Blackguard(ish) character(help optimize!) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Blackguard(ish) character(help optimize!) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
aeginotu
02-04-07, 04:52 PM Ok. Here's my idea.
2 Paladin of Tyranny/4 Hexblade/4 Blackguard/3 Rogue/1 Fighter(Variant for Sneak attack (http://tinyurl.com/2tb54t))/1 Swordsage/1 Nightsong Enforcer/2 Marshall
I need 5 more classes that all give Sneak die at level 1, the more with full BAB the better. I had it planned out to level 20, but my friend pointed out it was a third party book, ruling out five other classes(Specifically the book was Ultimate Prestige Classes 1 from Mongoose publishing).

But the bonus these levels give me is:
+3 times my charisma bonus to all saves(Divine Grace, Arcane Resistance, and Dark Blessing. No bonus type is named so it should stack). With a high charisma this makes saves easy.

Mettle and Evasion means any save for half or partial effect is instead negated, and with three times a high charisma to saves(at least +10, if you put a good stat into it) that makes a bunch of spells inefficient to use(although there are spells without saving throws, I'll just have to tack on some silly low LA templates for immunities).

So basically, I want to crank up this character with five more classes that give Sneak dice at level one for a level 20 total of 11d6(Using Assassin's Stance constantly as a Swordsage) and as much BAB as possible. Any alternative or better ideas for a similar effect are always welcome.
Xaktsaroth
02-04-07, 05:17 PM The Craven feat from CoR would give you an extra 1d6 SA.

There are some feats from CScoud that let you sac SA damage for some interesting effects.

There's also a weapon enchantment that gives you an extra 2d6 SA, but I'll be damned if I can't remember the name.
Momar
02-04-07, 05:28 PM The Craven feat from CoR would give you an extra 1d6 SA.

There are some feats from CScoud that let you sac SA damage for some interesting effects.

There's also a weapon enchantment that gives you an extra 2d6 SA, but I'll be damned if I can't remember the name.

Isn't craven + level damage to SA? Deadly precision provides +2d6 SA for a +2 from CA.
PhaedrusXY
02-04-07, 05:33 PM Ok. Here's my idea.
2 Paladin of Tyranny/4 Hexblade/4 Blackguard/3 Rogue/1 Fighter Variant for Sneak attack (http://tinyurl.com/2tb54t))/1 SwordsageDoesn't this have an XP penalty? There are very few classes that give both +1d6 sneak attack and +1 bab at first level (for good reason).
aeginotu
02-04-07, 05:34 PM Yeah it should, I personally don't know the rules on XP penalties for multiclassing though.
Blade2718
02-04-07, 05:43 PM Yeah it should, I personally don't know the rules on XP penalties for multiclassing though.20% penalty on XP for having nonfavored base classes more than a level apart.

Nightsong Enforcer has +1 BAB and +1d6 Sneak Attack. I believe Scar Enforcer does as well.
aeginotu
02-04-07, 05:57 PM Ouch, well not a big deal after the first one. What book(s) are the enforcers from?
ChristopherGroves
02-04-07, 06:01 PM Dread Commando (heroes of battle) is a full BAB + sneak class.

With all that Charisma, consider adding in some Marshal - there's an aura that lets you add your CHA to damage while flanking and as long as your CHA is 16+ you're doing very close to the same thing. Dunno, Marshal is something I always consider in CHA builds.
aeginotu
02-04-07, 06:27 PM Well, the problem with the Dread Commando(and the Ninja for that matter) is that it has sudden strike, not sneak attack. Sudden strike doesn't go off from flanking which I figured would be the main method of damage.
ChristopherGroves
02-04-07, 06:30 PM Lemme suggest Marshal again. +CHA to damage when flanking (but no BAB at first level).
aeginotu
02-04-07, 06:42 PM I'll probably take 1 Marshal then. The extra 4+ damage is great and can do more than a sneak die with a bit of twinking.
EDIT: Also Scar Enforcer is only for Half-Elves and I was to be a Lesser Aasimar.
ChristopherGroves
02-04-07, 06:50 PM I'd strongly consider Marshal 2 ... the second Marshal level lets you add one to your melee to-hit as a major aura (in addition to the BAB increase). As long as your BAB is over 16 by 20 it's effectively the same as a BAB increase.
aeginotu
02-04-07, 07:07 PM I'll go with Marshall 2 as well, I've got two more levels till 18 and have 15 BAB. Anything with sneak dice is good :)

EDIT: How about Assassin 5? Gives me a sneak die, no BAB though.
agonybloods
02-05-07, 08:15 AM Assassin gives a few arcane spells, as well as death attack. Death Attack is only really useful if you max assasin and have a high Int modifier. If you really want more sneak attack, take more rogue instead of assassin.
Father Tim
02-06-07, 01:32 PM 20% penalty on XP for having nonfavored base classes more than a level apart.

