Build (movie) Arwen [Archive] - Wizards Community

Build (movie) Arwen [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
TinySilverChalice
03-14-05, 09:07 PM I'm trying to convert a newbie into a D&D player. When I ask her what kind of character she wants to play, she said "Something like Arwen out of Lord of the Rings". Hey, whatever she wants to play, I just want her to play. I made a Drizzt knock-off in my newbie days, so I can't complain.

Now the thing is, what exactly is Arwen? A ranger? A druid? A druid/fighter? Something out of BOED?

Our game tends to not be very merciful in the way of character opt mistakes. She's crazy about LOTR, so she knows what kinds of things the character should be able to do (at least eventually). Little help, please?
SigmaJargon
03-14-05, 09:15 PM Try here (http://www.tuckborough.net/arwen.html) for info on Arwen. Its, er, pretty through.
Tempest Stormwind
03-14-05, 09:17 PM I'm trying to convert a newbie into a D&D player. When I ask her what kind of character she wants to play, she said "Something like Arwen out of Lord of the Rings". Hey, whatever she wants to play, I just want her to play. I made a Drizzt knock-off in my newbie days, so I can't complain.

Now the thing is, what exactly is Arwen? A ranger? A druid? A druid/fighter? Something out of BOED?

Our game tends to not be very merciful in the way of character opt mistakes. She's crazy about LOTR, so she knows what kinds of things the character should be able to do (at least eventually). Little help, please?
An elf.

Seriously. It's because of influences like Lord of the Rings that earlier editions of D&D had things like level 5 elves.

Even with her expanded role in the movies, where she's an effective rider and she (instead of Elrond) summons the flood, she didn't seem particularily talented. We don't get to see her in action a lot, but I get the impression she's not terribly experienced in combat. This means she's low-level at best. You can explain the flood as a sort of permanant magic item -- "If I can get him across the river, the power of my people will protect him" implies that there's an enchantment (persistent spell or contingent spell) on the valley that an elf can activate, rather than her casting a spell. If she IS casting a spell, it could be as simple as a Message, aimed to wherever the trigger is.

If we're going by the books, she's an aristocrat. If you're going by the movies, she's probably an expert with well-chosen skills. In both, she likely has Magical Training, but that's more to reflect her elven nature than anything else.

Remember, she's not an adventurer like Aragorn or the others. She's an NPC clearly in the books, and an NPC with more spotlight in the films.

Now, if your friend wants to play a character like that, you'd be better off giving her a badass female elf with a single sword and a decent array of other options -- I'd suggest a Battle Sorceror if she wants impressive spells, or a Ranger if she wants something a bit more standard (and free to make mistakes with, as there's no spell selection). Make sure you use a class defense system like Star Wars d20's so she can kick ass in robes or a dress instead of a chainmail shirt if she wants.
TinySilverChalice
03-14-05, 09:53 PM At a glance, there's lots of things it appears she can do (call the Horse River Spirits, use that Scimitar, heal magical wounds), but are actually just super sweet stuff Tolkin says all elves can do. Blah, a pox on that: I need game balance!

Well, what does she do/seem to be doing:
Using a scimitar
Acessing healing magic
Having animal companion/uber handle animal skill
Ability to activate magic item

Still sounds like a Ranger to me, maybe going into a little Druid toward the upper levels. What do you think?
SigmaJargon
03-14-05, 09:57 PM Sounds like Druid to me. Assuming you are in 3.5, Druids have scimitar proficiency, and seem to perfectly fufill all the other qualities you mention. Elf Druid 20 works just fine, unless you feel compelled to work in one or more PrC's.
Tempest Stormwind
03-14-05, 10:04 PM Ranger fits with the low-magic feel, plus physical characters are more fun for newcomers to play (by and large). She may have taken the Archery style (Tolkien's elves were renowed archers), which explains why she doesn't have a second sword.

Alternately, she could be a paladin. As odd as that sounds, it fits. Paladin of nature deities. Plus, paladins need godly charisma, so you literally can be so beautiful that your Turn Heads ability extends to other species. ^_^

(Departing a bit from what we've read and seen to what your player intends.)
PhaedrusXY
03-14-05, 10:20 PM she (instead of Elrond) summons the flood,It wasn't Elrond. It was Glorfindel. (Yes, I'm a huge nerd. :teach: )

Hmm... I think a Palladin of a woodland deity would fit well, though. Maybe a Palladin/Ranger with the feat from CAdv that gives you some overlap between the two.
Jeremymc
03-14-05, 10:21 PM Okay. For real. Druid? :confused:

Arwen has three skills:

1) Ride a horse.

