Post/Author/DateTime	Post
technochris81 07-30-06, 07:35 AM	my friend and i are going to PC a gestalt campaign. we want our characters to be as prepared as possible for everything our DM throws at us. so the question is, what is the best all-around gestalt duo and why? classes available: PHB, Expanded Psi, Complete x5, PHBII PHB races only thanks -chris
Ramaloke 07-30-06, 07:40 AM	Lawful Neutral Druid/Monk will totally rip stuff to shreds, you get all of your monk abilities in wild shape and a full caster class. Focus heavy on your mental stats (as your wildshape will replace your physical ones), eventually you can keep wildshaped all day and you are indeed, one scarry dude.
androcles 07-30-06, 10:00 AM	are you allowed access to magic of incarnum? if so, an amazing combo is the scout/totemist. if you shape the manticore belt and pump its essentia capacity to the maximum, then use all of your other melds for things that improve natural attacks, you could take a move action and then as a standard action unleash 8 tail spikes each dealing d6+str+5d6 skirmish+whatever you get from other melds. if you arent allowed incarnum then for gestalt you really cant beat a succubus/dread necromancer. this combo allows you to control over 400 HD of undead. to be more precise, 4+cha mod per level, so assuming an 18 at lvl 1 you would end up at level 20 with a charisma of 18+16(succubus)+5(lvls)+5(tome)+6(item)= 50 for a total undead controlingness of 24x20=480 HD. and thats a lot of damn hydra skeletons!!! but, if you are really limited in your choices i like the good old druid20/cleric20. with the amazing array of cleric buffs +divine persist cheese, and the druids buffs + wildshape you will outshine ANY tank there ever was!
technochris81 07-30-06, 10:07 AM	ok, as i said, i'm looking for TWO gestalt characters that will compliment each other nicely and cover each other's shortcomings for instance, your reply should look like this: one character should be a "blah/blah" while the other character should be a "blah/blah" this will cover all your bases because of "reason, reason, and reason" ***** and no, we can't use incarnum
Radijs 07-30-06, 11:00 AM	Wizard/Cleric - This will cover your spellcaster bases. Proceed into arcane hierophant (races of the wild) so you can cast arcane spells in armor. This way the character can also be in melee without dying too quickly. Barbarian/Rogue. A good hard hitter and a sneaky bastard with tons of HP all put together in one character. He can blow enemies away at the front line, and search for traps. That will cover IMO the most important basics, Healing, Magic, Trapfinder/skillmonkey and serious amounts of tankage.
RD_Imperialist 07-30-06, 11:14 AM	changeling rogue 4/warshaper 4/thief-acrobat 2/ninja 10//Cleric 10/ bone knight 10. He's good in a fight, full divine casting, loads of skills. and wizard 2/binder 1/anima mage 7/master transmogrifist 10//wizard 5/swashbuckler 3/binder 12. Full binding, full wizard casting, infinite variety. This is one of the most powerful possible gestalt characters.
Lo77o 07-30-06, 11:15 AM	I would strongly suggest druid/rogue and druid/sorc. If you both got 1 side druid your basicly sure you can sneak past or escape just about anything.
Ramaloke 07-30-06, 11:47 AM	Druid//Monk- Hard hitter, Healer, Great AC so Hard to Hit. Barbarian//Fighter, Beastly combatant, tons of feats +d12 and raging, ZOMG! or Fighter//Paladin, Great Combatant, Tons of Feats, some Divine Healing, Lay on Hands, Great Saves
ksbsnowowl 07-30-06, 12:03 PM	Indeed, Druid is amazing, and when gestalted with rogue, it will make you the perfect scout. Druid//Rogue - Perfect scouting ability, and the druid side comes with a built-in flanking buddy. Several low-level druid touch spells to maximize sneak attack, even against heavily armored foes (flame blade, produce flame). Once you hit level 5, you can also begin functioning as a heavy-hitting tank. You also have all good saves. Alternatively, be a Druid//Scout. Skirmish + pounce = lots of damage. But, some of the class abilities are redundant, and you have a flanking buddy anyway, so rogue is probably better. Though eventual Blindsight would be awesome. Were the Races of ... books allowed, I would have said a Dwarven Wizard/Runesmith//Warrior-type, as the runesmith PrC would have allowed you to ignore somatic components, and thus tank effectively. But alas, no Races of Stone, so I'm going to have to pretty well agree with the above poster, and say: Druid//Wizard - Wizards are often feeble and make big targets for the bad guys, but once you hit 6th level you can sling your spells from the sky in eagle form, keeping you out of the way from the big bruisers. Apply a suitable PrC to the wizard side. Druids are great on their own, but paired with gestalt they become more deadly. As was previously stated, you two will be able to make quick get-aways if things turn ugly (drop an obscuring mist, and then get out). Your ability to perform reconnaissance will be amazing (even a sole normal druid is tearing things up in the Red Hand of Doom adventure my group is currently running), and your mobility will also be astounding. If you are running a more wilderness setting, your ability to move freely through woods, while your enemies cannot, will be an amazing tactical advantage. You also up your effective party size via your animal companions, and you will both be able to summon more aid at the drop of a hat (spontaneous Summon Nature's Ally).
