Can Mighty Wallop be cast on a Monk's fist? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Can Mighty Wallop be cast on a Monk's fist? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
monkey3
05-26-06, 01:14 PM The text of the spell from "Races of Dragon" lists the valid target as "One bludgeoning melee weapon."

If so, this spell gives the Arcane Fist a second life.
_J_
05-26-06, 01:15 PM Yes it can, and yes it does :D
monkey3
05-26-06, 01:20 PM Yes it can, and yes it does :D

Any way I can defend that position to my DM?
Surreal
05-26-06, 01:23 PM Experience shows that the application of beer will add a substantial penalty to your DM's will save to resist such a suggestion.
Subedei
05-26-06, 01:23 PM ...What's there to defend? Does your DM not believe a monk's unarmed strikes are considered weapons for this purpose?

Have him read the description, they're considered both manufactured weapons and natural weapons, they're bludgeoning, what more is there to argue about?
_J_
05-26-06, 01:26 PM ...What's there to defend? Does your DM not believe a monk's unarmed strikes are considered weapons for this purpose?

Have him read the description, they're considered both manufactured weapons and natural weapons, they're bludgeoning, what more is there to argue about?
Agreed. PHB very clearly says that Monk's unarmed strike considered to be either a manufactured weapon or a natural weapon, which ever is more benefitial to him. And there is absolutely no argument that it isn't bludgeoning.
FeanorCursed
05-26-06, 01:38 PM Yes, you can.
Two days ago i invented this combo:

Race: any large
monk11/Initiate of the draconic mysteries8

Items: monk's tatoo, monk's belt, Fanged Ring
Feat: Improved natural attack and Empty hand mastery (and requiments for it)

Ask a wizards or a sorcerer to cast greater might wallop

Your unarmed damage: 2d10>4d8>6d8>8d8>12d8>16d8>24d8>32d8>48d8>64d8>96d8>128d8

Instead of empty hand mastery, you can use TWF. A lot of attacks = big damage.

PS:sorry for my english, i'm from Brazil.
Tenken
05-26-06, 09:52 PM Your maximum damage will be 2d10 (monk 20) > 4d6 (large) > 6d6 (Huge) > 8d6 (Gargantuan) > 12d6 (Colossal)

It doesn't matter if you have Fanged Ring or Improved Natural attack. You can't have any size greater than Colossal. Greater Mighty Wallop specifically states that it increases your damage as if you were one size category larger.
FeanorCursed
05-26-06, 10:11 PM First, it's d8, not d6
Second: It's not said that 12d8 is the colossal damage.
...
...
...
I might be wrong abaut that.
Tenken
05-26-06, 10:21 PM Yeh, you're right, 12d8, sorry. Regardless, it's not 128d8 because of the size increase, which was my point. DMG page 28 specifically shows the progression of increasing weapon damage by size.
Surreal
05-26-06, 10:27 PM It depends how you read it. The spell doesn't give an actual size increase. It merely changes your weapon damage "as if" it had increased in size. Important semantic difference.
FeanorCursed
05-26-06, 10:27 PM Yeh, Mighty wallop have this restrinction, but the other abilities no.

So, first use mighty wallop until you reach colossal, than apply the other abilities.
catharz
05-26-06, 10:29 PM Greater Mighty Wallop specifically states that it increases your damage as if you were one size category larger.

One size category larger for up to some number of caster levels, max Collossal, and I think +3.

So you just make sure GMWallop doesn't put you above Colossal, and then put on your other damage increasers. Remember that they don't actually increase the size of your IUS, just the damage.
Bill Bisco: Average Adventurer
05-26-06, 10:36 PM Another thing to consider too is to cast Greater Mighty Wallop to get up to Colossal Size and then cast Mighty Wallop. Mighty Wallop doesn't limit the size to Colossal and would be collassal+ ?
FeanorCursed
05-26-06, 10:44 PM One size category larger for up to some number of caster levels, max Collossal, and I think +3.
to tell the truth, +5 ;)

So you just make sure GMWallop doesn't put you above Colossal, and then put on your other damage increasers. Remember that they don't actually increase the size of your IUS, just the damage.
yep, that's it.

