Best starting race for each class? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Best starting race for each class? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Kanachi
12-20-06, 10:44 AM Hiya, I'm sure this has already been done, but I was just wondering what peoples opinions were on which race is best for each base class. So pick a base class and a race and list why you think its the best opption, lets see how many of the classes we can cover!

Thanks!
rilem
12-20-06, 10:50 AM You need to be more specific -- what books are you including? There are more than 30 base classes now, and many more races. Are you considering Racial Substitution Levels? LA Buyoff? Monstrous Races?
Balthanon
12-20-06, 11:00 AM Classes with intimidate are going to have a major advantage, so you might as well not even consider the others. Barbarians, fighters, and rogues are obviously going to be our classes of choice. No overt advantage in Charisma scores among the base races, however, as usual humans do have the advantage with their feat bonus for Skill Focus (Intimidate) and possibly Nymph's Kiss.

On the other hand, if we expand out into the classes in Tome of Battle, the book that gave us the rules for staring contests (i.e. Duel of Wills), you could always go with a dwarven or mongrelfolk warblade or swordsage with Unnerving Calm and maxed out Concentration. After 3rd level and a Skill Focus (Concentration), they may be able to catch up due to their racial stat bonus.

;)
Kanachi
12-20-06, 12:05 PM You need to be more specific -- what books are you including? There are more than 30 base classes now, and many more races. Are you considering Racial Substitution Levels? LA Buyoff? Monstrous Races?

I was just interested in building up a general list of which races are best for each of the 30 odd base classes. As for Racial Substitution Levels and LA Buyoff its probably best not to include these as not every DM allows them. As for books, anything thats wizards material and not 3rd party. After that I think pritty much anything goes as long as its humanoid enough to be a viable character in a game of dnd.

I just think a useful list could be made to help new/newish players see which races best suit the class they want to go for.
jameswilliamogle
12-20-06, 12:06 PM Well, I'll try contributing. I'll go w/ LA / ECL +0 races.

Whisper Gnome for Beguiler: sneaky synergies, good stats, and qualifies for Shadowcraft Mage. Forest Gnome is a good core second choice, for similar reasons, and you don't lose any Cha either.

Orc Barbarian: BIG strength. Take the Bear Totem Barbarian variant, and Roll-with-It if SS is allowed, to start boosting DR from 1st level.

Kobold Sorcerer: Dragonwrought for +9 to mental stats at 1st, free Draconic Heritage (no familiar), and effective access to spell levels as a Wizard at 6th. I like to mix with Draconic Breath and Entangling Exhalation, then focus on utility spells, but to each there own.

Spellscale Metamagic Specialist Sorcerer: Also costs your familiar, but you get free metamagics every day (your choice) that free up some potential feat slots for PrC qualification and such. A solid choice.

Human Binder: With so many ways to build a binder, the extra feat and skill points go a long way to get milage out of a tough character to optimize.

Whisper Gnome Rogue: see above for Beguiler.

Human Warlock: Feat intensive, although not as skill dependent, and qualifies the character for Chameleon PrC. Strongheart is a close, close second, and superior if you are focusing on just blasting and no item creation.

Desert Half-Orc OR Desert Dwarf Dragon Shaman OR Dragonfire Adept: Con dependent breath weapons, Cha side abilities, these races give bonuses to Con w/o penalizing Cha. There's specific instances where other races are better, but these are good general choices.

Grey Elf Wizard (no specialty): Gets 4 free spells per level for leveling up, and an extra +2 Int to boot. Definitely worth the extra feat a Human would've had.

Strongheart Halfling Druid: All Druids are feat intensive, and small size doesn't hurt you once you can Wildshape, and helps in the early levels when your size helps your AC and attack mod. Human comes in second, for the feat.

Dwarf Fighter: Iconic. Axe focus is great, easily qualifies for Deepwarden without trouble, and good movement in heavy armors. A great first strike character. Human is better if you want to do a trip-focused build, but the Powerful Build and Large races are even better for that, and its a very focused build, as well.

Humans are great choices unless you want to enter a race-specific PrC at some time later.
rilem
12-20-06, 12:42 PM What James said, mostly.

