Can't Kill Me! [Archive] - Wizards Community

Can't Kill Me! [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Aceon
06-05-06, 06:50 PM My DM couldn't kill me the old fashioned way...at least not without breaking his own game.

What he couldn't do with monsters, looks like he'll do with a court that I voluntarily submitted to. Now my character is facing a Military Tribunal for War Crimes and if found guilty will likely be executed.

Up to this point my character was almost unkillable. Through judicious use of polymorph, death ward, energy immunity and channel celestial ...he was nigh invulnerable!

Now I need a new character. I would like to make a Dweomerkeeper and I request some suggestions and advice as our DM his strict limits on what books we can use. My current character is a 23rd level elf Cleric of Corellon Larethian. ( Cleric 20, Seeker of the Misty Isle 1, Contemplative 1)

Now, I want to make my new 22nd lvl character his son by my Drow cohort. ( Drow female wizard 20) So, 1/2 Elf & 1/2 Drow. Mostly for dramatic and role playing effect...I am not interested in any Drow powers or ECL. For game mechanics assume he is an elf.

Books allowed: Core + Complete Series + FrostBurn + web enhancements to these books only. Also, some few items from Book of Exalted Deeds and Draconomican have beed allowed on a case by case basis. **No Forgotten Realms anything!**

No Forgotten Realms will crimp the mechanics of the CO boards standard Dweomercheater of Mystra. There is no Mystra...so I will likely worship the Elf god of Magic or just worship Magic itself. There is no spell domain, rune domain or feat: Initiate of Mystra or feat: Magical Training. No Divine Disciple? ( not sure if that PrC is in the Complete Divine, if so then yes.)

I have a number of conflicting abilities that I would like this character to have, so I am sure I won't get them all in one build, but here are some ideas that I like:

Channel Celestial spell from BoED
Ice Assasin spell from FrostBurn
persistant spell/divine metamagic + nightsticks
Divine Might + Epic Divine Might = 3 X cha damage
Spikes and or Brambles
Polymorphing into an outsider via various means:
1) DiD5 PrC (I don't think books allowed has this ) or
2) Convince my DM to allow "Otherworldly" feat (maybe - probably not )
3) Convince my DM to let me be an Aasimar ( he won't)
4) Get the Mysticism Domain and use (persistant) Greater Aspect of the Deity to become an outsider and then polymorphing
5) simplest way...get Animal Domain and (persistant) Shapechange

Here is a rough outline of what I have so far.
Ability scores: I don't have them yet, but assume excellent wisdom and charisma
Class Progression: ( limited to no more than 2 PrC's, but free bonus feat at 1st and extra pip at 20th)

1) Cleric 1 (magic/msysticism) [or try to get rune domain] extend spell, persistant spell
2) Cleric 2
3) Cleric 3 divine metatmagic -persistant spell
4) Cleric 4
5) Cleric 5
6) Sorceror 1 scribe scroll
7) DweomerKeeeper 1
8) DwmrK 2
9) DwmrK 3 Extra Turning
10) DwmrK 4
11) DwmrK 5
12) DwmrK 6 Pious Spell surge
13) DwmrK 7
14) DwmrK 8
15) DwmrK 9 Quicken Spell
16) DwmrK 10
17) Contemplative 1 ( Animal )
18) Cont 2 Divine Might
19) Cont 3
20) Cont 4
21) Epic Dweomerkeeper 1 -epic Divine Might
22) Epic Dwmrk 2

Please keep in mind that this is a work in progress and I am open to suggenstions/modifications.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide!

Aceon

**************************************** ****************************
What happened with my character? After some coercion...I let slip to a dragon prince the location of a slaver who had dragon slaves. He threated to end our alliance with my king if I didn't reveal the location of the city. Though I begged him not to, the dragons torched the city anyway. The evil city was enemy with our king, but still, innocents died and my character is on trial for his life and will likely die for something that someone else did.
Subedei
06-05-06, 07:00 PM You..ahah...nailed your female cohort..ahahahahah...who's a drow...buahahaha

:rofl:
Aceon
06-05-06, 07:10 PM You..ahah...nailed your female cohort..ahahahahah...who's a drow...buahahaha

:rofl:

