Post/Author/DateTime	Post
waywreth 11-01-04, 09:51 AM	Okay here goes - Starting a new campaign, and I'm going to try the typical spiked chain/trip fighter. So far I have the beginning 4 levels of the build set, but don't know what to do after that, so I'm looking for suggestions. Important note - this is a low level campaign so anything after level 10 is pointless... I don't even thing I'll get up that high. Also no psionics please. The way we're determining stats - Two good scores: choose (18,14) or (16,16) Two average scores: choose (14,10) or (12,12) Two low scores: choose (12,6) or (10,8) Also note, at level 4 you get a +2 to the stat of your choice, at level 8, another +2 but it MUST be a different stat than the first one you gave the +2. My build so far: Wolf Totem Barbarian 2 / Fighter 2/ Level 1 WB1- EWP Spiked Chain, Jotunbrud Level 2 WB2- Free Improved Trip Level 3 WB2/F1- Fighter Feat <Power Attack>, Feat <Combat Reflexes> Level 4 WB2/F2- Fighter Feat <Knockdown> Str - 16 Int - 14 Wis - 10 Dex - 16 Con - 12 Cha - 6 Things I was thinking about: Swashbuckler - Complete Warrior Human Paragon - UA Exotic Weapon Master - Complete Warrior Thanks for the help!
nihility 11-01-04, 09:57 AM	If you're allowed to use Forgotten Realms material, grab the wolf berserker feat from Unapproachable East. It adds another +4 to your trip check. Also, I would lose knockdown.
Oogar 11-01-04, 10:09 AM	I'd vote for a Str - 18 Dex - 14 Con - 12 Int - 14 Wis - 10 Cha - 6 The change in Dex for Strength costs you 1 AC and 1 AoO with the spiked chain (after you have Combat Reflexes). However, I think that the +1 to hit, +2 to damage and the +1 to trip check (the focus of your build) make it worth it for the first 3 levels... You can put the +2 that you get at level 4 into Dex if you feel the need (but again I would go strength). This also depends on the kinds of things that your DM runs for encounters... if you face swarms of zombies, then strength might not be as usefull as the Dex, but if a good portion of the time you are running into 1-3 stronger monsters, Strength will pay off (and 3 AoOs in a round will be enough). Exotic Weapon Master is truely worth looking at - Flurry is great, and exotic reach, is quite nice.
LordKiwi 11-01-04, 10:10 AM	Loose Jotunbrud (get a mage to enlarge you) and get Wolf Berserker. My favourite build at the moment for a tripper is... Race: Human Level BAB Saves Class Abilities/Feats 1 +0 2/2/2 Monk (Overwhelming attack) 1 EWP: Spiked Chain, Power Attack, Combat Reflexes, Unarmed Strike 2 +1 3/3/3 Mnk 2 Improved Bull Rush, Evasion 3 +1 5/3/3 Mnk 2 / Psychic Warrior 1 Combat Expertise, Heroic Spirit 4 +2 6/3/3 Mnk 2 / PW 2 Improved Trip 5 +3 8/3/3 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fighter 1 Monkey Grip 6 +4 9/3/3 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 Cleave, Knockback 7 +5 11/5/3 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Warmind 1 Chains of Personal Superiority +2 8 +6 12/6/3 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 2 Chains of Defensive Posture +2 9 +7 12/6/4 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 3 Shock Trooper, Enduring Body (DR 1/-) 10 +8 13/7/4 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 4 - 11 +9 13/7/4 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 5 Sweeping Strike 12 +10 14/8/5 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 6 Enduring Body (DR 2/-), Dodge 13 +10 16/10/7 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 6 / Heir of Siberys 1 Action Boost, Additional AP 14 +12 17/12/9 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 6 / HoS 2 Karmic Strike, Siberys Mark (Mark of Passage) 15 +12 17/12/9 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 6 / HoS 3 Great Cleave, Quicken Power, Improved Siberys Markr 16 +13 17/12/9 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 7 / HoS 3 Chain of Personal Superiority +4 17 +14 18/13/9 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 8 / HoS 3 Chain of Defensive Posture +4 18 +15 18/13/10 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 9 / HoS 3 WF: Spiked Chain, Enduring Body (DR 3/-) 19 +16 19/14/10 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 10 / HoS 3 Chain of Overwhelming Force 20 +17 21/14/10 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 10 / HoS 3 / Exotic Weapon Master 