How does Dispater act? [Archive] - Wizards Community

How does Dispater act? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Surgo
09-12-07, 05:22 PM In a certain idea for a story arc I've had and have been committing to paper recently, I have a major character going to Dis in an attempt to retrieve something...or, rather, someone. This someone just happens to be a prisoner. Fortunately, he's not an important prisoner...the only importance he currently has is his race (angel). The character would not be interested in releasing the prisoner, but rather taking him for his own nefarious purposes. Thus the idea I had would that the character, in essence, bribe Dispater, trading an item of greater value to the Lord in exchange for the prisoner. This is where roleplaying Dispater comes in.

It would, of course, not be called a bribe. It would be a gift, in exchange for proper passage into Dis (passports or visas or whatever the multiple Baatorian equivalents are in order to actually get there safely). The character would be granted an audience with Dispater, in order to give the gift with his own hands. The gift, the character would say, would be a gift of thanks for the Lord of the second for allowing the character to stay in the great city, for he was looking for something there, mentioning how unfortunate for the celestials some recent trafficking was...Dispater would agree, give the character his blessing in finding what they were looking for (in the form of a spell key), and make an offhand note that perhaps the prison guards have been a bit too ferocious to visitors lately, and they may need to be reigned in with some sort of punishment, with the devilish version of a wink and a smile. Then the character would go off and perform their adventure of kidnapping something out of one of the prisons of Dis, all without any interference from Dispater himself.

The above is how I imagine such a conversation with Dispater would work. The entire thing would be a complete facade, an elaborate display of innuendo, and both parties would know it. However, this facade is absolutely necessary; Dispater himself could say that he had no idea that that was going to happen, that that spell key for Plane Shift was just a nice token in return for the gift, to help the character find his way off easier, how he is so angry that the character would betray his civility like that. Of course, Dispater would not have to say any of these things, because there is no one to take him to task for such a transgression, but it's required anyway because of his lawful nature and the fact that it's just good practice to do so.

That is how I imagine Dispater to act, and how I should play him. Is there anything I should make note of, or find a way to work in? Do I have, in your opinion, the completely wrong idea of devilish interaction? Or, perhaps, another Lord that this sort of thing would be even more suited for? Tell me what you think.
Zousha_Omenohu
09-12-07, 08:26 PM Well, if it's any help, Tyrants of the Nine Hells has a little suggestion on how to roleplay Dispater:

The Lord of the Second affects a calm, controlled demeanor at all times. He makes an effort to remain gentlemanly and sophisticated even when committing acts of ferocious cruelty.

So he's very, very polite. Also, something doesn't quite sit well with me about seeing Dispater in person. Paranoia is his middle name and he would never meet someone in person. If this exchange was to be made, it would probably be through some form of remote communication or through a go-between, since Dispater would probably assume that the character means to lure him into a trap or something.
Bob the Efreet
09-12-07, 08:40 PM Also, something doesn't quite sit well with me about seeing Dispater in person. Paranoia is his middle name and he would never meet someone in person. If this exchange was to be made, it would probably be through some form of remote communication or through a go-between, since Dispater would probably assume that the character means to lure him into a trap or something.

Indeed. Dispater is ridiculously paranoid, and likely has a number of contingencies for getting out of most, if not all, problems that arise. Contingency #1 is "never leave the Iron Tower".
Witch
09-12-07, 08:47 PM I play Dispater as blatantly using the most paranoid tricks - always staying in control of the situation, or seeming to.

When running something called the Iron Siege, which involves deity characters trying to kill Dispater, I had a deity try and draw Dispater out of the Iron Tower by devastating vast portions of Dis. This was how I thought Dispater would reply (by means of a projected image of some sort whose nature I will not clarify yet):Now, now. Can you not see that your effort is in vain? As soon as you leave this area, devils will be sent to rebuild. Do I not demolish my own city in order to have it rebuilt myself, already? All you have done here is excert your own petty anger. You attempted to tell to this world that you are not without power. But nothing you have done has constituted a fundamental difference in this plane - it has only emphasized your own powerlessness in this regard.
In everything Dispater says, fundamental control and arrogance should be clear even if he is a gentlemen. He should be the one on top of the conversation, at all times, and if the PCs think they're on top of such a situation... they need to be forced to think again.
Thegans
09-12-07, 08:49 PM Well, if it's any help, Tyrants of the Nine Hells has a little suggestion on how to roleplay Dispater:

So he's very, very polite. Also, something doesn't quite sit well with me about seeing Dispater in person. Paranoia is his middle name and he would never meet someone in person. If this exchange was to be made, it would probably be through some form of remote communication or through a go-between, since Dispater would probably assume that the character means to lure him into a trap or something.

