Brb1/Ftr6/Dwarven Defender10/-???- [Archive] - Wizards Community

Brb1/Ftr6/Dwarven Defender10/-???- [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
johniemi
02-28-04, 01:48 PM I have a character who is now a *Feral dwarf Barbarian1/Fighter4. I have discussed with my GM and he lets me play a lawful good barbarian so no need to comment on the alignment. But the thing to comment would be; What 3 levels should I take as my last levels (18-20) before I go epic?

I'm building him as a strong fighter, like a jack-of-all-trades, because he has good Bab, good AC etc. He is wielding a battleaxe (like a bastard sword, but an axe) and uses a tower shield sometimes if the situatuon calls for better defending.

So a shorter version of the same question:

What 3 levels should I take as my last 3 levels? Fighter would be obvious but as I would be taking the fighter levels 7-10, it wouldn't be very beneficial as fighters only get 1 feat in those three levels (+1 for reaching character level 18 but that's not the point)

Frenzied berserker would be cool, and would add to the "barbarian" side of the character but I would have to take two feats I would otherwise never take (Destructive Rage and Intimidating Rage). Opinions??

(*Feral as the template from Savage species, basically LA+2, fast healing 2, con +4, str +4 and some other things)

-John
Masque
02-28-04, 02:33 PM I think barbarian and dwarven defender have alignment issues.

If you're wanting more defense, maybe you should take up a few levels of paladin. If you have a decent Cha, the bonuses to your saves would be pretty spiffy during your defensive stance, you'd get even more bonuses to save vs fear, and lay of hands is always a nice back up.

-M
pawsplay
02-28-04, 03:44 PM The only alignment "issues" is that a Lawful barbarian can't range, which is not a big deal. He could take exactly two levels of Paladin before facing an XP penalty. Frenzied Berserker will not work because of the loss of the ability to rage.

I'd say three levels of Exotic Weapon Master and do hurtful things with the dwarven waraxe.
Mawtaw
02-28-04, 04:23 PM have a character who is now a *Feral dwarf Barbarian1/Fighter4. I have discussed with my GM and he lets me play a lawful good barbarian so no need to comment on the alignment. But the thing to comment would be; What 3 levels should I take as my last levels (18-20) before I go epic?

Did you guys not read his first paragraph of his post. He asked his GM and he said it was fine to have a lawful barbarian and whatever the GM says goes. So stop going on about the alignment issue.

Just me.
pawsplay
02-28-04, 08:20 PM He just said LG barbarian was okay. He didn't say anything about raging while LG.
johniemi
02-29-04, 12:52 AM Ok to clear this up; My GM says that a lawful good barbarian is OK and he can rage. We decided this because the book Exalted Deeds has a rage/frenzy feat called "Righteous Wrath" that would indicate that lawful good characters can rage, as long as it used as an instrument for divine or good things. So basically, I would only be allowed to rage in battles against evil creatures, but the campaign is actually so black and white that all my opponents will be evil beings so that's not a problem. Also the fact that I will only take one barbarian level and that I will really have to focus hard on the roleplaying side of a lawful good are reasons why my DM gave me some slack and let me take (one level!) of lawful (good) barbarian. Playing a lawful good should be a little harder than f.ex. chaotic neutral, who really just MAY do what he feels is right for himself, but a lawful good HAS to do what is good for others as well.

More comments, I will check out the exotic weapon master later today.

-John
TaisharMalkier
02-29-04, 01:57 AM Zug Zug.

"My GM says that a lawful good barbarian is OK and he can rage. We decided this because the book Exalted Deeds has a rage/frenzy feat called "Righteous Wrath" that would indicate that lawful good characters can rage, as long as it used as an instrument for divine or good things."

You realize exalted characters can be any good, right?

Cheers
BenjCano
02-29-04, 04:00 AM Oh boy. This thread is circling...circling....circling. Give the guy a break, will ya?