HaikenEdge 07-30-06, 01:31 PM	Warlock 20//Hexblade 3/Sorcerer 13/Fatespinner 4. Use the sorcerer's spells for utility and the warlock's invocations for firepower. I think this build is relatively fun to play as a caster; not much of a fighter Ardent 4/Slayer 9/Fighter 4/Swashbuckler 3//Ranger 4/Rogue 9/Assassin 7. The ultimate non-mundane killer, I like to think. Take the Conflict, Freedom and Magic mantles, and you'll be able to do a lot of things that'll leave spellcasters and manifesters whimpering in fear.
Slyver 07-30-06, 02:45 PM	I assume you are the only two in the group. If not, a lot of what I am about to say is not true. There are several things you need to make a functional group with just two characters: * trapfinding with the necessary skills and skill points to go with it * both characters need some function to tank with, whether it be themselves, summoned creatures or pets * both characters should have some healing capacity * both characters need to have reasonable damage capabilities The sheer number of ways to make a duo with all of those abilities is staggering. Something as simple as: Rogue 16/Fighter 2/Ranger 2//Cleric x/Cleric PRCs x (Not in that order)(2 weapon fighter with Razing strike in there somewhere and potentially DM persist cheese as well if you want) and Ardent 10/Slayer 10//Ranger 2/Monk 2/Psionic Warrior 2/Fighter 14 (or some variation) could be quite potent and fulfills all of the above. Druid is of course a nice gestalt as well. Since the AH is probably banned per the gestalt rules see if you can make a Druid//Wizard (with wiz prc's) with perhaps a feat (or DM just allowing it as a natural function of the two classes) that gives the AH ability to have both druid animal companion and wizard familiar abilites apply to the same animal. This will make for a decent tank as well as a powerful spellcaster and summoner in one character. If you are interested in any of the above builds, or if you want something with a specific flavor or alignment etc. let me know and I will try to whip something up. Slyver
PhaedrusXY 07-30-06, 02:46 PM	What level are you starting at and what stats are you using?
GMforPowergamers 07-30-06, 04:15 PM	Ok, here is mine... This is for magical Mercnaries: COmbat machine: Fighter//PsiWarrior Human Magic Machine: Duskblade//Cleric Human This is for all around Player 1 Monk//Warlock/Arcane Fist//Rouge Player 2 Wizard//Cleric/Mystic therurge//Psion or for the power game in us all: Player 1 1/2 Giant Barbrian//Sorcerer/Frenzy bezerker//Rage mage Player 2 Cleric//Monk/Tatto monk//Disciple of the fist
Ghenesh 07-30-06, 05:15 PM	Player 2 Wizard//Cleric/Mystic therurge//Psion Gestalt rules strongly recomends not to allow Mystic Theurge, Arcane Hierophant or any other PrC with double Spellcasting Progression. About the thread itself, i'd recomend you to think of the basic parts of the game: Mele Combat/Battlefield Control: you will definitely need a character with tons of HP and capable of controlling the center of the battlemap, combining a mele class and a divine spellcaster is a good idea. Blast: a Psion or Wizard should do fine. Utility: Almost any full spellcaster.
