Blue Mage Optimization [Archive] - Wizards Community

Blue Mage Optimization [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
TheDarkFuzz
01-12-06, 06:45 AM I saw this class (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=137596), I fell in love with it, I thought it would be interesting to see what an optimized version looked like.

10 levels, 32 point buy.
TheDarkFuzz
01-12-06, 07:22 PM Anyone?
Bounces
01-12-06, 07:41 PM The power of the blue mage is directly proportional to his spells known list. As such max out int and spell craft.

He needs to find a cleric to cast the cure spells on him. Then he needs to find a friendly mage to cast suggestion, charm person, and dominate person on him. He needs to willingly fail his saves and then do the spell craft check. If he fails then lather rinse and repeat. (At max ranks level 10 you are looking at a 18 in your spell craft...19 if you have a 20. The DC to learn dominate person will be 30 which means you have just under a 50% chance of learning it. Rough...but if you are friends with a real mage then he should be happy to help you improve your spell list.

After you have your healing spells and your mind control spells you can go shopping for spells as you wish. Just dominate, charm, or suggest your enemy and get them to sling spells at you. Fail or you save on purpose (or in the case of save for half spells go ahead and take the save...no point in getting fried for no reason) and then take your spellcraft check. Once again, lather, rinse, and repeat. I would suggest avoiding your save or die spells...since, well, you don't want to die! :)

Really once you have a spell list of every spell in existence what feats you take don't matter. Optimizing a blue mage is easy...it just takes time.
system breaker
01-12-06, 07:41 PM Now, I'm far from a CO genius, but this class seems utterly sucktacular from a CO perspective. From an "I'm obsessed with FF" perspective, it seems like this would be a load of fun.

I personally think Sorcs are the weakest Core primary caster (maybe worst in game besides Warmage), and the Blue Mage seems to me to be nothing more than a weakened Sorc that's dependent on two ability scores instead of one, but that gets 2 more skill points/level.

I read through the class really quickly, and so I am sorry if I made any mistakes due to this.
TheDarkFuzz
01-12-06, 07:52 PM I've played a blue mage in an RL game, from 8th to 10th level, and I've found that while the class looks like a weakened sorc he actually ends up being pretty strong.

The thing is, even though his spells known are limited, he can buy scrolls and cast them on himself to improve it, which means multi-use scrolls. For instance, he buys a scroll of 6th level Fireball then goes into battle. He's got a spelllist full of utility and no blasts, but that's not a problem: he just casts the scroll spell and gets in the radius to learn fireball, then spends the next three rounds slinging 10th level fireballs like nobody's business.
SoulGamit
01-12-06, 08:39 PM Be undead and take the Power to Burn feat... you are now the most powerful caster in existence. Seriously... that feat is just wrong.

Mage of the Arcane Order seems like a really good idea for the class if you want to be independant, since you can then learn as many sorc/wizard spells as you want at no real cost to yourself. I'd only take 7 levels though.

Alternatively, have an artificer (or a 12th level warlock) cohort and just have him whip up scrolls for you to learn spells from.

Over all, I'd say Blue Mage 5 / Mage of the Arcane Order 7 / Blue Mage 5 / Archmage 3 is a nice build, you can replace Archmage if you want though.
system breaker
01-12-06, 08:43 PM Mage of the Arcane Order seems like a really good idea for the class if you want to be independant, since you can then learn as many sorc/wizard spells as you want at no real cost to yourself.

Now that's an excellent idea. This gets around the major drawback of this class without having to rely on anyone else.