Have a look at the Battlerager from Races of Faerun. It has an alignment requirment of non-lawful, and the ability to rage as a prerequisite, but you shouldn't have a problem convincing your DM to permit it. It requires a few odd skills, but nothing you couldn't afford, and feats that aren't at odds with your character at all. Power Attack, Cleave, and Endurance.

For your 3 levels, you get two extra rages per day, a bonus to Intimidate (yay), increased bonuses against poison, the Close-Quarters Fighting feat (lets you avoid a grapple by making an AoO against anything that tries to grab you with improved grab), immunity to fear, bonus to save against enchantments, and the Improved Unarmed Strike feat.
johniemi
02-29-04, 05:08 AM Originally posted by TaisharMalkier
Zug Zug.

You realize exalted characters can be any good, right?

Cheers

Yep, but as I was allowed to take;
1) Feral template
2) lawful barbarian (with all abilities)
3) dwarven defender who can rage in defensive stance

Thus we agreed that to balance these with a rule that my player would be lawful good, and should really be true to his alignment. I'm not saying it's a drawback but... well... doing bad things is usually beneficial (cheating in money games, persuading someone to do something and benefitting from it, picking pockets etc etc.) and now my character cannot do these "bad" things but must throw himself in danger everytime someone needs help.

-John

-John
noneedforagain
03-01-04, 01:18 PM isnt a prerequ for Dwarven defneder the Bab of 7 ? that means you HAVE to have it prior to becoming the darven defneder..

that means 1 bar/6 fighter then dwarven defnder at 8th lvl.

or am I completelye wrong ?

thanks, MArk
johniemi
03-01-04, 01:54 PM Originally posted by noneedforagain
isnt a prerequ for Dwarven defneder the Bab of 7 ? that means you HAVE to have it prior to becoming the darven defneder..

that means 1 bar/6 fighter then dwarven defnder at 8th lvl.

or am I completelye wrong ?

thanks, MArk

Oops! Thanks for pointing that out. I have changed my build to;

Bar1/Ftr6/Exotic Weapon master1/Dw.Defender10

I'm taking the exotic weapon master level just for the x2 to STR when using two-handed attack, "uncanny blow". (And the BaB +1 so now I would have Bab +7)

But anyway, as you can see I'm still missing two levels, my build is now 18 levels, and I need two levels of... something...

Exotic weapon master seemed good at first but there was only one special ability that I liked (uncanny blow; STR bonus x2) but the others don't fit in with my character.

So I will probably fill the last two levels with Ftr levels, I will get one Ftr feat so that's ok for me, and besides, I don't like the idea of taking lots of prestige classes, because it eats away the "prestige" :)

The reason I was able to take only 1 level of exotic weapon master is that it's a 3-level class anyway, so I am actually taking 33% of the class so that doesn't sound as bad as taking one level of a 10-level class :)

-John
PhaedrusXY
03-01-04, 02:20 PM Originally posted by noneedforagain
isnt a prerequ for Dwarven defneder the Bab of 7 ? that means you HAVE to have it prior to becoming the darven defneder..

that means 1 bar/6 fighter then dwarven defnder at 8th lvl.

or am I completelye wrong ?

thanks, MArk He has barb1/ftr6/DD10 in the title of the thread. I'm not sure what you're talking about.
pawsplay
03-02-04, 06:49 PM Exotic weapon master seemed good at first but there was only one special ability that I liked (uncanny blow; STR bonus x2) but the others don't fit in with my character.

What about exotic sunder? Everyone likes exotic sunder.

But I think I like this better. Two levels of Knight Protector. You get Iron Will for free and a shining beacon ability. Tactical Soldier also works.
Cloakable
03-02-04, 07:56 PM To me a Barbarian/Dwarven Defender just sounds plain stupid.