hogarth 07-30-06, 05:43 PM	My suggestions: Human Beguiler 20//Wizard 7/Fatespinner 4/Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil 7/Archmage 2 (trapfinder/arcane spellcaster) Human Druid 20//Cleric 6/Radiant Servant of Pelor 10/Sacred Exorcist 4 (everything else) Too bad Artificer is not available -- that would've replaced Beguiler above. :D
technochris81 07-30-06, 09:20 PM	What level are you starting at and what stats are you using? 1st level prolly 18, 16, 14, 12, 10, 8
Slyver 07-30-06, 11:18 PM	Those are pretty rough stats for gestalt. Great for a straight wiz or if you want to play druids, but for real multi-class, the way gestalt was intended, to help small parties survive, those stats are not very good. I would rather have 32 point buy over those, although for gestalt, 36 is ideal. Those stats add up to 38 points on a point buy system. Try to talk your DM into 36. It would also help us make more specific builds if we have more difinitive parameters of what you are looking for or what builds or ideas posted so far sound interesting to you. Slyver
Kirech 07-31-06, 01:38 AM	As this seems an interesting exercise, I thought I'd throw my two cents in. In a general sense, you want three things. For one, versatility. For another, synergy. For the third, the ability to do a lot with the few actions you are given. I like incarnum with gestalt, so the two character bases I'd recommend are Azurin Good Incarnate/Cleric and Duskling Totemist/Barbarian. Spells from the Incarnum domain help both characters, and the high constitutions will help both survive. Incarnum means you never have to have the same ability set two days in a row, so you can do what you need to do. Duskling Barbarians with extra Incarnum go really fast, and Totemist just adds injury to injury. If Incarnum is not to your liking, there's always the automatic Ultimate Combination: a pair of Cleric/Druids! Viva la CADzilla! Persistant Divine Power plus Wildshape! Spontaneous healing OR summoning! Did I mention the summoning? Because you're going to want to use it often, on account of your numbers deficiency. For a backstory, you could be a couple of eco-terrorist religious nuts of Obad-Hai or some other nature deity.
PhaedrusXY 07-31-06, 02:07 AM	Both Elans. One cleric//psywarrior, and the other rogue//psion(telepath). The Elan's racial abilities will help you survive the low levels, and neither character suffers from MAD. The cleric will be the main "tank" and healer, and the rogue will take care of skills, utility, and blasting. I'd consider a couple of levels of monk on the psywarrior side of the cleric, and three levels of swashbuckler and maybe some fighter for the rogue.
JaronK 07-31-06, 02:16 AM	Well, the strongest gestalt build is probably Druid/Cloistered Cleric... and two of them would be unstopable. However, if you want two different ones, have one be Druid/Cloistered Cleric, which covers... well... everything, and the other can be a Beguiler15/Shadowcraft Mage5//Swashbuckler3/Rogue 13/Scarlet Corsair3/Assassin1. That guy will be able to be an impressive arcane caster, with both utility spells and blast spells, as well as an excellent damage dealer with his swift action fients and occasional free action feints, plus 9d6 sneak attack. With the druid to tank and handle the outdoors, this guy can do some teleportation (yay Silent Image->Gate) and handle the diplomatic side... plus he can pump int and handle the skill monkey roll. Yehaw. Feel free to replace one cleric level with a level of monk on the druid/cleric, since the wisdom to AC, flurry, and save boosts will be useful. JaronK