Yep! Thought you'd like that! :D

This game has been going on nearly 2 1/2 years now and since elves are slaves in the human lands, and we were in hiding together all the time, and since we shared a tent...and I got tired of hearing all the lewd and lacivious jokes that came my way I finally decided to give in and just play along with it! :P
PhoenixInferno
06-05-06, 09:31 PM Corellon Larethian IS the Elven God of Magic (he has the Magic domain). The Spell Domain has been reprinted in the Spell Compendium. You can become an Outsider by finishing Contemplative.
Valanthe
06-05-06, 09:42 PM Couldn't you bluff your way out of the tribunal? I mean, c'mon, what's your party face doing?
Aceon
06-05-06, 11:04 PM Actually, it was the party thief...er, Rogue...that is to say "courtier" who brought me up on charges. Two party members are on the tribunal and the third is an NPC cleric of the god of retribution...so, again I am not optimistic about my chances of making it through the trial alive. Seeing as how they have exactly zero evidence of any wrongdoing and they are allowing the trial to proceed anyway...and I neglected to mention that I was the military commanding officer of the party and the other players were my subordinates and that the rogue...er "courtier" was my 2nd in command, well you can see what is going on here. When I got back to the rest of the party and explained to them what had happend with the dragons and that they had planned to attack the evil slaver city, my first officer announced that he was bringing me up on charges and incited a mutiny against my character in a rather obvious bid for power. Several other mutinous dogs in the party went along with it and the rest were still stunned over the impending disaster to the city and loss of innocent life. I wasn't going to fight my fellow clan members, whose lives I had saved so many times, so I submitted to arrest and was put in chains and was brought back to our nearest outpost tower for a trial. The trial should be over this week and I expect to need a new character then...hence this post.

While I am tempted to exact retribution, I think my fellow players would frown on it, so I will stick to making a frustratingly powerful new character.
Aceon
06-05-06, 11:11 PM Corellon Larethian IS the Elven God of Magic (he has the Magic domain). The Spell Domain has been reprinted in the Spell Compendium. You can become an Outsider by finishing Contemplative.

Actually, I have already been down this road before with my DM. He insists that Corellon Larethian is NOT the elven god of Magic, and he has the players handbook to back him up on this. Even though his description mentions Magic as part of his portfolio...he does not get the Magic domain. ( We are not using Forgotten Realms )

Also, I am not sure at what level Contemplative grants Outsider type, but I want to finish 10 levels of Dweomerkeeper so I can go epic with that. I might be able to get the spell domain, but the Spell Compendium is not a book that is approved for the campaign. I might be able to get some stuff out of it though, with prior permission.
PhoenixInferno
06-06-06, 12:13 AM Contemplative 10 gets Mystic Union which changes your type to Outsider (Native). You could take that Epic. I'm sure its Epic progression would get many Epic feats because it doesn't have any class abilities to progress.
dan8uillin
06-06-06, 02:03 AM grats on avoiding an interparty brawl, but i would have killed every single one of them before i gave up even an ounce of power.
Aceon
06-06-06, 04:50 PM Yes, I am sure I could have killed all of them. Why do you think they elected me leader in the first place! The problem is that if I did kill them all, we would have no game, and I would rather not be a spoiler like that.

But getting back to my question...any other ideas or suggestions for my new character? I want to take all 10 levels of Dweomerkeeper to get the 4 supernatural spells a day. While uber powerfull, the text of the spell: Miracle does not actually read the same as does the spell: Wish. Wish quite clearly states that you can use it to create or enhance a magic item. Miracle does not.
djinni
06-06-06, 06:03 PM Miracle does not.
Miracle also cannot be used against the player like wish can, in addition it is up to the GM on whether or not the Diety allows the miracle...
you should try using UR-priest instead of cleric that way the DM can't say "you god says no."
Aceon
06-07-06, 12:44 AM That is a very strong point. Thanks!

But I don't think I can forsake my god Corellon Larethian. I have worked hard to develop a bit of a reputation as his Champion, and besides Ur-Priests are just to icky!