Though really, there's too many variables to make any decent comparison in many cases. Whisper Gnome or Halflings make great rogues, unless you want a bruiser melee rogue, in which case Half-Orc is quite good. You can continue this ad infinitum. As such, the specific class guidebooks are probably a better source for this.

But here goes:

Artificer: Human (or Warforged with sub feats)

Barbarian: Warforged or Half-Orc.

Bard: Half-Elf (with sub-levels). Human without.

Knight: Dwarf (w/o Cha penalty)

Ninja: Strongheart Halfling. Ninjas like throwing things.

Rogue: Duergar (LA +1). Stealthy and good in combat, too. And who cares about poisoned traps?

Samurai: Azurin. Bonus feat and Incarnum helps the class greatly.

Soulknife: Kalashtar
hogarth
12-20-06, 12:59 PM The best staring race for any class is beholder, naturally. With eleven eyes, they can outstare pretty much anyone!
rilem
12-20-06, 01:14 PM Nah, a hydra beats that.
jameswilliamogle
12-20-06, 01:32 PM Half-elf Bard: Kick-ass Diplomacy. 'nuff said.
nobodez
12-20-06, 01:32 PM You might want to take a peek at the Appendix to PHB2. It's got a list of about two dozen classes and a preferred race for each (it's also got the "Races" books in there as well for those that allow it). Actually, that appendix is fairly nice for picking stuff out, though some of the builds are questionable (Favored Soul with Spontaneous Healer?).
nittanytbone
12-20-06, 02:34 PM Cleric:

1) Human (for feats & skills)
2) Dwarf (excellent for durability, good if NOT using DMM or Turn Undead due to low Cha - racial substitution levels available in Races of Stone)
3) Elf (Cleric-Archer)
4) Half-Orc (penalty to int hurts already low SP, penalty to cha hurts Turn Undead attempts, making it hard to fuel DMM)
5) Small Races: Good for a heavily spell-oriented cleric, otherwise don't bother.
6) Half-Elf: Only use if you're pursuing a diplomacy oriented build.
6) Bottom Line: Anything without LA!
Coffee_Dragon
12-20-06, 03:13 PM Base races - a lost cause?

There was a time people used to stick to their starting race for their entire adventuring career, now it seems the trend is to cherry pick, take a little dwarf here, a little elf there, some weird gnome subrace in between. Is it because WotC keeps pumping out new supplements with new races and multiplying the number of possibilities and combinations? Some DMs straight out disallow multiracing. Others allow pretty much anything saying that a character is its flavour, not its mechanics.

Discuss.
WalkenDude
12-20-06, 03:19 PM Best Barbarian=Shifter
carnivore
12-20-06, 04:48 PM Psion.....Kalashtar..or Human..or Empty Vessel

:D
Zemyla
12-20-06, 06:30 PM Unless you really need skills, I find that azurins and silverbrow humans outdo normal humans.
Hesparex
12-20-06, 11:14 PM One interesting race is a dream dwarf for a sorcerer (especially if you are allowed to use the Dwarven substitution levels)
hogarth
12-20-06, 11:41 PM Dwarf Fighter: Iconic. Axe focus is great, easily qualifies for Deepwarden without trouble, and good movement in heavy armors. A great first strike character. Human is better if you want to do a trip-focused build, but the Powerful Build and Large races are even better for that, and its a very focused build, as well.

I kind of like the Synad race for a fighter-type build. You get +2 to Will saves, access to psionic feats, aberration type (immunity to charm person, hold person, etc.), darkvision, a floating +2 insight bonus 1/day, and a couple of less useful abilities. Seems like a fair replacement for the human bonus feat!
aelryinth
12-21-06, 12:53 AM You might want to take a peek at the Appendix to PHB2. It's got a list of about two dozen classes and a preferred race for each (it's also got the "Races" books in there as well for those that allow it). Actually, that appendix is fairly nice for picking stuff out, though some of the builds are questionable (Favored Soul with Spontaneous Healer?).

For Taking cure minor wds as a level 0 spell, you add ALL the Heal spells as spells castable for your levels...effectively, you can outheal a cleric, and never need to spend precious spell slots on healing spells.