hogarth 07-31-06, 10:28 AM	Rough builds: (18 Int) Beguiler 1//Wizard 1: Scribe Scroll(B), Spell Focus (Ench.), Skill Focus (Spellcraft) Beguiler 2//Wizard 2: Beguiler 3//Wizard 3: Sculpt Spell Beguiler 4//Wizard 4: Beguiler 5//Wizard 5: Craft Wondrous Item Beguiler 6//Wizard 6: Spell Focus (Abj.) Beguiler 7//Mindbender 1: Beguiler 8//Fatespinner 1: Beguiler 9//Fatespinner 2: Greater Spell Focus (Abj.) Beguiler 10//Iot7FV 1: Beguiler 11//Iot7FV 2: Beguiler 12//Iot7FV 3: Spell Penetration Beguiler 13//Iot7FV 4: Beguiler 14//Iot7FV 5: Beguiler 15//Iot7FV 6: Extraordinary Spell Aim Beguiler 16//Iot7FV 7: Beguiler 17//Archmage 1: Beguiler 18//Archmage 2: Quicken Spell Beguiler 19//Archmage 3: Beguiler 20//Archmage 4: (18 Wis) Druid 1//Cleric 1: Extra Turning, Quicken Spell Druid 2//Cleric 2: Druid 3//Cleric 3: Divine Metamagic (Quicken) Druid 4//Cleric 4: Druid 5//Cleric 5: Druid 6//Cleric 6: Natural Spell Druid 7//RSoP 1: Druid 8//RSoP 2: Druid 9//RSoP 3: Leadership Druid 10//RSoP 4: Druid 11//RSoP 5: Druid 12//RSoP 6: Empower Spell Druid 13//RSoP 7: Druid 14//RSoP 8: Druid 15//RSoP 9: Spell Penetration Druid 16//RSoP 10: Druid 17//Sacred Exorcist 1: Druid 18//Sacred Exorcist 2: Greater Spell Penetration Druid 19//Sacred Exorcist 3: Druid 20//Sacred Exorcist 4: Tactics: Use charm spells, battlefield control spells and summoned creatures to make sure that enemies never get near you. With two characters each with two full caster classes, you should never run out of spells. Just don't run into combat situations unprepared! Use spying, scrying and allies to do all your dirty work.
jameswilliamogle 07-31-06, 12:15 PM	I'm against builds that have too much spellcasting; too many options in the throws of combat can really bog down play. Simple things are sometimes the best. Druid 20 // Monk 20 is really easy, Warlock 20 (or Wizard 5 / IOTSV 7 / AM 3 / Fatespinner 4 / Mindbender 1) // Rogue 20 is also. You'd have all your healing, trapfinding, melee, arcane, and ranged in those 2 characters. UMD covers most arcane casting (I suggest taking Scribe Scroll, Craft Wonderous, and Craft Staff for the Warlock's Imbue Item ability). K.I.S.S.
TheHumanDynamo 07-31-06, 12:29 PM	Playing in a duo gestalt campaign right now, our party make up has been working AMAZINGLY. Paladin/Sorcer and Druid/Monk Both have ability to heal, you have arcane and divine spells covered, both have combat abilities, and both have synergy with ability scores.
Kirech 07-31-06, 12:46 PM	I'm against builds that have too much spellcasting; too many options in the [throes] of combat can really bog down play. Simple things are sometimes the best. With only two characters in the party, it's kind of hard for combat to 'bog down' no matter how many options you have. Also, it seems that people are a little too free with the one level dip into Mindbender. You all realize it requires nongood alignment, right? I just don't see one traveling with a Radiant Servant of Pelor, for example, hogarth. I only mention it because I didn't notice myself at first. I had a whole build worked out that required good and nongood alignment at the same time.
hogarth 07-31-06, 01:03 PM	With only two characters in the party, it's kind of hard for combat to 'bog down' no matter how many options you have. You took the words right out of my mouth! As well, if both party members are casting spells each round, combats might be a lot shorter than usual anyway. Also, it seems that people are a little too free with the one level dip into Mindbender. You all realize it requires nongood alignment, right? I just don't see one traveling with a Radiant Servant of Pelor, for example, hogarth. I only mention it because I didn't notice myself at first. I had a whole build worked out that required good and nongood alignment at the same time. I was aware of the "non-good" qualifier for Mindbender. You've never had a party with a Neutral character and a Neutral Good character before? You must be leading a sheltered life. ;) We're not talking about maintaining "exalted" status for anyone here, so it should be fine (in my opinion). Of course, I don't think there's anything wrong with a Druid/Monk and a Warlock/Rogue pair either (even though one must be LN and the other must be chaotic or evil). I'm willing to hop on the Druid/Monk bandwagon with everyone else. :)
carnivore 07-31-06, 02:44 PM	try this: Human CN Druid 20/ Warlock 20 Human CG Psion 20/ Warlock 10/ Harper Paragon 10 both have unlimited long range attacks,at will buffs, the Druid/Warlock would be great for tanking.....but with Metamorphosis...the Psion/Warlock could also. :D
hogarth 07-31-06, 03:37 PM	Note the list of books above (so no cloistered clerics, bone knights, anima mages or harper paragons).