2) Be pretty.

3) Sew flags.

Seriously. How about the "Aristocrat" NPC class. She's the ULTIMATE NPC. She does nothing. She exists basically as scenery. She might as well be a couch. She shows up when the characters need a horse, or when they need a flag, or just in time to be pretty for Aragorn.
Tempest Stormwind
03-14-05, 10:24 PM It wasn't Elrond. It was Glorfindel. (Yes, I'm a huge nerd. :teach: )

Hmm... I think a Palladin of a woodland deity would fit well, though.
I don't have my copy with me, but I distinctly remember the exchange:
"But then who caused the flood?"
"Elrond commanded it."

But as I said earlier, yes, Arwen is an NPC. If you want to use an Arwen-inspired character, that's what the rest of this thread is.
PhaedrusXY
03-14-05, 10:26 PM I don't have my copy with me, but I distinctly remember the exchange:
"But then who caused the flood?"
"Elrond commanded it."Ok, yeah, I think Glorfindel says Elrond caused it. But it was Glorfindel who actually appeared in that "scene" and rode with Frodo across the river. Elrond supposedly was the power behind the flood, but he wasn't there in person. I think Glorfidel takes credit for making the waves look like horses or something. It's been a few years since I read the Holy Trilogy. My Tolkien is getting a little rusty. ;)
Tempest Stormwind
03-14-05, 10:27 PM Ok, yeah, I think Glorfindel says Elrond caused it. But it was Glorfindel who actually appeared in that "scene" and rode with Frodo across the river. Elrond supposedly was the power behind the flood, but he wasn't there in person.
Exactly. But as my earlier quote said, it was Elrond behind the flood. (Actually, I think Gandalf said this to Frodo. I'm not entirely sure. I DO remember Glorfindel in the scene, though.)
TinySilverChalice
03-14-05, 10:40 PM I hadn't even given thought to alignment. Good is assumed, but lawful? She sure gives her father a hard time for being lawful, but I guess there are exceptions.

I think we are going to have to go with something more in the spirit of movie Arwen than actual what she does. She doesn't do anything, actually, now that I'm really thinking about it.

Anyway...

What about Swanmay from BOED? It's a personal favor PrC of mine, but would it fit?

Edit: BTW, we play FR.
Deathson
03-14-05, 11:43 PM Have her be a NG elf druid.

Use the UA variant that replaces wild shape with monk-like AC bonuses and speed boosts. This allows her to avoid the wildshaping issue (Which arwen definately doesn't do) and kick ass without wearing armor. Give her an Elven Riding horse from the Eberron Campaign Setting. Not really optimal, but even like this, it's hard to go wrong as a druid.
malaegoth
03-15-05, 12:28 AM Elrond created the flood, Gandalf enhanced it, Glorfindel had nothing to do with it. All that and more can be found at that handy link earlier in this thread.

I support making her a druid, I think it best fits the very brief scenes we got of Liv from the movies.
Squirrelloid
03-15-05, 02:23 AM Ok, yeah, I think Glorfindel says Elrond caused it. But it was Glorfindel who actually appeared in that "scene" and rode with Frodo across the river. Elrond supposedly was the power behind the flood, but he wasn't there in person. I think Glorfidel takes credit for making the waves look like horses or something. It's been a few years since I read the Holy Trilogy. My Tolkien is getting a little rusty. ;)

Gandalf adds the horses. (I can actually recall the exact text from memory, if you'd like). Glorfindel is mostly a throw-away character, which is good, because he died in Gondolin in the first age. :uh-huh: (Check out the Silmarillion).
PhaedrusXY
03-15-05, 03:22 AM Glorfindel is mostly a throw-away character, which is good, because he died in Gondolin in the first age. :uh-huh: (Check out the Silmarillion).I've read the Silmarillion, but it's been ages. Wasn't Glorfindel the elven lord who carried Frodo on his horse into Rivendell, after he'd become sickened from the Ringwraith's blade? Or was that someone else? I know it was some elven lord that doesn't show up anywhere else in the trilogy or hobbit, and I was pretty sure it was Glorfindel. I'll have to check now. :P

Edit: Yeah, according to the site linked in the second post, the elf was Glorfindel. And it is supposedly the same Glorfindel. Evidently he was sent back from the Undying lands after being "killed", for some reason. You can read about him here (http://www.tuckborough.net/elves.html#Glorfindel). I really only remembered this because I liked the name, and used it for a D&D character (an elven wizard). I like using the names of obscure Tolkien characters for D&D characters, because most people won't know where they came from, and they all sound cooler than anthing I can come up with on my own. ;)
TinySilverChalice
03-15-05, 09:44 AM Have her be a NG elf druid.