Oops! Speaking of my current character there! I guess that is assuming he survives the trial. For my new character, ( who is his son ) to be an Ur-Priest would be a real betrayal of everything deal ol Dad fought for. ( 130 years of freeing elven slaves from the human lands. ) But if Dad is killed by these traitor humans whose cause he also fought for...? Hmm... could be.
Subedei
06-07-06, 01:45 AM The bitter son who hates everything his father stood for but constantly finds himself in his shadow, following his footsteps is a staple archetype.
InnErgEE
06-07-06, 02:14 AM I say blast the rogue into the afterlife and insist the party call his spirit back for proper truthful questioning so they can see you are innocent. And even if this route led to a major interparty battle I say shame to the rogue for starting it all by being a prick.

And the son doesn't even have to be bitter at the dad, more so I would see it being bitter at the God who let his extremely faithful and pious father die.
Subedei
06-07-06, 02:22 AM As long as he's bitter.
Caelic
06-07-06, 08:57 AM Consider the fact that the Spell Compendium isn't allowed a blessing--some of the tactics you want to use (Spikes and Brambles, for instance,) have been fixed in the Spell Compendium.
Aceon
06-07-06, 09:06 AM I say blast the rogue into the afterlife and insist the party call his spirit back for proper truthful questioning so they can see you are innocent. And even if this route led to a major interparty battle I say shame to the rogue for starting it all by being a prick.

Ha ha! Tempting, but somehow I don't think I will be allowed to cast spells in the courtroom. No one besides the tower castellan/bailif may have a weapon in the courtroom and I have been given vague but ominous threats about anyone attempting to cast a spell while within the room.

Besides, the rogue is an exalted good prick, who actually believes what he is saying. In fact he has testified that he believes I thought I was doing the right thing at the time, but that I am ultimately to blame for the resulting loss of innocent life in the enemy city torched by the dragons.

This is the same exalted lawfull good rogue who has boasted on multiple occasions that he could cheerfully assasinate someone if he believed they stood in his way, and still remain exalted lawful good. ( points to Slayer of Domiel PrC ...which he is not. )
Aceon
06-07-06, 09:12 AM Consider the fact that the Spell Compendium isn't allowed a blessing--some of the tactics you want to use (Spikes and Brambles, for instance,) have been fixed in the Spell Compendium.
Oh, well actually, now that you mention it...

Spell Compendium is only allowed as updates to spells from allowed books. So if Spikes and Brambles are updated in the Spell Compendium, then we have to go by that. Oh, well. No big deal. I don't expect to get everything that I like into one character.

Perhaps Divine Might+Epic Divine Might + buff out Charisma for 3X Cha damage would work as well as spikes and brambles. A little more effort and feats, but gets the job done.
Caelic
06-07-06, 10:40 AM What's your Diplomacy mod like? Got room for a cohort?

If most of the tribunal is going to be NPCs, monstrously high Diplomacy should be able to sway them.

Get yourself a good lawyer. ;)
Aceon
06-07-06, 01:24 PM I have a nearly maxed out Diplomacy at 23 ranks (max 25) + 5 Cha = +28

The problem is that 2 members of the tribunal are PC's who are having a grand ol time putting me through the ringer for the last 3 weeks! :)

Also, I chose not to take the stand in my own defense. So, my character has not said a single word throughout the trial. So no Diplomacy. ( biting my tongue for 3 weeks! ) The reason is that the list of spurious charges and the way they were presented to the court was pretty damning in and of itself. They really made me out to be a war criminal.

They called into question every time I had used teleportation ( travel domain ) to return to the elven temple to buy magic items for party members ( I don't need any for myself ) or get the clerics of the temple to make items for party members they made it seem like a deriliction of duty for the commanding officer to dissapear.

There were some elfs who were brought forward as witnesses for the prosecution and the prosecution tried to find out if anything had happened politically in the elven kingdom while I was visiting, or if any troop movements had occurred after I left. Because one of the charges levelled against me was that I had taken many personal trips to the elven lands and that I showed entirely too much interest in personal, family issues ( My characters father was the high priest of the even temple of Corellon Larethian for hundreds of years..untill he was asassinated and my superior officer suggested I take a few days off to attend the funeral.)

The theory was that I might have taken undue interest in telling my characters brother where to take his small army of 5,000 of our household guard into the wildlands to pursue the small army of elite, highly trained Ogres who had attacked and killed our father. They did pursue the Ogres but not becase of me. Also they were nearly all slaughtered in an ambush by Black Cloaks.