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=316793

"Battlefist [Ebr] (1 size), Ectoplasmic fist [Ebr](1 size) , use-activated Thornskin (1 die type)"
With this, he would go:
128d8>192d8>256d8>256d10

Average damage>1408 :D

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
monkey3 05-26-06, 01:14 PM	The text of the spell from "Races of Dragon" lists the valid target as "One bludgeoning melee weapon." If so, this spell gives the Arcane Fist a second life.
_J_ 05-26-06, 01:15 PM	Yes it can, and yes it does :D
monkey3 05-26-06, 01:20 PM	Yes it can, and yes it does :D Any way I can defend that position to my DM?
Surreal 05-26-06, 01:23 PM	Experience shows that the application of beer will add a substantial penalty to your DM's will save to resist such a suggestion.
Subedei 05-26-06, 01:23 PM	...What's there to defend? Does your DM not believe a monk's unarmed strikes are considered weapons for this purpose? Have him read the description, they're considered both manufactured weapons and natural weapons, they're bludgeoning, what more is there to argue about?
_J_ 05-26-06, 01:26 PM	...What's there to defend? Does your DM not believe a monk's unarmed strikes are considered weapons for this purpose? Have him read the description, they're considered both manufactured weapons and natural weapons, they're bludgeoning, what more is there to argue about? Agreed. PHB very clearly says that Monk's unarmed strike considered to be either a manufactured weapon or a natural weapon, which ever is more benefitial to him. And there is absolutely no argument that it isn't bludgeoning.
FeanorCursed 05-26-06, 01:38 PM	Yes, you can. Two days ago i invented this combo: Race: any large monk11/Initiate of the draconic mysteries8 Items: monk's tatoo, monk's belt, Fanged Ring Feat: Improved natural attack and Empty hand mastery (and requiments for it) Ask a wizards or a sorcerer to cast greater might wallop Your unarmed damage: 2d10>4d8>6d8>8d8>12d8>16d8>24d8>32d8>48d8>64d8>96d8>128d8 Instead of empty hand mastery, you can use TWF. A lot of attacks = big damage. PS:sorry for my english, i'm from Brazil.
Tenken 05-26-06, 09:52 PM	Your maximum damage will be 2d10 (monk 20) > 4d6 (large) > 6d6 (Huge) > 8d6 (Gargantuan) > 12d6 (Colossal) It doesn't matter if you have Fanged Ring or Improved Natural attack. You can't have any size greater than Colossal. Greater Mighty Wallop specifically states that it increases your damage as if you were one size category larger.
FeanorCursed 05-26-06, 10:11 PM	First, it's d8, not d6 Second: It's not said that 12d8 is the colossal damage. ... ... ... I might be wrong abaut that.
Tenken 05-26-06, 10:21 PM	Yeh, you're right, 12d8, sorry. Regardless, it's not 128d8 because of the size increase, which was my point. DMG page 28 specifically shows the progression of increasing weapon damage by size.
Surreal 05-26-06, 10:27 PM	It depends how you read it. The spell doesn't give an actual size increase. It merely changes your weapon damage "as if" it had increased in size. Important semantic difference.
FeanorCursed 05-26-06, 10:27 PM	Yeh, Mighty wallop have this restrinction, but the other abilities no. So, first use mighty wallop until you reach colossal, than apply the other abilities.
catharz 05-26-06, 10:29 PM	Greater Mighty Wallop specifically states that it increases your damage as if you were one size category larger. One size category larger for up to some number of caster levels, max Collossal, and I think +3. So you just make sure GMWallop doesn't put you above Colossal, and then put on your other damage increasers. Remember that they don't actually increase the size of your IUS, just the damage.
Bill Bisco: Average Adventurer 05-26-06, 10:36 PM	Another thing to consider too is to cast Greater Mighty Wallop to get up to Colossal Size and then cast Mighty Wallop. Mighty Wallop doesn't limit the size to Colossal and would be collassal+ ?
FeanorCursed 05-26-06, 10:44 PM	One size category larger for up to some number of caster levels, max Collossal, and I think +3. to tell the truth, +5 ;) So you just make sure GMWallop doesn't put you above Colossal, and then put on your other damage increasers. Remember that they don't actually increase the size of your IUS, just the damage. yep, that's it. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=316793 "Battlefist [Ebr] (1 size), Ectoplasmic fist [Ebr](1 size) , use-activated Thornskin (1 die type)" With this, he would go: 128d8>192d8>256d8>256d10 Average damage>1408 :D