Isn't that what an aspect is for?
Igfig
09-12-07, 09:06 PM ...and he would never meet someone in person.
Do remember that archdevils and demon princes can create aspects. Dispater himself never leaves the Iron Tower, but his aspects regularly travel the planes, entertain visitors, and answer summoning requests. An archdevil and his aspect share the same mind; what one knows, the other knows. What I'm getting at, as you have already guessed, is that the PCs can meet with one of his aspects instead.

To reply to the opening post, that does sound like I would imagine Dispater to act. However, being an archdevil of incredible intelligence, I can't imagine that he would allow the PCs to just waltz out of his city with his prisoner. More likely he would double-cross them, sending a disguised elite erinyes to impersonate the prisoner. Then he could not only deny any involvement in the break-in, but also put out a warrant for the PCs' arrest and/or soul-capture. If they prove to be too difficult for his first two posses to take down, he can arrange an "information leak" to another archdevil, who would devote forces to the PCs' capture and suffer greater losses than Dispater did. (Of course, on the off chance that the PCs do get captured, they won't be able to tell their captors anything important about Dispater's prisons; he sent them to a false prison in the first place.)

Wow, that came to me surprisingly easily. I should see about getting an internship in the Nine Hells.
Surgo
09-12-07, 09:38 PM Thanks for the replies so far, and I have a few responses for the responses.

...and he would never meet someone in person.
As someone before me beat me to it, aspects. I was actually thinking of some sort of Project Image style spell instead of an aspect, but an aspect works as well. Meeting an aspect or a projected image is as good as meeting the real thing from the character's perspective anyway, and as long as the meeting itself is accomplished it doesn't really matter how it's done.

However, being an archedevil of incredible intelligence, I can't imagine that he would allow the PCs to just waltz out of his city with his prisoner. More likely he would double-cross them, sending a disguised elite erinyes to impersonate the prisoner. Then he could not only deny any involvement in the break-in, but also put out a warrant for the PCs' arrest and/or soul-capture. If they prove to be too difficult for his first two posses to take down, he can arrange an "information leak" to another archdevil, who would devote forces to the PCs' capture and suffer greater losses than Dispater did.
It's not really waltzing into and out of the city, though. I suppose I didn't make it clear enough in the OP that it's more of a bargain or a sale, though it takes the form of a gift to make it 'lawfully okay'. The character would spend a -lot- of time procuring such a great gift for Dispater to make him willing to part with a prisoner in return; the gift would have to be much more useful for him than the prisoner, at least. Dispater would have it thoroughly exmained by a suboordinate, of course. Provided these rules of the trade are adhered to, with Dispater getting something more valuable for him out of the deal than he had before, I see no reason why he would not fulfill his end of the bargain. Reason being that he could get another one of these offers from the character in the future, and also because the character could use the angel prisoner in such a way to further create evil on the prime world* and thus, however indirectly, advance Dispater's own agenda ever-so-slightly. The former factor is more important than the latter, but the latter just makes the offer slightly more agreeable.

In conclusion, as long as Dispater benefits I see no reason why he would not double cross them. For the character to be even more secure, he could time his offer at a point where Dispater feels that the Dis prison guard union is getting too uppity and needs to be shown incompetent and slapped down for that reason. (How would the character get that sort of insider information? The Yugoloths I guess! This is a story idea that came to me while I was typing this post.) Dispater probably doesn't need a crisis to slap the prison guard union, but if it makes it that much easier so the better, and if he even directly benefits from it (in the form of the character's gift), that's excellent. I use this as a humorous example of an angle that the character might tackle, but I believe it illustrates what I'm trying to get at: so long as the character makes sure that the stars align, they should be able to do it and get away with it.