Why would any of these charges even be considered wrong? Because it is against Clan law to pursue anything but clan goals and missions once a member joins it. ( all party members are required to be of clan blood and sworn into the clan )

Also I got the best lawyer in the business, he was leader of all 3 clans for hundreds of years and knows clan law better than anyone. Also, he is one of the DM's pet epic characters...uber powerfull. So I may yet survive.
Redeemer of Ogar
06-07-06, 02:26 PM I don't suppose having your Cohort come in and plead on your behalf would have any positive impact here? :D At the very least, it's a way that you can maintain your character's honorable refusal to speak, while still actually getting to participate as a player. :)
Aceon
06-07-06, 03:06 PM That would be fantastic! Except for the fact that my cohort is a Drow female Wizard and we had sent her on a mission to the underdark to try to get her house to form an alliance with our clan. And my dm won't say what she is doing right now but makes ominous references to how she is in it up to her eyeballs right now!

But I have had several characters and NPC's speak up on my behalf. The General and the some of the dragons ( in human form ) came to the trial to speak for me. The dragons put up with this farce of a trial untill near the end, then stormed out after discovering that the rogue had warned the enemy mages of their intent to free the dragons enslaved brethren. They have dissolved our alliance and now a war is brewing between the dragons and the Magistrates ( the enemy Mages who rule the area ) At this point my character is the only one who the dragons trust.

Not having my cohort around for a few months kindof makes my leadership feat useless, but I am considering getting a new cohort to replace her. She is my characters wife anyway, so it is not like we'll become enemies if I get a new cohort.
Szass_Tam
06-07-06, 03:46 PM Or try this....When your wife/cohort finds out about your execution (if it comes to that), she hires an assasin, your new character (22nd-lvl ninja), to take out all those who helped convict you. I've come to the conclusion that the ninja, if played correctly, is a source of incredible power. My DM has attempted to kill my ninja on many an occasion, but each time was unsuccessful.
Kresalak
06-07-06, 04:11 PM Incredible power ninja lacks.

As to the "bitter son" archetype, your initial build apparantly wants to be able to hit things. Hard. So I propose Paladin 2/Hexblade 3/Ur-Priest 2/Bone Knight 12/Blackguard 3

Sorry, little Bone Knight addiction got through there, and 5 Nations isn't on your list (although if you could get your DM to reflavor it...). So you could substitute Bone Knight for Dweomerkeeper, and switch the build to Evil Variant Paladin 2/Hexblade 4/Ur-Priest 2/Dweomerkeeper 12/Blackguard 2. You get epic Dweomerkeeper, Cha x2 to saves, Cha x3 to saves vs spells, full Ur-Priest casting, and Rebuke Undead x/day to power divine feats.

But if you can get Bone Knight approved, it has all the nice immunities that you might want...
Aceon
06-08-06, 11:14 AM Incredible power ninja lacks.

As to the "bitter son" archetype, your initial build apparantly wants to be able to hit things. Hard. So I propose Paladin 2/Hexblade 3/Ur-Priest 2/Bone Knight 12/Blackguard 3

Sorry, little Bone Knight addiction got through there, and 5 Nations isn't on your list (although if you could get your DM to reflavor it...). So you could substitute Bone Knight for Dweomerkeeper, and switch the build to Evil Variant Paladin 2/Hexblade 4/Ur-Priest 2/Dweomerkeeper 12/Blackguard 2. You get epic Dweomerkeeper, Cha x2 to saves, Cha x3 to saves vs spells, full Ur-Priest casting, and Rebuke Undead x/day to power divine feats.

But if you can get Bone Knight approved, it has all the nice immunities that you might want...