Use the UA variant that replaces wild shape with monk-like AC bonuses and speed boosts. This allows her to avoid the wildshaping issue (Which arwen definately doesn't do) and kick ass without wearing armor.

Is UA Unearthed Arcana? That's, like, one of the four books we don't have. :weep: Does this variant work exactly like you just said: nix wild shape, add monk AC bonuses and base speed increase? Does this include the coveted WIS to AC of monks?
rilem
03-15-05, 10:23 AM Yeah, in the movies and book she's an low-level NPC, plainly. But that's not the assignment. We want a DND character with Arwen flavor. What level are we talking?

Points to consider (all per the movie: If this person wants to play a by-the-books Arwen, there's little hope).

- She can sneak with the best of them, getting the drop on Aragorn.

- She is apparently immune to fear, staring down the entire flock of Nazgul.

- She can ride like the dickens.

- There is that neat river trick, which to me looks like a Rushing Waters spell (5th level Druid, possibly empowered).

So that's a big vote for Druid, boosting hide/ms skills through either ranger levels or Magic. (Check the Comp. Adv. for some good spells, I think). You'll also want some levels of Wild Plains Outrider for mounted abilities.

Two 12-level builds

Druid6/LionofTalisid3/WildPlainsOutrider3
Feats: Saddleback, Track, Mounted Combat, Favored of the Companions

With less magic, you're talking a Ranger6/BattleMaiden3/Outrider3.
I can't recall if BattleMaiden (from Oriental Adventures) gets fear immunity; if not, build a level of Lion of Talisid in as well, looking for Ranger8/Lion1/Outrider3/BattleMaiden8 eventually.

