Summoning on the Outer Planes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Summoning on the Outer Planes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
twiggyleaf
05-07-07, 02:22 AM Does anyone have any idea about how Summoning Spells may be affected on the Outer Planes? It is my understanding that Summoning Spells usually use the astral plane as a method of transportation from original to desired plane. I can see this working in all cases on any Prime Material Plane or even the Inner Planes, but wondered if there might be restrictions between Outer Planes.

For example, how easy would it be for a good character on one of the planes of the abyss to summon a creature from Celestia using Monster Summoning 2?

It is not exactly clear to me whether there is an astral link between these planes, and even if there is, are there other reasons that prevent or subvert this ability.

I am thinking of making a House Rule on this not being allowed but would like to hear if there are any rules to suggest otherwise. I don't have Manual of the Planes, and wondered if there was anything in that Tome to advise me.

What do others think?
Rerecros
05-07-07, 02:31 AM there is no current rules on this, but you might want to make you PCs make a DC 20 caster level check, whenever they cast spells whose subdescriptor (good/evil/chaotic/lawful) opposes their current plane.
Naderion
05-07-07, 06:21 AM Strictly by the rules, you can use summon monster on every plane without any penalty.

But as rerecros said, you can easily make your own system to make the summoning of outsiders to outer planes different to their own a bit more difficult.
I use a system that reduces the effective caster level of the spells when cast on planes with a different alignment.
Current plane has a mildly alignment trait the spell doesn't share: -1
Current plane has a strong alignment trait the spell doesn't share: -2
Current plane has a mildly alignment trait opposed to the spell: -2
Current plane has a strong alignment trait opposed to the spell: -4

This leads to these modifications:
O\P LG NG CG LN CN LE NE CE
LG - - -2 - -4 -2 -4 -4
NG -1 - -1 -2 -2 -3 -4 -3
CG -2 - - -4 - -4 -4 -2
LN -1 -2 -3 - -4 -1 -2 -3
CN -3 -2 -1 -4 - -3 -2 -1
LE -2 -4 -4 - -4 - - -2
NE -3 -4 -3 -2 -2 -1 - -1
CE -4 -4 -2 -4 - -2 - -
If you are a 12th level wizard and try to summon a LN outsider (O) on a NE Plane (P), your caster level for this spell is reduced by -2 to 10 and it lasts for 10 rounds. Also you couldn't cast Summon Monster VI at all, because you need a minimum caster level of 11 to cast it.

You can use this system also for all spells with an alignment descriptor, but only using the adjustments for opposite alignment traits. A Holy Word just doesn't really work that well in Hades.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
twiggyleaf 05-07-07, 02:22 AM	Does anyone have any idea about how Summoning Spells may be affected on the Outer Planes? It is my understanding that Summoning Spells usually use the astral plane as a method of transportation from original to desired plane. I can see this working in all cases on any Prime Material Plane or even the Inner Planes, but wondered if there might be restrictions between Outer Planes. For example, how easy would it be for a good character on one of the planes of the abyss to summon a creature from Celestia using Monster Summoning 2? It is not exactly clear to me whether there is an astral link between these planes, and even if there is, are there other reasons that prevent or subvert this ability. I am thinking of making a House Rule on this not being allowed but would like to hear if there are any rules to suggest otherwise. I don't have Manual of the Planes, and wondered if there was anything in that Tome to advise me. What do others think?
Rerecros 05-07-07, 02:31 AM	there is no current rules on this, but you might want to make you PCs make a DC 20 caster level check, whenever they cast spells whose subdescriptor (good/evil/chaotic/lawful) opposes their current plane.
Naderion 05-07-07, 06:21 AM	Strictly by the rules, you can use summon monster on every plane without any penalty. But as rerecros said, you can easily make your own system to make the summoning of outsiders to outer planes different to their own a bit more difficult. I use a system that reduces the effective caster level of the spells when cast on planes with a different alignment. Current plane has a mildly alignment trait the spell doesn't share: -1 Current plane has a strong alignment trait the spell doesn't share: -2 Current plane has a mildly alignment trait opposed to the spell: -2 Current plane has a strong alignment trait opposed to the spell: -4 This leads to these modifications: O\P LG NG CG LN CN LE NE CE LG - - -2 - -4 -2 -4 -4 NG -1 - -1 -2 -2 -3 -4 -3 CG -2 - - -4 - -4 -4 -2 LN -1 -2 -3 - -4 -1 -2 -3 CN -3 -2 -1 -4 - -3 -2 -1 LE -2 -4 -4 - -4 - - -2 NE -3 -4 -3 -2 -2 -1 - -1 CE -4 -4 -2 -4 - -2 - - If you are a 12th level wizard and try to summon a LN outsider (O) on a NE Plane (P), your caster level for this spell is reduced by -2 to 10 and it lasts for 10 rounds. Also you couldn't cast Summon Monster VI at all, because you need a minimum caster level of 11 to cast it. You can use this system also for all spells with an alignment descriptor, but only using the adjustments for opposite alignment traits. A Holy Word just doesn't really work that well in Hades.