Actually, it's a 20% penalty per base class that is more than one level off your highest base class (favoured class is ignored for these purposes). So if the original build is human, Hexblade is ignored and net result is a 40% XP penalty due to Fighter and Swordsage levels being two less than Rogue.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
aeginotu 02-04-07, 04:52 PM	Ok. Here's my idea. 2 Paladin of Tyranny/4 Hexblade/4 Blackguard/3 Rogue/1 Fighter(Variant for Sneak attack (http://tinyurl.com/2tb54t))/1 Swordsage/1 Nightsong Enforcer/2 Marshall I need 5 more classes that all give Sneak die at level 1, the more with full BAB the better. I had it planned out to level 20, but my friend pointed out it was a third party book, ruling out five other classes(Specifically the book was Ultimate Prestige Classes 1 from Mongoose publishing). But the bonus these levels give me is: +3 times my charisma bonus to all saves(Divine Grace, Arcane Resistance, and Dark Blessing. No bonus type is named so it should stack). With a high charisma this makes saves easy. Mettle and Evasion means any save for half or partial effect is instead negated, and with three times a high charisma to saves(at least +10, if you put a good stat into it) that makes a bunch of spells inefficient to use(although there are spells without saving throws, I'll just have to tack on some silly low LA templates for immunities). So basically, I want to crank up this character with five more classes that give Sneak dice at level one for a level 20 total of 11d6(Using Assassin's Stance constantly as a Swordsage) and as much BAB as possible. Any alternative or better ideas for a similar effect are always welcome.
Xaktsaroth 02-04-07, 05:17 PM	The Craven feat from CoR would give you an extra 1d6 SA. There are some feats from CScoud that let you sac SA damage for some interesting effects. There's also a weapon enchantment that gives you an extra 2d6 SA, but I'll be damned if I can't remember the name.
Momar 02-04-07, 05:28 PM	The Craven feat from CoR would give you an extra 1d6 SA. There are some feats from CScoud that let you sac SA damage for some interesting effects. There's also a weapon enchantment that gives you an extra 2d6 SA, but I'll be damned if I can't remember the name. Isn't craven + level damage to SA? Deadly precision provides +2d6 SA for a +2 from CA.
PhaedrusXY 02-04-07, 05:33 PM	Ok. Here's my idea. 2 Paladin of Tyranny/4 Hexblade/4 Blackguard/3 Rogue/1 Fighter Variant for Sneak attack (http://tinyurl.com/2tb54t))/1 SwordsageDoesn't this have an XP penalty? There are very few classes that give both +1d6 sneak attack and +1 bab at first level (for good reason).
aeginotu 02-04-07, 05:34 PM	Yeah it should, I personally don't know the rules on XP penalties for multiclassing though.
Blade2718 02-04-07, 05:43 PM	Yeah it should, I personally don't know the rules on XP penalties for multiclassing though.20% penalty on XP for having nonfavored base classes more than a level apart. Nightsong Enforcer has +1 BAB and +1d6 Sneak Attack. I believe Scar Enforcer does as well.
aeginotu 02-04-07, 05:57 PM	Ouch, well not a big deal after the first one. What book(s) are the enforcers from?
ChristopherGroves 02-04-07, 06:01 PM	Dread Commando (heroes of battle) is a full BAB + sneak class. With all that Charisma, consider adding in some Marshal - there's an aura that lets you add your CHA to damage while flanking and as long as your CHA is 16+ you're doing very close to the same thing. Dunno, Marshal is something I always consider in CHA builds.
aeginotu 02-04-07, 06:27 PM	Well, the problem with the Dread Commando(and the Ninja for that matter) is that it has sudden strike, not sneak attack. Sudden strike doesn't go off from flanking which I figured would be the main method of damage.
ChristopherGroves 02-04-07, 06:30 PM	Lemme suggest Marshal again. +CHA to damage when flanking (but no BAB at first level).
aeginotu 02-04-07, 06:42 PM	I'll probably take 1 Marshal then. The extra 4+ damage is great and can do more than a sneak die with a bit of twinking. EDIT: Also Scar Enforcer is only for Half-Elves and I was to be a Lesser Aasimar.
ChristopherGroves 02-04-07, 06:50 PM	I'd strongly consider Marshal 2 ... the second Marshal level lets you add one to your melee to-hit as a major aura (in addition to the BAB increase). As long as your BAB is over 16 by 20 it's effectively the same as a BAB increase.
aeginotu 02-04-07, 07:07 PM	I'll go with Marshall 2 as well, I've got two more levels till 18 and have 15 BAB. Anything with sneak dice is good :) EDIT: How about Assassin 5? Gives me a sneak die, no BAB though.
agonybloods 02-05-07, 08:15 AM	Assassin gives a few arcane spells, as well as death attack. Death Attack is only really useful if you max assasin and have a high Int modifier. If you really want more sneak attack, take more rogue instead of assassin.
Father Tim 02-06-07, 01:32 PM	20% penalty on XP for having nonfavored base classes more than a level apart. Actually, it's a 20% penalty per base class that is more than one level off your highest base class (favoured class is ignored for these purposes). So if the original build is human, Hexblade is ignored and net result is a 40% XP penalty due to Fighter and Swordsage levels being two less than Rogue.