Very nice! A couple of quick questions though as I don't have my books with me...We are allowed a maximum of 2 PrC. So, I can get away with base clases to do the build and then Dweomerkeeper and Blackguard...but are Hexblade and Ur-Priest prestige classes or full classes? I think both are prestige classes but I am not positive they may not be variant full 20 classes?
Subedei
06-08-06, 11:18 AM Ur-Priest is a prestige class, Hexblade is a base class.
Aceon
06-09-06, 09:40 PM thanks

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Aceon 06-05-06, 06:50 PM	My DM couldn't kill me the old fashioned way...at least not without breaking his own game. What he couldn't do with monsters, looks like he'll do with a court that I voluntarily submitted to. Now my character is facing a Military Tribunal for War Crimes and if found guilty will likely be executed. Up to this point my character was almost unkillable. Through judicious use of polymorph, death ward, energy immunity and channel celestial ...he was nigh invulnerable! Now I need a new character. I would like to make a Dweomerkeeper and I request some suggestions and advice as our DM his strict limits on what books we can use. My current character is a 23rd level elf Cleric of Corellon Larethian. ( Cleric 20, Seeker of the Misty Isle 1, Contemplative 1) Now, I want to make my new 22nd lvl character his son by my Drow cohort. ( Drow female wizard 20) So, 1/2 Elf & 1/2 Drow. Mostly for dramatic and role playing effect...I am not interested in any Drow powers or ECL. For game mechanics assume he is an elf. Books allowed: Core + Complete Series + FrostBurn + web enhancements to these books only. Also, some few items from Book of Exalted Deeds and Draconomican have beed allowed on a case by case basis. No Forgotten Realms anything! No Forgotten Realms will crimp the mechanics of the CO boards standard Dweomercheater of Mystra. There is no Mystra...so I will likely worship the Elf god of Magic or just worship Magic itself. There is no spell domain, rune domain or feat: Initiate of Mystra or feat: Magical Training. No Divine Disciple? ( not sure if that PrC is in the Complete Divine, if so then yes.) I have a number of conflicting abilities that I would like this character to have, so I am sure I won't get them all in one build, but here are some ideas that I like: Channel Celestial spell from BoED Ice Assasin spell from FrostBurn persistant spell/divine metamagic + nightsticks Divine Might + Epic Divine Might = 3 X cha damage Spikes and or Brambles Polymorphing into an outsider via various means: 1) DiD5 PrC (I don't think books allowed has this ) or 2) Convince my DM to allow "Otherworldly" feat (maybe - probably not ) 3) Convince my DM to let me be an Aasimar ( he won't) 4) Get the Mysticism Domain and use (persistant) Greater Aspect of the Deity to become an outsider and then polymorphing 5) simplest way...get Animal Domain and (persistant) Shapechange Here is a rough outline of what I have so far. Ability scores: I don't have them yet, but assume excellent wisdom and charisma Class Progression: ( limited to no more than 2 PrC's, but free bonus feat at 1st and extra pip at 20th) 1) Cleric 1 (magic/msysticism) [or try to get rune domain] extend spell, persistant spell 2) Cleric 2 3) Cleric 3 divine metatmagic -persistant spell 4) Cleric 4 5) Cleric 5 6) Sorceror 1 scribe scroll 7) DweomerKeeeper 1 8) DwmrK 2 9) DwmrK 3 Extra Turning 10) DwmrK 4 11) DwmrK 5 12) DwmrK 6 Pious Spell surge 13) DwmrK 7 14) DwmrK 8 15) DwmrK 9 Quicken Spell 16) DwmrK 10 17) Contemplative 1 ( Animal ) 18) Cont 2 Divine Might 19) Cont 3 20) Cont 4 21) Epic Dweomerkeeper 1 -epic Divine Might 22) Epic Dwmrk 2 Please keep in mind that this is a work in progress and I am open to suggenstions/modifications. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide! Aceon ************************************** ************************** What happened with my character? After some coercion...I let slip to a dragon prince the location of a slaver who had dragon slaves. He threated to end our alliance with my king if I didn't reveal the location of the city. Though I begged him not to, the dragons torched the city anyway. The evil city was enemy with our king, but still, innocents died and my character is on trial for his life and will likely die for something that someone else did.
Subedei 06-05-06, 07:00 PM	You..ahah...nailed your female cohort..ahahahahah...who's a drow...buahahaha :rofl:
Aceon 06-05-06, 07:10 PM	You..ahah...nailed your female cohort..ahahahahah...who's a drow...buahahaha :rofl: Yep! Thought you'd like that! :D This game has been going on nearly 2 1/2 years now and since elves are slaves in the human lands, and we were in hiding together all the time, and since we shared a tent...and I got tired of hearing all the lewd and lacivious jokes that came my way I finally decided to give in and just play along with it! :P
PhoenixInferno 06-05-06, 09:31 PM	Corellon Larethian IS the Elven God of Magic (he has the Magic domain). The Spell Domain has been reprinted in the Spell Compendium. You can become an Outsider by finishing Contemplative.
Valanthe 06-05-06, 09:42 PM	Couldn't you bluff your way out of the tribunal? I mean, c'mon, what's your party face doing?
Aceon 06-05-06, 11:04 PM	Actually, it was the party thief...er, Rogue...that is to say "courtier" who brought me up on charges. Two party members are on the tribunal and the third is an NPC cleric of the god of retribution...so, again I am not optimistic about my chances of making it through the trial alive. Seeing as how they have exactly zero evidence of any wrongdoing and they are allowing the trial to proceed anyway...and I neglected to mention that I was the military commanding officer of the party and the other players were my subordinates and that the rogue...er "courtier" was my 2nd in command, well you can see what is going on here. When I got back to the rest of the party and explained to them what had happend with the dragons and that they had planned to attack the evil slaver city, my first officer announced that he was bringing me up on charges and incited a mutiny against my character in a rather obvious bid for power. Several other mutinous dogs in the party went along with it and the rest were still stunned over the impending disaster to the city and loss of innocent life. I wasn't going to fight my fellow clan members, whose lives I had saved so many times, so I submitted to arrest and was put in chains and was brought back to our nearest outpost tower for a trial. The trial should be over this week and I expect to need a new character then...hence this post. While I am tempted to exact retribution, I think my fellow players would frown on it, so I will stick to making a frustratingly powerful new character.
Aceon 06-05-06, 11:11 PM	Corellon Larethian IS the Elven God of Magic (he has the Magic domain). The Spell Domain has been reprinted in the Spell Compendium. You can become an Outsider by finishing Contemplative. Actually, I have already been down this road before with my DM. He insists that Corellon Larethian is NOT the elven god of Magic, and he has the players handbook to back him up on this. Even though his description mentions Magic as part of his portfolio...he does not get the Magic domain. ( We are not using Forgotten Realms ) Also, I am not sure at what level Contemplative grants Outsider type, but I want to finish 10 levels of Dweomerkeeper so I can go epic with that. I might be able to get the spell domain, but the Spell Compendium is not a book that is approved for the campaign. I might be able to get some stuff out of it though, with prior permission.
PhoenixInferno 06-06-06, 12:13 AM	Contemplative 10 gets Mystic Union which changes your type to Outsider (Native). You could take that Epic. I'm sure its Epic progression would get many Epic feats because it doesn't have any class abilities to progress.
dan8uillin 06-06-06, 02:03 AM	grats on avoiding an interparty brawl, but i would have killed every single one of them before i gave up even an ounce of power.
Aceon 06-06-06, 04:50 PM	Yes, I am sure I could have killed all of them. Why do you think they elected me leader in the first place! The problem is that if I did kill them all, we would have no game, and I would rather not be a spoiler like that. But getting back to my question...any other ideas or suggestions for my new character? I want to take all 10 levels of Dweomerkeeper to get the 4 supernatural spells a day. While uber powerfull, the text of the spell: Miracle does not actually read the same as does the spell: Wish. Wish quite clearly states that you can use it to create or enhance a magic item. Miracle does not.
djinni 06-06-06, 06:03 PM	Miracle does not. Miracle also cannot be used against the player like wish can, in addition it is up to the GM on whether or not the Diety allows the miracle... you should try using UR-priest instead of cleric that way the DM can't say "you god says no."
Aceon 06-07-06, 12:44 AM	That is a very strong point. Thanks! But I don't think I can forsake my god Corellon Larethian. I have worked hard to develop a bit of a reputation as his Champion, and besides Ur-Priests are just to icky! Oops! Speaking of my current character there! I guess that is assuming he survives the trial. For my new character, ( who is his son ) to be an Ur-Priest would be a real betrayal of everything deal ol Dad fought for. ( 130 years of freeing elven slaves from the human lands. ) But if Dad is killed by these traitor humans whose cause he also fought for...? Hmm... could be.