It's a very good feat for Favored Souls who, like Sorcs, need to max out spells possible.

====Aelryinth
Votan
12-21-06, 01:36 AM Hiya, I'm sure this has already been done, but I was just wondering what peoples opinions were on which race is best for each base class. So pick a base class and a race and list why you think its the best opption, lets see how many of the classes we can cover!

Thanks!

Elf Ranger. You get all of those racial benefits to spotting and searching (you actually use the auto-detect secret doors because you'll have skill ranks in it). As an archer in light armor you are not going to notice the lost CON but you'll love the high dexterity. With the rich 3.5 skill points, this is a great option.

However, it does rather suggest bow specialist; I am a little less clear about two weapon fighting specialists.
X-Codes
12-21-06, 02:54 AM Nah, a hydra beats that.
Abberations rule over all others in staring contests, hogarth just picked the wrong one.

The real winner is GIBBERING MOUTHER! :D

EDIT: Seriously... enough making fun of the OP now... at least for me.

The best race for any base class depends entirely on what you intend to do with that class. Incarnum could be blended into Dragon Shamans very effectively (especially if your DM gives you Azure Touch), more so with an Azurin or Duskling for their natural essentia, or you could focus on being secondary tank as a Goliath and max out your Str and Con for damage output.

Barbarian Chargers always want more strength, so Orc goes best with them. On the other hand, Barbarian Trippers need more feats, so Humans or Azurins are the ways to work with them. Half-Orcs also do well with Barbarian levels as Menacers.
Surreal
12-21-06, 03:32 AM Abberations rule over all others in staring contests, hogarth just picked the wrong one.

The real winner is GIBBERING MOUTHER! :D
How about the Living Wall? (2ed I think)
neceros
12-21-06, 04:10 AM Human.
Balthanon
12-21-06, 06:00 AM EDIT: Seriously... enough making fun of the OP now... at least for me.