The Power to Burn feat my also be a good idea, but I am unfamiliar with it.
SoulGamit
01-12-06, 08:50 PM Power to Burn is a custom feat in the thread that has the blue mage.
TheDarkFuzz
01-12-06, 09:30 PM POWER TO BURN [General]
Prerequisites: Endurance, Ability to cast Arcane spells spontaneously, Int 13, Cha 13
Benefit: You can cast one of your spontaneous spells using a lower level spell slot than would normally be required for that spell, including any Metamagic effects. The spell's level remains the same. Other requirements must still be met (knowledge of the spell, sufficiently high casting stat).
For each level the slot is below the required level, you take 1d6 Intelligence damage and 1d6 Charisma damage. (This damage takes place after the resolution of the spell, and thus does not affect spell DCs, and cannot be healed by the spell cast.) If either Intelligence or Charisma is reduced to 0 by this damage, the shock to your system is immediately fatal unless you succeed at a Fortitude save, DC = 10 + 5 times the number of spell levels exceeded.
Normal: You can only use a spell slot to cast a spell of equal or lower level.

There ya go.
IceFractal
01-12-06, 09:58 PM Undead are only immune to physical ability damage, so they wouldn't be that much better at using Power to Burn. Sure, they wouldn't die from it, but they'd still become an imbecile pretty fast. Now if it was ability drain, then we'd be talking.

Anyway, Mage of the Arcane Order seems like the best idea so far, but if you don't want to spend the levels on it, then a spellcaster cohort with a couple Chameleon levels who takes Extra Spell as the variable feat would eventually let you pick up any spells you wanted.
Antendren
01-12-06, 10:01 PM Be undead and take the Power to Burn feat... you are now the most powerful caster in existence.Being undead doesn't protect you from either intelligence or charisma damage.