Subedei 06-07-06, 01:45 AM	The bitter son who hates everything his father stood for but constantly finds himself in his shadow, following his footsteps is a staple archetype.
InnErgEE 06-07-06, 02:14 AM	I say blast the rogue into the afterlife and insist the party call his spirit back for proper truthful questioning so they can see you are innocent. And even if this route led to a major interparty battle I say shame to the rogue for starting it all by being a prick. And the son doesn't even have to be bitter at the dad, more so I would see it being bitter at the God who let his extremely faithful and pious father die.
Subedei 06-07-06, 02:22 AM	As long as he's bitter.
Caelic 06-07-06, 08:57 AM	Consider the fact that the Spell Compendium isn't allowed a blessing--some of the tactics you want to use (Spikes and Brambles, for instance,) have been fixed in the Spell Compendium.
Aceon 06-07-06, 09:06 AM	I say blast the rogue into the afterlife and insist the party call his spirit back for proper truthful questioning so they can see you are innocent. And even if this route led to a major interparty battle I say shame to the rogue for starting it all by being a prick. Ha ha! Tempting, but somehow I don't think I will be allowed to cast spells in the courtroom. No one besides the tower castellan/bailif may have a weapon in the courtroom and I have been given vague but ominous threats about anyone attempting to cast a spell while within the room. Besides, the rogue is an exalted good prick, who actually believes what he is saying. In fact he has testified that he believes I thought I was doing the right thing at the time, but that I am ultimately to blame for the resulting loss of innocent life in the enemy city torched by the dragons. This is the same exalted lawfull good rogue who has boasted on multiple occasions that he could cheerfully assasinate someone if he believed they stood in his way, and still remain exalted lawful good. ( points to Slayer of Domiel PrC ...which he is not. )
Aceon 06-07-06, 09:12 AM	Consider the fact that the Spell Compendium isn't allowed a blessing--some of the tactics you want to use (Spikes and Brambles, for instance,) have been fixed in the Spell Compendium. Oh, well actually, now that you mention it... Spell Compendium is only allowed as updates to spells from allowed books. So if Spikes and Brambles are updated in the Spell Compendium, then we have to go by that. Oh, well. No big deal. I don't expect to get everything that I like into one character. Perhaps Divine Might+Epic Divine Might + buff out Charisma for 3X Cha damage would work as well as spikes and brambles. A little more effort and feats, but gets the job done.
Caelic 06-07-06, 10:40 AM	What's your Diplomacy mod like? Got room for a cohort? If most of the tribunal is going to be NPCs, monstrously high Diplomacy should be able to sway them. Get yourself a good lawyer. ;)
Aceon 06-07-06, 01:24 PM	I have a nearly maxed out Diplomacy at 23 ranks (max 25) + 5 Cha = +28 The problem is that 2 members of the tribunal are PC's who are having a grand ol time putting me through the ringer for the last 3 weeks! :) Also, I chose not to take the stand in my own defense. So, my character has not said a single word throughout the trial. So no Diplomacy. ( biting my tongue for 3 weeks! ) The reason is that the list of spurious charges and the way they were presented to the court was pretty damning in and of itself. They really made me out to be a war criminal. They called into question every time I had used teleportation ( travel domain ) to return to the elven temple to buy magic items for party members ( I don't need any for myself ) or get the clerics of the temple to make items for party members they made it seem like a deriliction of duty for the commanding officer to dissapear. There were some elfs who were brought forward as witnesses for the prosecution and the prosecution tried to find out if anything had happened politically in the elven kingdom while I was visiting, or if any troop movements had occurred after I left. Because one of the charges levelled against me was that I had taken many personal trips to the elven lands and that I showed entirely too much interest in personal, family issues ( My characters father was the high priest of the even temple of Corellon Larethian for hundreds of years..untill he was asassinated and my superior officer suggested I take a few days off to attend the funeral.) The theory was