Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Johnny_Gaijin 11-22-06, 02:37 AM	hey, sorry because i'm sure it's out there but i've been searching for 20 minutes w/o any luck. can somebody please link me to a guide dealing w/ two weapon fighting? thanks!
FeceMan 11-22-06, 02:41 AM	Allow me: Don't do it.
GaffeR 11-22-06, 11:16 AM	Hey! (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=713640) There's not really a TWF guide out there. Take the TWF, ITWF, and GTWF feats. Don't take TWDefense. Take Weapon Finesse if you have low Str or can't afford the MAD (Str AND Dex). Find a way to get a lot of extra damage (multiple attributes to damage, sneak attack, skirmish) on a full attack (which should have 7+ attacks per round). Dervish is nice, as is Bloodclaw Master from ToB. Tempest is not that great. Those are the only dedicated TWFers I can think of.
DemonOSU 11-22-06, 11:20 AM	Tempest isn't all that bad... it negaties many of the penalties you recieve and allows you to attack with each weapon in a spring attack. Combine that with a rogue and Two-Weapon Rend and you will be dealing pretty decent damage without having to stand toe to toe.
jameswilliamogle 11-22-06, 11:22 AM	Try to get Shadow Blade from Tome of Battle eventually. Dex to damage is nice, even if it is only usable w/ a few weapons.
Llochlyn 11-22-06, 12:38 PM	Revenant blade is your best friend ! Ranger 2/Warblade 3/Revenant blade 1/Bloodclaw master 2/revenant blade +4 looks interesting.
Brol_The_Mighty 11-22-06, 12:41 PM	Revenant blade is good if you add FB to it
PhoenixInferno 11-22-06, 01:03 PM	Tempest isn't all that bad... it negaties many of the penalties you recieve and allows you to attack with each weapon in a spring attack. Combine that with a rogue and Two-Weapon Rend and you will be dealing pretty decent damage without having to stand toe to toe.Tempest takes 5 levels to complete for what? REDUCING, not ELIMINATING, TWF penalties. I'd rather eat the penalties and find a better use for 5 levels. And gosh, two hits while Spring Attack'ing? There's a feat that does that now! All of a sudden, the Tempest looks about as bad as it did in 3.0.
wolfie-kun 11-22-06, 01:09 PM	Tempest takes 5 levels to complete for what? REDUCING, not ELIMINATING, TWF penalties. I'd rather eat the penalties and find a better use for 5 levels. And gosh, two hits while Spring Attack'ing? There's a feat that does that now! All of a sudden, the Tempest looks about as bad as it did in 3.0. Actually, I find Tempest good for a two-level dip immediately after a third level of Dervish. More than anything else, for the d10 hit die and easy as hell requirements.
Neptunehero 11-22-06, 01:28 PM	Tempest isn't BAD so much as there's a lot better out there. Bloodclaw master, as mentioned above, is a great one that eliminates TWF penalties, lets you use full Str modifier on each hit, and gives you some other decent side bonuses. The requirements are a bit stiffer for the bloodclaw master, but it is quite worth it for most twfers. Don't forget Improved Buckler defense, a great feat for any twf character who wants to remedy his terrible AC.
mathiu 11-22-06, 01:28 PM	Tempest takes 5 levels to complete for what? REDUCING, not ELIMINATING, TWF penalties. I'd rather eat the penalties and find a better use for 5 levels. And gosh, two hits while Spring Attack'ing? There's a feat that does that now! All of a sudden, the Tempest looks about as bad as it did in 3.0. Incorrect. Tempest eliminates the TWF penalties unless one is using oversized weapons, in which case it reduces the penalties to -2/-2. However, with a dip in Oversized Two Weapon Fighting presented in Complete Warrior, this knocks it down to -0/-0. Any oversized TWFer that doesn't take that feat better have a good reason for passing up a drop of that penalty from -4/-4 to -2/-2. Thus, for a TWFer, this allows for an equivalent of a +7 to melee attacks over the progression. Or you could stack Tempest with Dervish and enjoy a 1d8 weapon that counts as a light weapon with an 18-20 crit range without even having to eat a feat. As it is, my current favorite is very simple (granted I don't have a massive book library beyond the completes). Fighter 5/Dervish 10/Tempest 5. As Dervish and Tempest have tumble as class skills, that allows for decent tumbling for high mobility in toe-to-toe combat (an important thing as a dervish) as well as a phenomenal number of attacks per round at the higher ends. Personally, I'm a big fan of: +20/+15/+10/+5, +20/+15/+10 base, throw in slashing weapons and those fancy dervish abilities and you can start to really obliterate an enemy with the sheer number of attacks.
PhoenixInferno 11-22-06, 01:39 PM	stuffSince you used 5 levels of Fighter in a build, you're more or less to be automatically ignored. FB/Revenant Blade or Bloodclaw Master has a higher raw damage output period.