1 Flurry of Strikes Epic progression… 21 +19 21/14/10 Mnk 2 / PW2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 10 / HoS 3 / EWM 2 Wield Oversized Weapon, Uncanny Blow 22 +19 22/15/11 Mnk 2 / PW 2 / Fghtr 2 / Wm 10 /HoS 3 / EWM 3 Trip Attack You can easly switch out Monk for Barbarian and switch some of the feats around. It will then nearly match your starting build. Depending on what campaigne world's you are allowed you may need to swap out Heir of Siberys for Annointed Knight and swap Heroic Spirit for Ancestral Relic. If you are in Faerun it's definatly worth including Wolf Berserker. For this build I'd sugest the following stats... Strength 16 Dexterity 16 Constitution 12 Intelligence 10 Wisdom 14 Charisma 6 Lord Kiwi,
waywreth 11-01-04, 11:14 AM	Thanks for the replies - A few things to note - I am really only allowed one FR feat, so I figured that Jotunbrud would be better than Wolf Berserker - more because the being large is more useful overall than just a +4 to trip. I'll try to get that feat included in later though since I'm from the Wolf Berserker Lodge... hmmm... It is a Greyhawk based campaign. Per Str vs Dex - I suspect we'll be fighting groups of weaker monsters. Again not sure, but it's my feeling overall (and this is a new DM). Good point on the switching Dex/Str up. I might go with that anyway though more for the plus to hit and trip - as you say the focus. Also, why lose knockdown? I was shooting for a Power attack, 10+ dmg, free trip attack, they get up and thus provoke, take 10+ dmg, free trip... etc. style of combat. Thanks again for the advice!
LordKiwi 11-01-04, 11:16 AM	I am really only allowed one FR feat, so I figured that Jotunbrud would be better than Wolf Berserker - more because the being large is more useful overall than just a +4 to trip. I'll try to get that feat included in later though since I'm from the Wolf Berserker Lodge... hmmm... It is a Greyhawk based campaign. Because your party caster can enlarge or polymorph you to get the same bonus, or you can get items to do it for you. Wolf Berserker stays all the time. Lord Kiwi,
nihility 11-01-04, 11:20 AM	Also, why lose knockdown? Simple: because you can always trip first, then get a followup attack off of improved trip. I would probably take knockdown eventually, but I would delay it until I had picked up some other nice feats. Elusive target is a good one to work for if you plan on having a high AC, while karmic strike is good to work for if you're going to have a low AC. I would take wolf berserker over jotunbrud so long as your mage is willing to buff you; enlarge person is the best first level spell in core. It doesn't stack with jotunbrud, and gives you the benefits of greater reach, size bonus to checks, and strength, as opposed to jotunbrud, which only gives the size bonus. If your mage won't buff, then jotunbrud is probably better (though wolf berserker + enlarge is the best).
nihility 11-01-04, 11:24 AM	...they get up and thus provoke, take 10+ dmg, free trip... etc. style of combat... AoOs resolve before the action that tiggers them. Thus, your AoO-derived trip attempt won't actually keep them down. The sequence is like so: 1) enemy attempts to stand, provoking an AoO 2) you take your AoO, do damage, and trigger a trip 3) trip is resolved 4) with the AoO resolved, the enemy resolves their original action and stands. Result: the enemy is hurt, but standing. For more on this, go here: http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20041026a
waywreth 11-01-04, 11:54 AM	4) with the AoO resolved, the enemy resolves their original action and stands. Doh, forgot about that. Thanks! Per advice, I'll delay knockdown then. It's not as useful as I thought, especially early on. I think karmic strike is looking better and better in its place. Of course that means I have to take dodge first. We'll see. Also, class wise after the barb2/ftr2 - what should I go for before I take Exotic Weapon Master? I was thinking barbarian, fighter (blech level 3 fighter bad!) or swashbuckler.
nihility 11-01-04, 12:06 PM	Consider going into ranger for a bit. You get a nice bump to your skills, plus the bonus feats are nice. Grabbing rapid shot would help round out the character. Alternately, shoot for Occult Slayer to shore up your biggest weakness: your will save. Edit: Hexblade is also worth a look.