EDIT: Swanmay doesn't fit. Nice class, different archetype. Swammays are Swanmays, and Arwen ain't one. Beloved of Valarian would even be better — especially in Tolkien's very chaste book version, though of course she's doomed to lose access to this class eventually.
HoshiAdam
03-15-05, 11:13 AM A level of Dragonslayer will grant immunity to fear.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
TinySilverChalice 03-14-05, 09:07 PM	I'm trying to convert a newbie into a D&D player. When I ask her what kind of character she wants to play, she said "Something like Arwen out of Lord of the Rings". Hey, whatever she wants to play, I just want her to play. I made a Drizzt knock-off in my newbie days, so I can't complain. Now the thing is, what exactly is Arwen? A ranger? A druid? A druid/fighter? Something out of BOED? Our game tends to not be very merciful in the way of character opt mistakes. She's crazy about LOTR, so she knows what kinds of things the character should be able to do (at least eventually). Little help, please?
SigmaJargon 03-14-05, 09:15 PM	Try here (http://www.tuckborough.net/arwen.html) for info on Arwen. Its, er, pretty through.
Tempest Stormwind 03-14-05, 09:17 PM	I'm trying to convert a newbie into a D&D player. When I ask her what kind of character she wants to play, she said "Something like Arwen out of Lord of the Rings". Hey, whatever she wants to play, I just want her to play. I made a Drizzt knock-off in my newbie days, so I can't complain. Now the thing is, what exactly is Arwen? A ranger? A druid? A druid/fighter? Something out of BOED? Our game tends to not be very merciful in the way of character opt mistakes. She's crazy about LOTR, so she knows what kinds of things the character should be able to do (at least eventually). Little help, please? An elf. Seriously. It's because of influences like Lord of the Rings that earlier editions of D&D had things like level 5 elves. Even with her expanded role in the movies, where she's an effective rider and she (instead of Elrond) summons the flood, she didn't seem particularily talented. We don't get to see her in action a lot, but I get the impression she's not terribly experienced in combat. This means she's low-level at best. You can explain the flood as a sort of permanant magic item -- "If I can get him across the river, the power of my people will protect him" implies that there's an enchantment (persistent spell or contingent spell) on the valley that an elf can activate, rather than her casting a spell. If she IS casting a spell, it could be as simple as a Message, aimed to wherever the trigger is. If we're going by the books, she's an aristocrat. If you're going by the movies, she's probably an expert with well-chosen skills. In both, she likely has Magical Training, but that's more to reflect her elven nature than anything else. Remember, she's not an adventurer like Aragorn or the others. She's an NPC clearly in the books, and an NPC with more spotlight in the films. Now, if your friend wants to play a character like that, you'd be better off giving her a badass female elf with a single sword and a decent array of other options -- I'd suggest a Battle Sorceror if she wants impressive spells, or a Ranger if she wants something a bit more standard (and free to make mistakes with, as there's no spell selection). Make sure you use a class defense system like Star Wars d20's so she can kick ass in robes or a dress instead of a chainmail shirt if she wants.
TinySilverChalice 03-14-05, 09:53 PM	At a glance, there's lots of things it appears she can do (call the Horse River Spirits, use that Scimitar, heal magical wounds), but are actually just super sweet stuff Tolkin says all elves can do. Blah, a pox on that: I need game balance! Well, what does she do/seem to be doing: Using a scimitar Acessing healing magic Having animal companion/uber handle animal skill Ability to activate magic item Still sounds like a Ranger to me, maybe going into a little Druid toward the upper levels. What do you think?
SigmaJargon 03-14-05, 09:57 PM	Sounds like Druid to me. Assuming you are in 3.5, Druids have scimitar proficiency, and seem to perfectly fufill all the other qualities you mention. Elf Druid 20 works just fine, unless you feel compelled to work in one or more PrC's.
Tempest Stormwind 03-14-05, 10:04 PM	Ranger fits with the low-magic feel, plus physical characters are more fun for newcomers to play (by and large). She may have taken the Archery style (Tolkien's elves were renowed archers), which explains why she doesn't have a second sword. Alternately, she could be a paladin. As odd as that sounds, it fits. Paladin of nature deities. Plus, paladins need godly charisma, so you literally can be so beautiful that your Turn Heads ability extends to other species. ^_^ (Departing a bit from what we've read and seen to what your player intends.)
PhaedrusXY 03-14-05, 10:20 PM	she (instead of Elrond) summons the flood,It wasn't Elrond. It was Glorfindel. (Yes, I'm a huge nerd. :teach: ) Hmm... I think a Palladin of a woodland deity would fit well, though. Maybe a Palladin/Ranger with the feat from CAdv that gives you some overlap between the two.
Jeremymc 03-14-05, 10:21 PM	Okay. For real. Druid? :confused: Arwen has three skills: 1) Ride a horse. 2) Be pretty. 3) Sew flags. Seriously. How about the "Aristocrat" NPC class. She's the ULTIMATE NPC. She does nothing. She exists basically as scenery. She might as well be a couch. She shows up when the characters need a horse, or when they need a flag, or just in time to be pretty for Aragorn.
Tempest Stormwind 03-14-05, 10:24 PM	It wasn't Elrond. It was Glorfindel. (Yes, I'm a huge nerd. :teach: ) Hmm... I think a Palladin of a woodland deity would fit well, though. I don't have my copy with me, but I distinctly remember the exchange: "But then who caused the flood?" "Elrond commanded it." But as I said earlier, yes, Arwen is an NPC. If you want to use an Arwen-inspired character, that's what the rest of this thread is.