that I might have taken undue interest in telling my characters brother where to take his small army of 5,000 of our household guard into the wildlands to pursue the small army of elite, highly trained Ogres who had attacked and killed our father. They did pursue the Ogres but not becase of me. Also they were nearly all slaughtered in an ambush by Black Cloaks. Why would any of these charges even be considered wrong? Because it is against Clan law to pursue anything but clan goals and missions once a member joins it. ( all party members are required to be of clan blood and sworn into the clan ) Also I got the best lawyer in the business, he was leader of all 3 clans for hundreds of years and knows clan law better than anyone. Also, he is one of the DM's pet epic characters...uber powerfull. So I may yet survive.
Redeemer of Ogar 06-07-06, 02:26 PM	I don't suppose having your Cohort come in and plead on your behalf would have any positive impact here? :D At the very least, it's a way that you can maintain your character's honorable refusal to speak, while still actually getting to participate as a player. :)
Aceon 06-07-06, 03:06 PM	That would be fantastic! Except for the fact that my cohort is a Drow female Wizard and we had sent her on a mission to the underdark to try to get her house to form an alliance with our clan. And my dm won't say what she is doing right now but makes ominous references to how she is in it up to her eyeballs right now! But I have had several characters and NPC's speak up on my behalf. The General and the some of the dragons ( in human form ) came to the trial to speak for me. The dragons put up with this farce of a trial untill near the end, then stormed out after discovering that the rogue had warned the enemy mages of their intent to free the dragons enslaved brethren. They have dissolved our alliance and now a war is brewing between the dragons and the Magistrates ( the enemy Mages who rule the area ) At this point my character is the only one who the dragons trust. Not having my cohort around for a few months kindof makes my leadership feat useless, but I am considering getting a new cohort to replace her. She is my characters wife anyway, so it is not like we'll become enemies if I get a new cohort.
Szass_Tam 06-07-06, 03:46 PM	Or try this....When your wife/cohort finds out about your execution (if it comes to that), she hires an assasin, your new character (22nd-lvl ninja), to take out all those who helped convict you. I've come to the conclusion that the ninja, if played correctly, is a source of incredible power. My DM has attempted to kill my ninja on many an occasion, but each time was unsuccessful.
Kresalak 06-07-06, 04:11 PM	Incredible power ninja lacks. As to the "bitter son" archetype, your initial build apparantly wants to be able to hit things. Hard. So I propose Paladin 2/Hexblade 3/Ur-Priest 2/Bone Knight 12/Blackguard 3 Sorry, little Bone Knight addiction got through there, and 5 Nations isn't on your list (although if you could get your DM to reflavor it...). So you could substitute Bone Knight for Dweomerkeeper, and switch the build to Evil Variant Paladin 2/Hexblade 4/Ur-Priest 2/Dweomerkeeper 12/Blackguard 2. You get epic Dweomerkeeper, Cha x2 to saves, Cha x3 to saves vs spells, full Ur-Priest casting, and Rebuke Undead x/day to power divine feats. But if you can get Bone Knight approved, it has all the nice immunities that you might want...
Aceon 06-08-06, 11:14 AM	Incredible power ninja lacks. As to the "bitter son" archetype, your initial build apparantly wants to be able to hit things. Hard. So I propose Paladin 2/Hexblade 3/Ur-Priest 2/Bone Knight 12/Blackguard 3 Sorry, little Bone Knight addiction got through there, and 5 Nations isn't on your list (although if you could get your DM to reflavor it...). So you could substitute Bone Knight for Dweomerkeeper, and switch the build to Evil Variant Paladin 2/Hexblade 4/Ur-Priest 2/Dweomerkeeper 12/Blackguard 2. You get epic Dweomerkeeper, Cha x2 to saves, Cha x3 to saves vs spells, full Ur-Priest casting, and Rebuke Undead x/day to power divine feats. But if you can get Bone Knight approved, it has all the nice immunities that you might want... Very nice! A couple of quick questions though as I don't have my books with me...We are allowed a maximum of 2 PrC. So, I can get away with base clases to do the build and then Dweomerkeeper and Blackguard...but are Hexblade and Ur-Priest prestige classes or full classes? I think both are prestige classes but I am not positive they may not be variant full 20 classes?
Subedei 06-08-06, 11:18 AM	Ur-Priest is a prestige class, Hexblade is a base class.
Aceon 06-09-06, 09:40 PM	thanks