Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ck2001wendt 04-08-05, 10:05 AM	1. Play a Cleric with the Spell domain. -Take the Divine MM - Persistent chain, Domain Spontaneity (Spell Domain) and Still Spell. Possible by 9th level (earlier if you also have the Planning Domain, which grants Extend). -Load up on Anyspell and Greater Anyspell. -Buy or build a crapload of Nighsticks (Libris Mortis). 7500 to buy, or 3750 to build. Nightsticks give four extra turn attempts each. LM does not specifiy how that energy need be used...so it can be used to fuel Domain Spontaneity and Divine MM. -Memorize (and Persist) the following: Slots taken: 2nd Stilled Divine Favor Stilled Entropic Shield 3rd or 4th (you can Domain Spontaneity a spell using a spell of higher level) Blade Weave Critical Strike Daggerspell Stance Haste, Swift Stilled Dragonskin Stilled Listening Lorecall Stilled Prayer Wraithstrike Swift Fly 5th Stilled Divine Power Stilled War Cry 6th Stiled Imp. Blink Stilled Nightstalker's Transformation. What you get: A Full BAB attacker with 4d6 SA dice, lots of extra damage goodies (to make up for the loss of Str bonus from Wraithstrike) and some excellent defensive protections. Oh, and all your attacks are touch attacks. Drawback: You can no longer cast spells while Nightstalker's Transformation is active. I like it for the 3d6 extra SA, and I would probably build a rogue 1/Cleric 11/Chameleon 8 around this tactic, then up my Dex like crazy and get Weapon Finesse. What you need: -11 levels of Cleric -2.5 hours to prepare all the Anyspells (15 min casting time), plus another 5 minutes to cast all the spells. -7 Turn Attempts of your own, to cast Daggerspell Stance (Focus is 2 daggers, presumably held). 14 Cha with Eagle's Splendor should do it. -14x7 = 98 Turn attempts, but 30 Nightsticks (two for each Divine MM)...225,000 GP to buy, 112,500 to build. The GP limit for a 15th level character, for ex is 200,000. A cohort with Craft Rod and Magical Artisan (Rod), could build them all for about 80,000 GP and 3000 XP. 2. Play a straight Chameleon. -If the Chameleon has access to domain restricted spells, it will be able to memorize a crapload of Anyspells and Greater Anyspells. -Either way, I'd recommend and Incantatrix cohort. The Incantatrix Persists up to 10 of the Chameleon's spells (probably the ones with Somatic components), while the Chameleon uses Divine MM/Nightsticks to get all the Divine spells with only Verbal Components.
Boo 04-08-05, 11:42 AM	Why all the stilled spells? Also, you forgot to take in the cost of the spellbook you need for all those arcane spells. Also I dont see how useful Domain Spontaneity is. Probably better of taking Initiate of Mystra since that adds the Anyspell spells to your regular spell list.
ck2001wendt 04-08-05, 12:03 PM	Why all the stilled spells? Also, you forgot to take in the cost of the spellbook you need for all those arcane spells. Also I dont see how useful Domain Spontaneity is. Probably better of taking Initiate of Mystra since that adds the Anyspell spells to your regular spell list. If a Spell has Somatic components, you need at least one hand free to cast it. Which means you can only hold one Nightstick as you cast, and you'll need to sacrifice three of your own Turn Attempts as you Divine MM. If you Still the Spell, you can hold two Nightsticks, and use their Turn energy to fuel the entire Divine MM. If you aren't using Daggerspell stance (which I like, as it's and overall -2 Att, +2 dmg., +2 AC and SR 25), you don't need ANY Turn attempts left for the day...you can use only Nightsticks. As for Initiate of Mystra...that's another way to go, yes. I like "Domain Pick'em," but if you want to devote another feat to get Extend spell (instead of using the Planning Domain) you can. You'll still get the full effect by 11th, and have all the feats by 9th or so (if human).
Boo 04-08-05, 12:57 PM	I didnt think the rod in Libris mortis said it needed to be wielded to gain the turn attempts. It just said the possessor of it gains 4 more turn attempts. Then again I coulda just been reading it the way I wanted to read it ;)
thorian 04-08-05, 05:56 PM	You merely need to possess the rod, not wield it, so there is no reason to use still spell. My brother has been playing a similar build where he uses nightstick rods to persist cleric spells and wizard spells selected via anyspell and greater anyspell. The build is incredibly effective. Just make sure you have a spellblade with dispel magic and greater dispel magic to protect your buffs. The ring of counterspells is a waste in this regard.
ck2001wendt 04-08-05, 07:20 PM	Spellblades are a must (Dispel, Greater Dispel, Reaving Dispel). Also useful is a Ring of Counterspells or a Spellblade for Reciprocal Gyre (CA, does damage based on amound of buffs you have on you. Ring of Counterspells, Major might be an option for Disjunction.