Kirech 07-31-06, 03:38 PM	I was aware of the "non-good" qualifier for Mindbender. You've never had a party with a Neutral character and a Neutral Good character before? You must be leading a sheltered life. ;) We're not talking about maintaining "exalted" status for anyone here, so it should be fine (in my opinion). I'm aware that mixed-alignment parties can work, I just think that with only two party members the contrast is that much more apparrent. A RSoP tends to lean towards self-sacrifice and devotion to a higher cause. He just seems less likely to choose as his only travelling companion someone who makes free with the minds of others. I suppose it could work, but it seems that it would require some unnecessary doublethink and roleplaying gymnastics.
PhaedrusXY 07-31-06, 03:54 PM	I'm aware that mixed-alignment parties can work, I just think that with only two party members the contrast is that much more apparrent. A RSoP tends to lean towards self-sacrifice and devotion to a higher cause. He just seems less likely to choose as his only travelling companion someone who makes free with the minds of others. I suppose it could work, but it seems that it would require some unnecessary doublethink and roleplaying gymnastics.It could work just fine. Didn't you ever read the original Dragonlance books? Raisltlin wasn't exactly a bundle of joy, but the rest of the party was obviously good.
carnivore 07-31-06, 03:54 PM	Note the list of books above (so no cloistered clerics, bone knights, anima mages or harper paragons). opps......... :embarrass then just stick with the straight warlock 20..like this: Human CN Druid 20/ Warlock 20................focuses on Combat, healing, battlefield control Human CG Psion 20/ Warlock 20..................focuses on Transport, Information, Direct Damage, Ability damage :D
Surreal 07-31-06, 04:17 PM	I've been trying to come up with a duo idea that best makes use of a Druid/Heirophant's ability to transfer their wildshape powers to someone else. #1: druid/monk/heirophant/MoMF/whatever - maybe get both the shapeshift variant and wildshape from a secondary source (wildshaping ranger or monk, or abolisher, etc), because... why not? - you pass (one or both of) these abilities along to your partner while you rain down spells and summons #2: spellthief/psywar/something with wildshape/warshaper - get something that can wildshape, so you can meet the prereqs for Savage Grapple, which lets you inflict sneak attack damage with every grapple - combine with the crazy grappling abilities of the psywar, your massive form given to you from #1, the ability to steal buffs with spellthief, and hopefully high SA dice, you should be able to tear your enemy to shreds - maybe pick a race with SR - the mageslayer line of stuff would probably be good too - oh heck, go with the Teff. Shadowlord for shadow pouncey goodness I don't have a full breakdown, but mix and match stuff on the gestalt sides until you get what you like. Basically the druid hands off his wildshape powers to augment the psywar grappler who then proceeds to nullify the biggest threat/caster, while his summons keep the baddies at bay until the psywar can rip through the rest of them.
hogarth 07-31-06, 04:21 PM	It could work just fine. Didn't you ever read the original Dragonlance books? Raisltlin wasn't exactly a bundle of joy, but the rest of the party was obviously good. Or you could watch just about any "mismatched buddies" movie ever made. Your homework for tonight is to watch "The Odd Couple", "Lethal Weapon" and "The Good, The Bad And The Ugly". (This will be on the final exam.)
Pellanor 07-31-06, 04:23 PM	Of of the favorite builds I saw on here a while back was a Favoured Soul 20 // Sorcerer 5 / Geomancer 10 / Arcane PrC 5. That one gives you a ton of spontanious casting, the ability to cast arcane spells in armor, all good saves, a d8 HD, some special abilities like Energy Resistance and Weapon Focus, uses Cha for all casting, and has some funcky drifts and such. If you take a level of Sacred Exorsist for the arcane casting PRC, you'll pick up Turning, allowing you to power divine feats like Persist. I would then suggest a Barb // Rogue type character for the other one. This one will give you the skills and raw, non-magiced fighting power, and should work fairly well. You'll want to pick up Steadfast Determination with this guy, to boost his will saves. You might want to make this one a Barbarian 10 / Frenzied Berserker 10 // Scout 15 / Thief Acrobat 5, in order to make him really mobile. Hope that helps.
jameswilliamogle 07-31-06, 04:38 PM	Corey Feldman 10 / Sarah Michelle Geller 10 // Arnold Scharznegger 7 / Matt Damon 5 / Brad Pitt 5 / Steven Segal 3 Full BAB, undead control, and can take a lickin.