PhaedrusXY 03-14-05, 10:26 PM	I don't have my copy with me, but I distinctly remember the exchange: "But then who caused the flood?" "Elrond commanded it."Ok, yeah, I think Glorfindel says Elrond caused it. But it was Glorfindel who actually appeared in that "scene" and rode with Frodo across the river. Elrond supposedly was the power behind the flood, but he wasn't there in person. I think Glorfidel takes credit for making the waves look like horses or something. It's been a few years since I read the Holy Trilogy. My Tolkien is getting a little rusty. ;)
Tempest Stormwind 03-14-05, 10:27 PM	Ok, yeah, I think Glorfindel says Elrond caused it. But it was Glorfindel who actually appeared in that "scene" and rode with Frodo across the river. Elrond supposedly was the power behind the flood, but he wasn't there in person. Exactly. But as my earlier quote said, it was Elrond behind the flood. (Actually, I think Gandalf said this to Frodo. I'm not entirely sure. I DO remember Glorfindel in the scene, though.)
TinySilverChalice 03-14-05, 10:40 PM	I hadn't even given thought to alignment. Good is assumed, but lawful? She sure gives her father a hard time for being lawful, but I guess there are exceptions. I think we are going to have to go with something more in the spirit of movie Arwen than actual what she does. She doesn't do anything, actually, now that I'm really thinking about it. Anyway... What about Swanmay from BOED? It's a personal favor PrC of mine, but would it fit? Edit: BTW, we play FR.
Deathson 03-14-05, 11:43 PM	Have her be a NG elf druid. Use the UA variant that replaces wild shape with monk-like AC bonuses and speed boosts. This allows her to avoid the wildshaping issue (Which arwen definately doesn't do) and kick ass without wearing armor. Give her an Elven Riding horse from the Eberron Campaign Setting. Not really optimal, but even like this, it's hard to go wrong as a druid.
malaegoth 03-15-05, 12:28 AM	Elrond created the flood, Gandalf enhanced it, Glorfindel had nothing to do with it. All that and more can be found at that handy link earlier in this thread. I support making her a druid, I think it best fits the very brief scenes we got of Liv from the movies.
Squirrelloid 03-15-05, 02:23 AM	Ok, yeah, I think Glorfindel says Elrond caused it. But it was Glorfindel who actually appeared in that "scene" and rode with Frodo across the river. Elrond supposedly was the power behind the flood, but he wasn't there in person. I think Glorfidel takes credit for making the waves look like horses or something. It's been a few years since I read the Holy Trilogy. My Tolkien is getting a little rusty. ;) Gandalf adds the horses. (I can actually recall the exact text from memory, if you'd like). Glorfindel is mostly a throw-away character, which is good, because he died in Gondolin in the first age. :uh-huh: (Check out the Silmarillion).
PhaedrusXY 03-15-05, 03:22 AM	Glorfindel is mostly a throw-away character, which is good, because he died in Gondolin in the first age. :uh-huh: (Check out the Silmarillion).I've read the Silmarillion, but it's been ages. Wasn't Glorfindel the elven lord who carried Frodo on his horse into Rivendell, after he'd become sickened from the Ringwraith's blade? Or was that someone else? I know it was some elven lord that doesn't show up anywhere else in the trilogy or hobbit, and I was pretty sure it was Glorfindel. I'll have to check now. :P Edit: Yeah, according to the site linked in the second post, the elf was Glorfindel. And it is supposedly the same Glorfindel. Evidently he was sent back from the Undying lands after being "killed", for some reason. You can read about him here (http://www.tuckborough.net/elves.html#Glorfindel). I really only remembered this because I liked the name, and used it for a D&D character (an elven wizard). I like using the names of obscure Tolkien characters for D&D characters, because most people won't know where they came from, and they all sound cooler than anthing I can come up with on my own. ;)
TinySilverChalice 03-15-05, 09:44 AM	Have her be a NG elf druid. Use the UA variant that replaces wild shape with monk-like AC bonuses and speed boosts. This allows her to avoid the wildshaping issue (Which arwen definately doesn't do) and kick ass without wearing armor. Is UA Unearthed Arcana? That's, like, one of the four books we don't have. :weep: Does this variant work exactly like you just said: nix wild shape, add monk AC bonuses and base speed increase? Does this include the coveted WIS to AC of monks?
rilem 03-15-05, 10:23 AM	Yeah, in the movies and book she's an low-level NPC, plainly. But that's not the assignment. We want a DND character with Arwen flavor. What level are we talking? Points to consider (all per the movie: If this person wants to play a by-the-books Arwen, there's little hope). - She can sneak with the best of them, getting the drop on Aragorn. - She is apparently immune to fear, staring down the entire flock of Nazgul. - She can ride like the dickens. - There is that neat river trick, which to me looks like a Rushing Waters spell (5th level Druid, possibly empowered). So that's a big vote for Druid, boosting hide/ms skills through either ranger levels or Magic. (Check the Comp. Adv. for some good spells, I think). You'll also want some levels of Wild Plains Outrider for mounted abilities. Two 12-level builds Druid6/LionofTalisid3/WildPlainsOutrider3 Feats: Saddleback, Track, Mounted Combat, Favored of the Companions With less magic, you're talking a Ranger6/BattleMaiden3/Outrider3. I can't recall if BattleMaiden (from Oriental Adventures) gets fear immunity; if not, build a level of Lion of Talisid in as well, looking for Ranger8/Lion1/Outrider3/BattleMaiden8 eventually. EDIT: Swanmay doesn't fit. Nice class, different archetype. Swammays are Swanmays, and Arwen ain't one. Beloved of Valarian would even be better — especially in Tolkien's very chaste book version, though of course she's doomed to lose access to this class eventually.
HoshiAdam 03-15-05, 11:13 AM	A level of Dragonslayer will grant immunity to fear.