NateNate 04-08-05, 07:25 PM	Nightsticks specifically say that the extra turn attempts they grant can only be used to turn undead, nothing else! You can't power Divine feats with Nightsticks, end of story. Thats why every DM should read the descriptions of any magic items their players get.
Tempest Stormwind 04-08-05, 07:37 PM	Nightsticks specifically say that the extra turn attempts they grant can only be used to turn undead, nothing else! You can't power Divine feats with Nightsticks, end of story. Thats why every DM should read the descriptions of any magic items their players get. You're reading Defenders of the Faith. This is an excerpt from Libris Mortis (snipped a fair bit to try to keep at least within earshot of the CoC): "Nightstick: ... Anyone who posesses the rod and is able to turn or rebuke undead gains four more uses of the ability per day. Moderate necromancy...." That's it. The first elipsis deletes description, and the second the rest of the magic item details like caster level and price. Nothing there about limits on use of those things, or even keeping them in hand. This tactic needs to sit down with the divine versions of the Shadowcraft Illusionist (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=290914) (later in the thread) and have a small chat about pulling off similar stunts.
ck2001wendt 04-08-05, 09:18 PM	My personal preference for this build is a Rogue/Cleric/Chameleon/Nightsong Enforcer, maxing out either TWF or Archery. 20 CL at 15th level is nothing to sneeze at. The big question for me, is whether you can take Anyspell (which is a Domain spell, and not on anyone's spell list) and put it on your Chameleon spell list. If so, you can start your day off as an Arcane/Divine, shift all of your buffing spells into Divine, spend 3 or 4 hours to get your buffs running (depending on how many Anyspells you need), then refocus to Combat/Arcane and go to town. If not, you really need an Incantatrix cohort to Persist those CAd spells that aren't also on a Divine List, as well as to get some of the spells that normally require Somatic components (if you can't get Still spell).
ed209 04-08-05, 10:11 PM	The big question for me, is whether you can take Anyspell (which is a Domain spell, and not on anyone's spell list) and put it on your Chameleon spell list. What about Divine Crusader?
Boo 04-08-05, 10:24 PM	Anyspell is also added to a cleric's list if you take the initiate of Mystra feat
ck2001wendt 04-08-05, 10:45 PM	What about Divine Crusader? Huh. The Divine Crusader has a spell list 9 spells long...the spells of a particular Domain. There are 100 variants of Divine Crusader, and therefore all Domain spells would be instantly added to your potential spell list. Huh. This may not exactly be what the designers had in mind when they allowed "any divine spell lists," but I guess technically if that were the case you couldn't use Assassin spells either. So Rogue 2/Swashbuckler 1/Fighter 1/Cleric 1 (Planning and Time)/Chameleon 10/Anything 5. 15th level is what's important. I prefer a TWF chain for Daggerspell Stance/Blade Storm, but you could also go Archery Style. Start your morning with the Arcane and Divine Foci. Load all of your buff spells into Divine, including useful Arcane spells that you find in the various Domains, and get the rest through Anyspell and Greater Anyspell. Rod the heck out of yourself (I am going to assume you must hold the Nightstick to use it; if I were a DM it's how I'd rule it); you can use your +6 Ability boost [Competance] to start with Cha, for an additional three Turns. When done, switch to Combat/Arcane (the Arcane spells are a backup in case they manage to strip something vital...). Switch your Ability boost to Dex (which you can do when you change Focus). Behold: The Chameleon Commando. Your melee attacks have: Fighter BAB (15 at 15th) +4 Comp to Att/Dmg (Chameleon) +2 Insight to Dmg (Daggerspell Stance) +6 Luck to Att/Dmg (Divine Favor) +1 Unnamed to Att (Swift Haste) +2 Morale to Att/Dmg (War Cry; +4 on a Charge) +5 Enhancement (Extended G. Magic Weapon) =33 Att. Bonus at 15th level, not counting your Dex (which will be another 8-10). You probably have ITWF (and you're Hasted), for 6 Atts a round. All touch attacks, so you have basically 5.7 guaranteed hits each round (excepting natural 1s).