* In this case, the character would sever the hands of the angel prisoner to use as a component in the creation of an artifact, and use the rest of its body/soul for another ritual.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Surgo 09-12-07, 05:22 PM	In a certain idea for a story arc I've had and have been committing to paper recently, I have a major character going to Dis in an attempt to retrieve something...or, rather, someone. This someone just happens to be a prisoner. Fortunately, he's not an important prisoner...the only importance he currently has is his race (angel). The character would not be interested in releasing the prisoner, but rather taking him for his own nefarious purposes. Thus the idea I had would that the character, in essence, bribe Dispater, trading an item of greater value to the Lord in exchange for the prisoner. This is where roleplaying Dispater comes in. It would, of course, not be called a bribe. It would be a gift, in exchange for proper passage into Dis (passports or visas or whatever the multiple Baatorian equivalents are in order to actually get there safely). The character would be granted an audience with Dispater, in order to give the gift with his own hands. The gift, the character would say, would be a gift of thanks for the Lord of the second for allowing the character to stay in the great city, for he was looking for something there, mentioning how unfortunate for the celestials some recent trafficking was...Dispater would agree, give the character his blessing in finding what they were looking for (in the form of a spell key), and make an offhand note that perhaps the prison guards have been a bit too ferocious to visitors lately, and they may need to be reigned in with some sort of punishment, with the devilish version of a wink and a smile. Then the character would go off and perform their adventure of kidnapping something out of one of the prisons of Dis, all without any interference from Dispater himself. The above is how I imagine such a conversation with Dispater would work. The entire thing would be a complete facade, an elaborate display of innuendo, and both parties would know it. However, this facade is absolutely necessary; Dispater himself could say that he had no idea that that was going to happen, that that spell key for Plane Shift was just a nice token in return for the gift, to help the character find his way off easier, how he is so angry that the character would betray his civility like that. Of course, Dispater would not have to say any of these things, because there is no one to take him to task for such a transgression, but it's required anyway because of his lawful nature and the fact that it's just good practice to do so. That is how I imagine Dispater to act, and how I should play him. Is there anything I should make note of, or find a way to work in? Do I have, in your opinion, the completely wrong idea of devilish interaction? Or, perhaps, another Lord that this sort of thing would be even more suited for? Tell me what you think.
Zousha_Omenohu 09-12-07, 08:26 PM	Well, if it's any help, Tyrants of the Nine Hells has a little suggestion on how to roleplay Dispater: The Lord of the Second affects a calm, controlled demeanor at all times. He makes an effort to remain gentlemanly and sophisticated even when committing acts of ferocious cruelty. So he's very, very polite. Also, something doesn't quite sit well with me about seeing Dispater in person. Paranoia is his middle name and he would never meet someone in person. If this exchange was to be made, it would probably be through some form of remote communication or through a go-between, since Dispater would probably assume that the character means to lure him into a trap or something.
Bob the Efreet 09-12-07, 08:40 PM	Also, something doesn't quite sit well with me about seeing Dispater in person. Paranoia is his middle name and he would never meet someone in person. If this exchange was to be made, it would probably be through some form of remote communication or through a go-between, since Dispater would probably assume that the character means to lure him into a trap or something. Indeed. Dispater is ridiculously paranoid, and likely has a number of contingencies for getting out of most, if not all, problems that arise. Contingency #1 is "never leave the Iron Tower".
Witch 09-12-07, 08:47 PM	I play Dispater as blatantly using the most paranoid tricks - always staying in control of the situation, or seeming to. When running something called the Iron Siege, which involves deity characters trying to kill Dispater, I had a deity try and draw Dispater out of the Iron Tower by devastating vast portions of Dis. This was how I thought Dispater would reply (by means of a projected image of some sort whose nature I will not clarify yet):Now, now. Can you not see that your effort is in vain? As soon as you leave this area, devils will be sent to rebuild. Do I not demolish my own city in order to have it rebuilt myself, already? All you have done here is excert your own petty anger. You attempted to tell to this world that you are not without power. But nothing you have done has constituted a fundamental difference in this plane - it has only emphasized your own powerlessness in this regard. In everything Dispater says, fundamental control and arrogance should be clear even if he is a gentlemen. He should be the one on top of the conversation, at all times, and if the PCs think they're on top of such a situation... they need to be forced to think again.