Really once you have a spell list of every spell in existence what feats you take don't matter.That's not possible. The class has a very firm restriction on how many spells you can know at any given time.
TheDarkFuzz
01-12-06, 11:57 PM True dat about the limited spells known. But the MotAO has that whole spellpool thing, which means a mage could grab the spell they wanted, cast it on themselves, make their check and add it to their list in two rounds. Switching out spells in 12 seconds is a damn sight more versatile than the sorcerer.
SoulGamit
01-13-06, 10:11 AM Did not know that about undead. Still, voidmind would work, and I'm sure there's a spell somewere that can make you immune to ability damage. LoP's Dirty Trick #4 lists a bunch of ways I think.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
TheDarkFuzz 01-12-06, 06:45 AM	I saw this class (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=137596), I fell in love with it, I thought it would be interesting to see what an optimized version looked like. 10 levels, 32 point buy.
TheDarkFuzz 01-12-06, 07:22 PM	Anyone?
Bounces 01-12-06, 07:41 PM	The power of the blue mage is directly proportional to his spells known list. As such max out int and spell craft. He needs to find a cleric to cast the cure spells on him. Then he needs to find a friendly mage to cast suggestion, charm person, and dominate person on him. He needs to willingly fail his saves and then do the spell craft check. If he fails then lather rinse and repeat. (At max ranks level 10 you are looking at a 18 in your spell craft...19 if you have a 20. The DC to learn dominate person will be 30 which means you have just under a 50% chance of learning it. Rough...but if you are friends with a real mage then he should be happy to help you improve your spell list. After you have your healing spells and your mind control spells you can go shopping for spells as you wish. Just dominate, charm, or suggest your enemy and get them to sling spells at you. Fail or you save on purpose (or in the case of save for half spells go ahead and take the save...no point in getting fried for no reason) and then take your spellcraft check. Once again, lather, rinse, and repeat. I would suggest avoiding your save or die spells...since, well, you don't want to die! :) Really once you have a spell list of every spell in existence what feats you take don't matter. Optimizing a blue mage is easy...it just takes time.
system breaker 01-12-06, 07:41 PM	Now, I'm far from a CO genius, but this class seems utterly sucktacular from a CO perspective. From an "I'm obsessed with FF" perspective, it seems like this would be a load of fun. I personally think Sorcs are the weakest Core primary caster (maybe worst in game besides Warmage), and the Blue Mage seems to me to be nothing more than a weakened Sorc that's dependent on two ability scores instead of one, but that gets 2 more skill points/level. I read through the class really quickly, and so I am sorry if I made any mistakes due to this.
TheDarkFuzz 01-12-06, 07:52 PM	I've played a blue mage in an RL game, from 8th to 10th level, and I've found that while the class looks like a weakened sorc he actually ends up being pretty strong. The thing is, even though his spells known are limited, he can buy scrolls and cast them on himself to improve it, which means multi-use scrolls. For instance, he buys a scroll of 6th level Fireball then goes into battle. He's got a spelllist full of utility and no blasts, but that's not a problem: he just casts the scroll spell and gets in the radius to learn fireball, then spends the next three rounds slinging 10th level fireballs like nobody's business.
SoulGamit 01-12-06, 08:39 PM	Be undead and take the Power to Burn feat... you are now the most powerful caster in existence. Seriously... that feat is just wrong. Mage of the Arcane Order seems like a really good idea for the class if you want to be independant, since you can then learn as many sorc/wizard spells as you want at no real cost to yourself. I'd only take 7 levels though. Alternatively, have an artificer (or a 12th level warlock) cohort and just have him whip up scrolls for you to learn spells from. Over all, I'd say Blue Mage 5 / Mage of the Arcane Order 7 / Blue Mage 5 / Archmage 3 is a nice build, you can replace Archmage if you want though.
system breaker 01-12-06, 08:43 PM	Mage of the Arcane Order seems like a really good idea for the class if you want to be independant, since you can then learn as many sorc/wizard spells as you want at no real cost to yourself. Now that's an excellent idea. This gets around the major drawback of this class without having to rely on anyone else. The Power to Burn feat my also be a good idea, but I am unfamiliar with it.
SoulGamit 01-12-06, 08:50 PM	Power to Burn is a custom feat in the thread that has the blue mage.
TheDarkFuzz 01-12-06, 09:30 PM	POWER TO BURN [General] Prerequisites: Endurance, Ability to cast Arcane spells spontaneously, Int 13, Cha 13 Benefit: You can cast one of your spontaneous spells using a lower level spell slot than would normally be required for that spell, including any Metamagic effects. The spell's level remains the same. Other requirements must still be met (knowledge of the spell, sufficiently high casting stat). For each level the slot is below the required level, you take 1d6 Intelligence damage and 1d6 Charisma damage. (This damage takes place after the resolution of the spell, and thus does not affect spell DCs, and cannot be healed by the spell cast.) If either Intelligence or Charisma is reduced to 0 by this damage, the shock to your system is immediately fatal unless you succeed at a Fortitude save, DC = 10 + 5 times the number of spell levels exceeded. Normal: You can only use a spell slot to cast a spell of equal or lower level. There ya go.
IceFractal 01-12-06, 09:58 PM	Undead are only immune to physical ability damage, so they wouldn't be that much better at using Power to Burn. Sure, they wouldn't die from it, but they'd still become an imbecile pretty fast. Now if it was ability drain, then we'd be talking. Anyway, Mage of the Arcane Order seems like the best idea so far, but if you don't want to spend the levels on it, then a spellcaster cohort with a couple Chameleon levels who takes Extra Spell as the variable feat would eventually let you pick up any spells you wanted.
Antendren 01-12-06, 10:01 PM	Be undead and take the Power to Burn feat... you are now the most powerful caster in existence.Being undead doesn't protect you from either intelligence or charisma damage. Really once you have a spell list of every spell in existence what feats you take don't matter.That's not possible. The class has a very firm restriction on how many spells you can know at any given time.
TheDarkFuzz 01-12-06, 11:57 PM	True dat about the limited spells known. But the MotAO has that whole spellpool thing, which means a mage could grab the spell they wanted, cast it on themselves, make their check and add it to their list in two rounds. Switching out spells in 12 seconds is a damn sight more versatile than the sorcerer.
SoulGamit 01-13-06, 10:11 AM	Did not know that about undead. Still, voidmind would work, and I'm sure there's a spell somewere that can make you immune to ability damage. LoP's Dirty Trick #4 lists a bunch of ways I think.