It probably would have stopped by now already if he had corrected the original post. :)
Hastifer
12-21-06, 07:55 AM Actually, despite all the aberrations mentioned, no one has thought of using Care Bears.
WombleHunter
12-21-06, 09:36 AM They get Abomination traits too.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Kanachi 12-20-06, 10:44 AM	Hiya, I'm sure this has already been done, but I was just wondering what peoples opinions were on which race is best for each base class. So pick a base class and a race and list why you think its the best opption, lets see how many of the classes we can cover! Thanks!
rilem 12-20-06, 10:50 AM	You need to be more specific -- what books are you including? There are more than 30 base classes now, and many more races. Are you considering Racial Substitution Levels? LA Buyoff? Monstrous Races?
Balthanon 12-20-06, 11:00 AM	Classes with intimidate are going to have a major advantage, so you might as well not even consider the others. Barbarians, fighters, and rogues are obviously going to be our classes of choice. No overt advantage in Charisma scores among the base races, however, as usual humans do have the advantage with their feat bonus for Skill Focus (Intimidate) and possibly Nymph's Kiss. On the other hand, if we expand out into the classes in Tome of Battle, the book that gave us the rules for staring contests (i.e. Duel of Wills), you could always go with a dwarven or mongrelfolk warblade or swordsage with Unnerving Calm and maxed out Concentration. After 3rd level and a Skill Focus (Concentration), they may be able to catch up due to their racial stat bonus. ;)
Kanachi 12-20-06, 12:05 PM	You need to be more specific -- what books are you including? There are more than 30 base classes now, and many more races. Are you considering Racial Substitution Levels? LA Buyoff? Monstrous Races? I was just interested in building up a general list of which races are best for each of the 30 odd base classes. As for Racial Substitution Levels and LA Buyoff its probably best not to include these as not every DM allows them. As for books, anything thats wizards material and not 3rd party. After that I think pritty much anything goes as long as its humanoid enough to be a viable character in a game of dnd. I just think a useful list could be made to help new/newish players see which races best suit the class they want to go for.
jameswilliamogle 12-20-06, 12:06 PM	Well, I'll try contributing. I'll go w/ LA / ECL +0 races. Whisper Gnome for Beguiler: sneaky synergies, good stats, and qualifies for Shadowcraft Mage. Forest Gnome is a good core second choice, for similar reasons, and you don't lose any Cha either. Orc Barbarian: BIG strength. Take the Bear Totem Barbarian variant, and Roll-with-It if SS is allowed, to start boosting DR from 1st level. Kobold Sorcerer: Dragonwrought for +9 to mental stats at 1st, free Draconic Heritage (no familiar), and effective access to spell levels as a Wizard at 6th. I like to mix with Draconic Breath and Entangling Exhalation, then focus on utility spells, but to each there own. Spellscale Metamagic Specialist Sorcerer: Also costs your familiar, but you get free metamagics every day (your choice) that free up some potential feat slots for PrC qualification and such. A solid choice. Human Binder: With so many ways to build a binder, the extra feat and skill points go a long way to get milage out of a tough character to optimize. Whisper Gnome Rogue: see above for Beguiler. Human Warlock: Feat intensive, although not as skill dependent, and qualifies the character for Chameleon PrC. Strongheart is a close, close second, and superior if you are focusing on just blasting and no item creation. Desert Half-Orc OR Desert Dwarf Dragon Shaman OR Dragonfire Adept: Con dependent breath weapons, Cha side abilities, these races give bonuses to Con w/o penalizing Cha. There's specific instances where other races are better, but these are good general choices. Grey Elf Wizard (no specialty): Gets 4 free spells per level for leveling up, and an extra +2 Int to boot. Definitely worth the extra feat a Human would've had. Strongheart Halfling Druid: All Druids are feat intensive, and small size doesn't hurt you once you can Wildshape, and helps in the early levels when your size helps your AC and attack mod. Human comes in second, for the feat. Dwarf Fighter: Iconic. Axe focus is great, easily qualifies for Deepwarden without trouble, and good movement in heavy armors. A great first strike character. Human is better if you want to do a trip-focused build, but the Powerful Build and Large races are even better for that, and its a very focused build, as well. Humans are great choices unless you want to enter a race-specific PrC at some time later.
rilem 12-20-06, 12:42 PM	What James said, mostly. Though really, there's too many variables to make any decent comparison in many cases. Whisper Gnome or Halflings make great rogues, unless you want a bruiser melee rogue, in which case Half-Orc is quite good. You can continue this ad infinitum. As such, the specific class guidebooks are probably a better source for this. But here goes: Artificer: Human (or Warforged with sub feats) Barbarian: Warforged or Half-Orc. Bard: Half-Elf (with sub-levels). Human without. Knight: Dwarf (w/o Cha penalty) Ninja: Strongheart Halfling. Ninjas like throwing things. Rogue: Duergar (LA +1). Stealthy and good in combat, too. And who cares about poisoned traps? Samurai: Azurin. Bonus feat and Incarnum helps the class greatly. Soulknife: Kalashtar