"Aaargh! I am very mad at you now and becaus of it I am going to stand here, RIGHT HERE!!! RAAARGH!"

eerhnm? :P

Oh well, back to your question.
What about taking 2 Barbarian levels?
If i´m not mistaken 3 levels of Barbarian gives you rage 2/day, Trapsense +1 and Uncanny Dodge (Dex to Ac)

Sure you have Uncanny Dodge from the Dwarven Defender (But its called something else) but another Rage/day isnt so bad. And the barbarian gets 4+int mod skills per level :)

Just my 2pp:s :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
johniemi 02-28-04, 01:48 PM	I have a character who is now a Feral dwarf Barbarian1/Fighter4. I have discussed with my GM and he lets me play a lawful good barbarian so no need to comment on the alignment. But the thing to comment would be; What 3 levels should I take as my last levels (18-20) before I go epic? I'm building him as a strong fighter, like a jack-of-all-trades, because he has good Bab, good AC etc. He is wielding a battleaxe (like a bastard sword, but an axe) and uses a tower shield sometimes if the situatuon calls for better defending. So a shorter version of the same question: What 3 levels should I take as my last 3 levels? Fighter would be obvious but as I would be taking the fighter levels 7-10, it wouldn't be very beneficial as fighters only get 1 feat in those three levels (+1 for reaching character level 18 but that's not the point) Frenzied berserker would be cool, and would add to the "barbarian" side of the character but I would have to take two feats I would otherwise never take (Destructive Rage and Intimidating Rage). Opinions?? (Feral as the template from Savage species, basically LA+2, fast healing 2, con +4, str +4 and some other things) -John
Masque 02-28-04, 02:33 PM	I think barbarian and dwarven defender have alignment issues. If you're wanting more defense, maybe you should take up a few levels of paladin. If you have a decent Cha, the bonuses to your saves would be pretty spiffy during your defensive stance, you'd get even more bonuses to save vs fear, and lay of hands is always a nice back up. -M
pawsplay 02-28-04, 03:44 PM	The only alignment "issues" is that a Lawful barbarian can't range, which is not a big deal. He could take exactly two levels of Paladin before facing an XP penalty. Frenzied Berserker will not work because of the loss of the ability to rage. I'd say three levels of Exotic Weapon Master and do hurtful things with the dwarven waraxe.
Mawtaw 02-28-04, 04:23 PM	have a character who is now a *Feral dwarf Barbarian1/Fighter4. I have discussed with my GM and he lets me play a lawful good barbarian so no need to comment on the alignment. But the thing to comment would be; What 3 levels should I take as my last levels (18-20) before I go epic? Did you guys not read his first paragraph of his post. He asked his GM and he said it was fine to have a lawful barbarian and whatever the GM says goes. So stop going on about the alignment issue. Just me.
pawsplay 02-28-04, 08:20 PM	He just said LG barbarian was okay. He didn't say anything about raging while LG.
johniemi 02-29-04, 12:52 AM	Ok to clear this up; My GM says that a lawful good barbarian is OK and he can rage. We decided this because the book Exalted Deeds has a rage/frenzy feat called "Righteous Wrath" that would indicate that lawful good characters can rage, as long as it used as an instrument for divine or good things. So basically, I would only be allowed to rage in battles against evil creatures, but the campaign is actually so black and white that all my opponents will be evil beings so that's not a problem. Also the fact that I will only take one barbarian level and that I will really have to focus hard on the roleplaying side of a lawful good are reasons why my DM gave me some slack and let me take (one level!) of lawful (good) barbarian. Playing a lawful good should be a little harder than f.ex. chaotic neutral, who really just MAY do what he feels is right for himself, but a lawful good HAS to do what is good for others as well. More comments, I will check out the exotic weapon master later today. -John
TaisharMalkier 02-29-04, 01:57 AM	Zug Zug. "My GM says that a lawful good barbarian is OK and he can rage. We decided this because the book Exalted Deeds has a rage/frenzy feat called "Righteous Wrath" that would indicate that lawful good characters can rage, as long as it used as an instrument for divine or good things." You realize exalted characters can be any good, right? Cheers