Slyver 07-31-06, 04:53 PM	Corey Feldman 10 / Sarah Michelle Geller 10 // Arnold Scharznegger 7 / Matt Damon 5 / Brad Pitt 5 / Steven Segal 3 Full BAB, undead control, and can take a lickin. Why are you dropping out of Schwarzenegger at 7? One more level and he gets Terminate. I would drop 1 level of Segal. After two levels it gets nothing new, just the same crap over and over. Otherwise, a damn nice build. Slyver
jameswilliamogle 07-31-06, 04:55 PM	Why are you dropping out of Schwarzenegger at 7? One more level and he gets Terminate. I would drop 1 level of Segal. After two levels it gets nothing new, just the same crap over and over. SlyverYou're right; drop 2 levels of Segal and add 2 level of Schwarzenegger for "Terminate" and "Crom!" Su abilities. I think we can all agree that the 10th level ability "Governator" is not worth it, though.
stmunks 07-31-06, 04:58 PM	Why not try for a Psychic Warrior 20/Druid 20? High Wisdom works well for both classes, lots of nifty Claw and buff powers that you can use while wildshaped (and a nice way to get around the "no spellcasting PERIOD" prohibition on the PHB II Shapeshift variant), and feats galore. Or, if you want to get more creative with the same theme: Psychic Warrior10/Elocator 10//Druid 10/Nature's Warrior5/Warshaper5 Much lower spellcasting and somewhat lower manifesting ability, but this works particularly well with the PHB II Shapeshift rules: you will be an absolute MONSTER on the battlefield in terms of damage, mobility, and control. Swap out a couple of Psychic Warrior levels for Monk, and now you have an obscene AC and Evasion to boot.
Pellanor 07-31-06, 05:17 PM	Here's another fun idea. Have each of the characters as Changelings with 5 levels of Warshaper, and 10 levels of Chameleon. Whatever else you take doesn't really matter, as now you can have 8 different parties in two handy characters. Then go and take leadership as well, and each get another changeling warshaper chameleon minion. Then confuse the hell out of all the NPCs.
Khazra Reborn 07-31-06, 05:28 PM	human wizard6/incanatrix10/archmage4 // rogue2/monk2/swashbuckler3/duskblade13 Take carmendine monk and able learner. Its a decent fighter, a strong fullcaster and takes great advanatage of being able to get 18 in 1 stat (int). favoured soul10/walker in the wastes10 // ranger6/blackguard3/marshal1/chameleon10 Pick up the TWF tree inc. TWpounce/rend. Get some slippers of battledancing and use them and over the top aura for a powerful charge. In addition your a fullcaster casting on cha, with cha to HP, saves, damage, attack and a huge cha (+6boon) to make full use of it.
Kreistor1 07-31-06, 05:48 PM	With only two party members, you need your characters to be able to cast all Cleric and Wizard spells between them. The only way to do that right now is Cleric and Wizard. Warlock, Favored Soul, Sorcerer, etc. are all out the window. You also need a Trapfinding class, but that doesn't need to be the Rogue. Both characters need a HP pool. For the first, I'd go Scout/Wizard, and go very high Dex. If you build for 16 Dex, take a +2 Dex race (plenty of those around), and go Cat's Grace round 1/+4 Dex item, you can get your Dex way up there. Mithral Buckler gives you shield AC and keeps that free hand for casting, and all you need to do is take that move action after casting for 10' and you get Skirmish AC. I think there's a lot of synergy there. Open Locks will be Cross Class, but you can take Knock to help there. The compliment for this is Knight/Cleric. You're seldom going to see Flank, so no worries about that little loss. This guy wants to call the opponents over to him so that the Wizard can massacre the little guys. You could also try Knight/Wizard with Scout/Cleric. The K/W Gish wants to be heavily armored. I did an Adamantine bodied Warforged that way. I solved the ASF by using Still Spell, Sudden Still, and Verbal only spells. That puts the Cleric behind the frontliner keeping him vertical, instead of relying on the Tank to heal himself.