Thegans 09-12-07, 08:49 PM	Well, if it's any help, Tyrants of the Nine Hells has a little suggestion on how to roleplay Dispater: So he's very, very polite. Also, something doesn't quite sit well with me about seeing Dispater in person. Paranoia is his middle name and he would never meet someone in person. If this exchange was to be made, it would probably be through some form of remote communication or through a go-between, since Dispater would probably assume that the character means to lure him into a trap or something. Isn't that what an aspect is for?
Igfig 09-12-07, 09:06 PM	...and he would never meet someone in person. Do remember that archdevils and demon princes can create aspects. Dispater himself never leaves the Iron Tower, but his aspects regularly travel the planes, entertain visitors, and answer summoning requests. An archdevil and his aspect share the same mind; what one knows, the other knows. What I'm getting at, as you have already guessed, is that the PCs can meet with one of his aspects instead. To reply to the opening post, that does sound like I would imagine Dispater to act. However, being an archdevil of incredible intelligence, I can't imagine that he would allow the PCs to just waltz out of his city with his prisoner. More likely he would double-cross them, sending a disguised elite erinyes to impersonate the prisoner. Then he could not only deny any involvement in the break-in, but also put out a warrant for the PCs' arrest and/or soul-capture. If they prove to be too difficult for his first two posses to take down, he can arrange an "information leak" to another archdevil, who would devote forces to the PCs' capture and suffer greater losses than Dispater did. (Of course, on the off chance that the PCs do get captured, they won't be able to tell their captors anything important about Dispater's prisons; he sent them to a false prison in the first place.) Wow, that came to me surprisingly easily. I should see about getting an internship in the Nine Hells.
Surgo 09-12-07, 09:38 PM	Thanks for the replies so far, and I have a few responses for the responses. ...and he would never meet someone in person. As someone before me beat me to it, aspects. I was actually thinking of some sort of Project Image style spell instead of an aspect, but an aspect works as well. Meeting an aspect or a projected image is as good as meeting the real thing from the character's perspective anyway, and as long as the meeting itself is accomplished it doesn't really matter how it's done. However, being an archedevil of incredible intelligence, I can't imagine that he would allow the PCs to just waltz out of his city with his prisoner. More likely he would double-cross them, sending a disguised elite erinyes to impersonate the prisoner. Then he could not only deny any involvement in the break-in, but also put out a warrant for the PCs' arrest and/or soul-capture. If they prove to be too difficult for his first two posses to take down, he can arrange an "information leak" to another archdevil, who would devote forces to the PCs' capture and suffer greater losses than Dispater did. It's not really waltzing into and out of the city, though. I suppose I didn't make it clear enough in the OP that it's more of a bargain or a sale, though it takes the form of a gift to make it 'lawfully okay'. The character would spend a -lot- of time procuring such a great gift for Dispater to make him willing to part with a prisoner in return; the gift would have to be much more useful for him than the prisoner, at least. Dispater would have it thoroughly exmained by a suboordinate, of course. Provided these rules of the trade are adhered to, with Dispater getting something more valuable for him out of the deal than he had before, I see no reason why he would not fulfill his end of the bargain. Reason being that he could get another one of these offers from the character in the future, and also because the character could use the angel prisoner in such a way to further create evil on the prime world* and thus, however indirectly, advance Dispater's own agenda ever-so-slightly. The former factor is more important than the latter, but the latter just makes the offer slightly more agreeable. In conclusion, as long as Dispater benefits I see no reason why he would not double cross them. For the character to be even more secure, he could time his offer at a point where Dispater feels that the Dis prison guard union is getting too uppity and needs to be shown incompetent and slapped down for that reason. (How would the character get that sort of insider information? The Yugoloths I guess! This is a story idea that came to me while I was typing this post.) Dispater probably doesn't need a crisis to slap the prison guard union, but if it makes it that much easier so the better, and if he even directly benefits from it (in the form of the character's gift), that's excellent. I use this as a humorous example of an angle that the character might tackle, but I believe it illustrates what I'm trying to get at: so long as the character makes sure that the stars align, they should be able to do it and get away with it. * In this case, the character would sever the hands of the angel prisoner to use as a component in the creation of an artifact, and use the rest of its body/soul for another ritual.