hogarth 12-20-06, 12:59 PM	The best staring race for any class is beholder, naturally. With eleven eyes, they can outstare pretty much anyone!
rilem 12-20-06, 01:14 PM	Nah, a hydra beats that.
jameswilliamogle 12-20-06, 01:32 PM	Half-elf Bard: Kick-ass Diplomacy. 'nuff said.
nobodez 12-20-06, 01:32 PM	You might want to take a peek at the Appendix to PHB2. It's got a list of about two dozen classes and a preferred race for each (it's also got the "Races" books in there as well for those that allow it). Actually, that appendix is fairly nice for picking stuff out, though some of the builds are questionable (Favored Soul with Spontaneous Healer?).
nittanytbone 12-20-06, 02:34 PM	Cleric: 1) Human (for feats & skills) 2) Dwarf (excellent for durability, good if NOT using DMM or Turn Undead due to low Cha - racial substitution levels available in Races of Stone) 3) Elf (Cleric-Archer) 4) Half-Orc (penalty to int hurts already low SP, penalty to cha hurts Turn Undead attempts, making it hard to fuel DMM) 5) Small Races: Good for a heavily spell-oriented cleric, otherwise don't bother. 6) Half-Elf: Only use if you're pursuing a diplomacy oriented build. 6) Bottom Line: Anything without LA!
Coffee_Dragon 12-20-06, 03:13 PM	Base races - a lost cause? There was a time people used to stick to their starting race for their entire adventuring career, now it seems the trend is to cherry pick, take a little dwarf here, a little elf there, some weird gnome subrace in between. Is it because WotC keeps pumping out new supplements with new races and multiplying the number of possibilities and combinations? Some DMs straight out disallow multiracing. Others allow pretty much anything saying that a character is its flavour, not its mechanics. Discuss.
WalkenDude 12-20-06, 03:19 PM	Best Barbarian=Shifter
carnivore 12-20-06, 04:48 PM	Psion.....Kalashtar..or Human..or Empty Vessel :D
Zemyla 12-20-06, 06:30 PM	Unless you really need skills, I find that azurins and silverbrow humans outdo normal humans.
Hesparex 12-20-06, 11:14 PM	One interesting race is a dream dwarf for a sorcerer (especially if you are allowed to use the Dwarven substitution levels)
hogarth 12-20-06, 11:41 PM	Dwarf Fighter: Iconic. Axe focus is great, easily qualifies for Deepwarden without trouble, and good movement in heavy armors. A great first strike character. Human is better if you want to do a trip-focused build, but the Powerful Build and Large races are even better for that, and its a very focused build, as well. I kind of like the Synad race for a fighter-type build. You get +2 to Will saves, access to psionic feats, aberration type (immunity to charm person, hold person, etc.), darkvision, a floating +2 insight bonus 1/day, and a couple of less useful abilities. Seems like a fair replacement for the human bonus feat!
aelryinth 12-21-06, 12:53 AM	You might want to take a peek at the Appendix to PHB2. It's got a list of about two dozen classes and a preferred race for each (it's also got the "Races" books in there as well for those that allow it). Actually, that appendix is fairly nice for picking stuff out, though some of the builds are questionable (Favored Soul with Spontaneous Healer?). For Taking cure minor wds as a level 0 spell, you add ALL the Heal spells as spells castable for your levels...effectively, you can outheal a cleric, and never need to spend precious spell slots on healing spells. It's a very good feat for Favored Souls who, like Sorcs, need to max out spells possible. ====Aelryinth
Votan 12-21-06, 01:36 AM	Hiya, I'm sure this has already been done, but I was just wondering what peoples opinions were on which race is best for each base class. So pick a base class and a race and list why you think its the best opption, lets see how many of the classes we can cover! Thanks! Elf Ranger. You get all of those racial benefits to spotting and searching (you actually use the auto-detect secret doors because you'll have skill ranks in it). As an archer in light armor you are not going to notice the lost CON but you'll love the high dexterity. With the rich 3.5 skill points, this is a great option. However, it does rather suggest bow specialist; I am a little less clear about two weapon fighting specialists.
X-Codes 12-21-06, 02:54 AM	Nah, a hydra beats that. Abberations rule over all others in staring contests, hogarth just picked the wrong one. The real winner is GIBBERING MOUTHER! :D EDIT: Seriously... enough making fun of the OP now... at least for me. The best race for any base class depends entirely on what you intend to do with that class. Incarnum could be blended into Dragon Shamans very effectively (especially if your DM gives you Azure Touch), more so with an Azurin or Duskling for their natural essentia, or you could focus on being secondary tank as a Goliath and max out your Str and Con for damage output. Barbarian Chargers always want more strength, so Orc goes best with them. On the other hand, Barbarian Trippers need more feats, so Humans or Azurins are the ways to work with them. Half-Orcs also do well with Barbarian levels as Menacers.
Surreal 12-21-06, 03:32 AM	Abberations rule over all others in staring contests, hogarth just picked the wrong one. The real winner is GIBBERING MOUTHER! :D How about the Living Wall? (2ed I think)
neceros 12-21-06, 04:10 AM	Human.
Balthanon 12-21-06, 06:00 AM	EDIT: Seriously... enough making fun of the OP now... at least for me. It probably would have stopped by now already if he had corrected the original post. :)
Hastifer 12-21-06, 07:55 AM	Actually, despite all the aberrations mentioned, no one has thought of using Care Bears.
WombleHunter 12-21-06, 09:36 AM	They get Abomination traits too.