Antarx 11-22-06, 01:53 PM	There isn't any guide, but theres some tips: 1º Forget large weapons. Fighting with 2 huge greatswords may be cool, but the penalties are too much for had a chance to hit anything. Use 2 medium swords at most. 2º Find good weapons. Elven lightblades are cool. 1d6 damage, 18-20 x2. If you get improved critical, theres a lot of chances of hit a crit every combat. And the feats apply for both weapons. But a trowing weapon could be better. 3º Get as many extra damage as you can. 2HF get it easy, by simply going power attack route. You need to find anotheer path. the usual choices are Favored enemy and Sneak attack. 4º Don't waste attacks. If you chargue to an enemy, you only get 1 or 2 attacks (usually), but, if you throw weapons (throwing axes, daggers, etc) you are getting a full atack for free. (well, in fact, you need returning weapons, or a large lot of weapons...) For example, a human ranger 6/stalker of karash 3 feats Alertness Favored of the companions * 2WF *Track E.W.P elven lightblade Improved favored enemy. Improved critical (elven lightblade) Get 2 +1 blessed-hunting throwing axes (total price as +3) A pair of adamantine /silvered / cold iron axes Gloves of Taarnahm the Vigilant (10.000) (Gives any weapon you are holding throwing and returning weapon qualities.) Now, you can make a full attack at +6/+2 +6/+2 (not including strengt or dex) Your damage is 1d6+1 +str [(+1 Favored enemy (evil) +3 Improved FE) x2 (hunting weapon)] = 1d6+8+str,15-20 x3 in a crit (that is allways automaticaly confirmed against evil creatures) P.D. I want to make a post about 2WF, but I have problems with translations. If anyone can help me, we could start to work Requeriment: Literacy Leanguajes (English, Spanish) Knowledge (English Grammar) 5 or more ranks OR Leanguaje (English) Decipher Script 10 ranks Gather Information 10 ranks Sense motive 10 ranks Knowledge (English Grammar) 5 or more ranks Handle Animal 1 rank (I'm considered already a trained one) Comon sense feat
Surreal 11-22-06, 02:26 PM	I like the Dragonsplits (MM4). They are one-handed exotic weapons, have variable damage types and crits, are counted as light for purposes of weapon finesse and TWF, yet can technically still be used to power attack.
Skarlett Spyder 11-22-06, 03:01 PM	And gosh, two hits while Spring Attack'ing? There's a feat that does that now! Forgive my ignorance, but what feat might that be?
Tyrrell 11-22-06, 03:31 PM	I see a lot of dissmissive talk regarding Fighters and two weapon fighting without numbers to back it up. But the dissing is not completely unwaranted. I'm not impressed with tempest as a class when compared to fighter feats. If a character has both a good strength and a good dex, two weapon fighting can do more damage than a two handed weapon when you don't take into account how many feats it takes. When you do take the number of feats into account or when you start to work with builds where you are sacraficing strenth in order to get the necessay dex, there's normally a way for th etwo handed fighter to do more damage with the feats that the two weapon fighter used to be god at two weapon fighting. There is probably some way to do this better not using as much fighter, but here is what I'd do with 12 levels of fighter (after that I'd proably move to something that sneak attacks). Use a 1d10 weapon in each hand if dwarf, start out with war axe, if human use your bonus feat for an exotic proficency (bastard sword). level 1 two weapon fighting, oversize two weapon fighting level 2 exotic weapon proficency (if you need it) or weapon focus level 3 weapon focus (if don't have it yet) or whatever two weapon defense is a possibility but I'm not too excited about it. level 4 weapon specialization level 6 improved two weapon fighting and something else (two weapon pounce if it is available at this level) level 8 improved weapon focus level 9 slashing weapon mastery level 10 improved crit level 12 improved specialization and greater two weapon fighting Oversize two weapon fighting allows you to reap the benefits of the specialization/ focus chain with both weapons. Those benefits are +4 to hit and +6 damage with all six attacks at level 12. With a two weapon fighter it is always possible to grab one of your weapons with both hands, in fact in many situations where you don't get a full attack action it is very advantageous to do this. Quick draw would be a good feat choice for one of the open slots that I left in this character.
Jorous 11-22-06, 03:34 PM	Forgive my ignorance, but what feat might that be? Bounding Assault (2 attacks while Spring attacking) and Rapid Blitz (3 attacks) from Players Handbook 2
simply_idiot 11-22-06, 04:24 PM	Human Barbarian 2/Fighter 4/ Frenzied Berserker 10/Melee class +4 Str 18 (+4 for levels) Dex high Con high Int dont matta Wis don't matta Cha don't matta 01- Destructive Rage, Intimidating Rage 02- Power Attack 03- Cleave, Two Weapon Fighting 04- Improved Bull Rush 06- Shock Trooper, Leap Attack 09- Two Weapon Rend 12- Oversized Two Weapon Fighting 15- (Weapon Focus?) 18- (Impoved Critical?) Rage, Frenzy, give up 20 AC to Shock Trooper's modified Power Attack to add +40 damage to every attack, jump ten feet (doubling the +40 to +80 extra damage for every attack). Hit with your first longsword (1d8 +13 (unenhanced STR mod) +80. Hit with your second lonsword (1d8 +6 +80). Rend your opponent (+1d6 +6 + 80) By this time, everyone is too afraid to attack you, so your AC is no matter.
Swrdsinger 11-22-06, 06:28 PM	Revenant blade Is probobly my favorite of the TWF Classes. It's also worth noting that with Tempest and revenant blade, the penalties for TWFing disapear entirely. My favorite combo though is probobly Revenant blade/stalker of kharash. Take favored power attack and you get a 3 to 1 power attack ratio with both end of the weapon. Combine that with double hit and true strike (think fighter2/ranger2/duskblade1/revenant blade5/Stalker of Kharash2) Take favored power attack, leap attack, and Double strike. Cast true strike, charge, using power attack to the max (+12) and you'll get +48 damage with each end, pluss however much else damage you'd normally do. Throw in shock trooper and the dammage would get truly insane