kilroo 07-31-06, 09:28 PM	Personally I'm kinda fond of having a Spellthief on one side and a Warlock on the other, and borrowing stuff from each other. (Hey, if you were both Spellthief//Warlocks, you could have pretty much every useful invocation!) Some mutation of Warlock//Druid and Spellthief//Duskblade might be interesting. Especially if someone could make it...you know...good.
Lilt 08-01-06, 11:58 AM	Well the first thing to do is to check with your DM as to wether or not multiclassing penalties are being applied. Many of the builds I've seen listed here would be at big XP penalties unless you're negating such rules (which the gestalt rules do not say to do). I'd probably go with somethign like Wizard//Rogue and a Druid//Monk. The Druid is obviously the tank and healer, whilst the wizard/rogue is there for blasting/utility and traps/backup healing through UMD. There are good stat synergies on both of them, and both can have very good BABs if you're willing to branch out into high-BAB classes. In the case of the Wizard/Rogue, consider trying to fit Swashbuckler 3 in there on the rogue side for even more int synergy. Also lots of people have been ignoring the OPs explicit limitations, or limitations from the gestalt rules. IE: remember no non-PHB races and no combination classes like mystic theurge. That said, there's no harm in testing the water when things aren't specified. If you're allowed the races books then a Chameleon goes great in gestalt and isn't forbidden in the same way that Mystic Theurge and Arcane Trickster are.
RD_Imperialist 08-01-06, 12:07 PM	Why not try for a Psychic Warrior 20/Druid 20? High Wisdom works well for both classes, lots of nifty Claw and buff powers that you can use while wildshaped (and a nice way to get around the "no spellcasting PERIOD" prohibition on the PHB II Shapeshift variant), and feats galore. Or, if you want to get more creative with the same theme: Psychic Warrior10/Elocator 10//Druid 10/Nature's Warrior5/Warshaper5 Much lower spellcasting and somewhat lower manifesting ability, but this works particularly well with the PHB II Shapeshift rules: you will be an absolute MONSTER on the battlefield in terms of damage, mobility, and control. Swap out a couple of Psychic Warrior levels for Monk, and now you have an obscene AC and Evasion to boot. only one prestige class at a time.
Pellanor 08-01-06, 12:34 PM	*snip*Whoops. For some odd reason I read Complete X as Complete X and Races of X. I guess I'm just used to anybody who has one, having the other. Though the Chameleon is available online (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20041210b&page=1), so it may still be good. You are right about the multiclassing penalties though. You'll have to be careful with them. Generally I try to take only one base class per side of the build, and make sure one of the two is a favoured class, or keep them within a level of eachother.
reel_big_gish 08-01-06, 12:43 PM	Cleric 13 / Radiant Servant of Pelor 7 // Sorceror 4 / Geomancer 10 / Sorceror 8 / Paladin 2 Feats: Extend Spell, Persistent Spell, Divine Metamagic: Persistent Spell, extra Turning (5) - 9th level arcane & divine - Cha synergy - Divine Metamagic for arcane spells - No Arcane Spell Failure - No expensive material components
Lilt 08-01-06, 02:04 PM	Cleric 13 / Radiant Servant of Pelor 7 // Sorceror 4 / Geomancer 10 / Sorceror 8 / Paladin 2 Feats: Extend Spell, Persistent Spell, Divine Metamagic: Persistent Spell, extra Turning (5) - 9th level arcane & divine - Cha synergy - Divine Metamagic for arcane spells - No Arcane Spell Failure - No expensive material componentsI can't see any way to do that legally. To get that build you need to take 2 PrCs at the same time which isn't allowed under gestalt rules. You might want to also use a better notation as it looks like the second half of the build is 4 levels over after taking 12 sorcerer levels. Instead of Sorcerer 8 you might want to put Sorcerer 4 or Sorcerer +4.
hogarth 08-01-06, 02:12 PM	I can't see any way to do that legally. To get that build you need to take 2 PrCs at the same time which isn't allowed under gestalt rules. You're right -- it needs to be RSoP 6, not 7, since he can't enter Geomancer sooner than Cleric 4//Sorceror 4 (if he wants to use Sorceror). The bigger problem is that RSoP == Neutral Good, Paladin == Lawful Good.
