick spells from any of the major spell lists (ie, CLW, Find Traps, etc). You could even call them divine to wear armor, but then couldn't get into AT. I know UA isn't allowed, but it is SRD, so you may be able to convince the DM of the validity.