BenjCano 02-29-04, 04:00 AM	Oh boy. This thread is circling...circling....circling. Give the guy a break, will ya? Have a look at the Battlerager from Races of Faerun. It has an alignment requirment of non-lawful, and the ability to rage as a prerequisite, but you shouldn't have a problem convincing your DM to permit it. It requires a few odd skills, but nothing you couldn't afford, and feats that aren't at odds with your character at all. Power Attack, Cleave, and Endurance. For your 3 levels, you get two extra rages per day, a bonus to Intimidate (yay), increased bonuses against poison, the Close-Quarters Fighting feat (lets you avoid a grapple by making an AoO against anything that tries to grab you with improved grab), immunity to fear, bonus to save against enchantments, and the Improved Unarmed Strike feat.
johniemi 02-29-04, 05:08 AM	Originally posted by TaisharMalkier Zug Zug. You realize exalted characters can be any good, right? Cheers Yep, but as I was allowed to take; 1) Feral template 2) lawful barbarian (with all abilities) 3) dwarven defender who can rage in defensive stance Thus we agreed that to balance these with a rule that my player would be lawful good, and should really be true to his alignment. I'm not saying it's a drawback but... well... doing bad things is usually beneficial (cheating in money games, persuading someone to do something and benefitting from it, picking pockets etc etc.) and now my character cannot do these "bad" things but must throw himself in danger everytime someone needs help. -John -John
noneedforagain 03-01-04, 01:18 PM	isnt a prerequ for Dwarven defneder the Bab of 7 ? that means you HAVE to have it prior to becoming the darven defneder.. that means 1 bar/6 fighter then dwarven defnder at 8th lvl. or am I completelye wrong ? thanks, MArk
johniemi 03-01-04, 01:54 PM	Originally posted by noneedforagain isnt a prerequ for Dwarven defneder the Bab of 7 ? that means you HAVE to have it prior to becoming the darven defneder.. that means 1 bar/6 fighter then dwarven defnder at 8th lvl. or am I completelye wrong ? thanks, MArk Oops! Thanks for pointing that out. I have changed my build to; Bar1/Ftr6/Exotic Weapon master1/Dw.Defender10 I'm taking the exotic weapon master level just for the x2 to STR when using two-handed attack, "uncanny blow". (And the BaB +1 so now I would have Bab +7) But anyway, as you can see I'm still missing two levels, my build is now 18 levels, and I need two levels of... something... Exotic weapon master seemed good at first but there was only one special ability that I liked (uncanny blow; STR bonus x2) but the others don't fit in with my character. So I will probably fill the last two levels with Ftr levels, I will get one Ftr feat so that's ok for me, and besides, I don't like the idea of taking lots of prestige classes, because it eats away the "prestige" :) The reason I was able to take only 1 level of exotic weapon master is that it's a 3-level class anyway, so I am actually taking 33% of the class so that doesn't sound as bad as taking one level of a 10-level class :) -John
PhaedrusXY 03-01-04, 02:20 PM	Originally posted by noneedforagain isnt a prerequ for Dwarven defneder the Bab of 7 ? that means you HAVE to have it prior to becoming the darven defneder.. that means 1 bar/6 fighter then dwarven defnder at 8th lvl. or am I completelye wrong ? thanks, MArk He has barb1/ftr6/DD10 in the title of the thread. I'm not sure what you're talking about.
pawsplay 03-02-04, 06:49 PM	Exotic weapon master seemed good at first but there was only one special ability that I liked (uncanny blow; STR bonus x2) but the others don't fit in with my character. What about exotic sunder? Everyone likes exotic sunder. But I think I like this better. Two levels of Knight Protector. You get Iron Will for free and a shining beacon ability. Tactical Soldier also works.
Cloakable 03-02-04, 07:56 PM	To me a Barbarian/Dwarven Defender just sounds plain stupid. "Aaargh! I am very mad at you now and becaus of it I am going to stand here, RIGHT HERE!!! RAAARGH!" eerhnm? :P Oh well, back to your question. What about taking 2 Barbarian levels? If i´m not mistaken 3 levels of Barbarian gives you rage 2/day, Trapsense +1 and Uncanny Dodge (Dex to Ac) Sure you have Uncanny Dodge from the Dwarven Defender (But its called something else) but another Rage/day isnt so bad. And the barbarian gets 4+int mod skills per level :) Just my 2pp:s :)