Pellanor 08-01-06, 02:58 PM	You're right -- it needs to be RSoP 6, not 7, since he can't enter Geomancer sooner than Cleric 4//Sorceror 4 (if he wants to use Sorceror). The bigger problem is that RSoP == Neutral Good, Paladin == Lawful Good.So wait, the bigger problem is that TRUE, TRUE. How's that make sense?
hogarth 08-01-06, 03:24 PM	double post
hogarth 08-01-06, 03:24 PM	So wait, the bigger problem is that TRUE, TRUE. How's that make sense? ...you can't be a Radiant Servant of Pelor and a Paladin at the same time as reel_big_gish suggested.
Rerednaw 08-01-06, 03:36 PM	Because I think the Warlock is cool... Warlock 20/Rogue 20 (invocate invisibility all day long and get sneak attacks with your eldritch blasts.) Warlock 20/Warmage 20 (blast all day long.) Cleric 20/Wizard 20. 'nuff said. Or if you like tanking... Cleric 20/Druid 20.
reel_big_gish 08-01-06, 03:51 PM	That's what I get for adding paladin in as an afterthought. I also used wizard originally, hence the geomancer progression would have finished at 13. so cleric 14 / radiant servant of pelor 6 // sorceror 4 / geomancer 10 / sorceror +6 Given the limitations on books, that's what I would go with. Otherwise, Archivist 14 / Contemplative 1 (Sun Domain) / Radiant Servant of Pelor 1 / Archivist +4 // Wizard 3 / Geomancer 6 / Sacred Exorcist 1/ Geomancer +4 / Wizard+1 / Fatespinner 5 Feats: Extend Spell (human), Persistent Spell (1st), Open Feats (3rd, 6th, 9th), Divine Metamagic: Persistent (12th), Extra Turning (15th), Exra Turning (18th), Bonus Metamagic Feat (Archivist 10), Bonus Metamagic Feat (Wizard 5) Nightsticks are your friends. I chose Fatespinner because it's better than vanilla wizard levels, and it requires no feats to gain entrance. Do somethign else with it if you like; you have more than enough feats to spare on entry requirements.
Omnirahk, half-Rahkshi 08-01-06, 04:59 PM	Monk//Fighter. Monk is a decent melee class on its own, and fighter adds all the bonus feats and full BAB. Of course you'll probably want to replace fighter with a fighter-type PrC soon enough. Maybe Exotic Weapon Master if you want to focus on one of your kata weapons instead of unarmed. Fighter//Rogue. Sneak attack with melee mastery. 'Nough said. Beguiler//Warmage. You're awesome at trickery and damage spells. Psion/Crystal Master//Swashbuckler. INT to damage. In Crystal Master, embed the gems that give DR, AC, quick-healing, and the like. Swashbuckler//Warmage. By level 3 you're adding INT to melee and spell damage. Hexblade//Paladin of Slaughter, if you can be evil. You'll be adding CHA to yours saves and the DC's of your spells, while putting your opponent at a penalty to AC and saves. With the right feats, enemies could also be at penalties to attack and damage rolls. Completely disable them. Paladin//Sorcerer. Say hello to the advantages of high CHA. Hexblade//Warlock. High CHA aids your spells and invocations. Maybe not the best one here, actually. Paladin//Monk. WIS governs spells and AC. If you think you can afford the MAD, you'll be nigh untouchable by sword and spell. Cleric//Druid. WIS governs both. And with all those spells, it doesn't matter how much spontaneous curing you do. Anything//Any LA race. This is iffy at best. But if you're gaining class levels early, good enough. I'm sure there's more. Look for classes or PrCs that grant a bonus to saves/AC/etc based on an ability modifier and gestalt with a class that uses that as a main feature.