What are the Basic Rules for DnD Deities? [Archive] - Wizards Community

What are the Basic Rules for DnD Deities? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Windbit
03-12-07, 10:02 PM I know it's up to the DM to make a cosmology, but I was wondering what the standard rules for deities are. Here's a few of my questions, but feel free to give me any info you think would be helpful:

1)What is an Aspect?
2)Do deities gain their power from worship?
3)Can a region's beliefs affect their deity? For example, if a sect of Pelor's worshippers believed that he was also the moon god as well as the sun god, would Pelor be affected?
4)If a group were to start a new cult, would a new deity be created?
5)If a cult worshipped a creature (for example, a giant spider), would it gain supernatural powers?
Ordbyrht
03-12-07, 10:48 PM . . . I was wondering what the standard rules for deities are.
The standard rules for deities can be found at The Hypertext d20 SRD (v3.5 d20 System Reference Document (http://www.d20srd.org/). Other than that, I can answer a few of the questions.

1)What is an Aspect?
This answer comes straight from the Wizard's mouth. An aspect is "the embodiment of a small portion of an arch-fiend's or deity's life force." (Miniatures Handbook p. 46). While many might assume that an aspect is the same as an avatar, they would be wrong. Unlike an avatar (for more detail on avatars, please see Deities and Demigods, an aspect is not an extension of a deity, that is, a deity does not directly control an aspect.

2)Do deities gain their power from worship?
For the most part, deities require the belief of mortal worshippers to sustain themselves. Overdeities, such as Ao of Toril and the High God of Krynn, may not require worship. A sphere's population is generally ignorant of overdeities and they simply do not respond to prayer or grant clerical abilities.

The primal deities that were birthed before the creation of the Prime Material Plane or even before the formation of the Outer Planes may also not require worship.
Shemeska the Marauder
03-13-07, 01:36 AM 2)Do deities gain their power from worship?

Ultimately D&D gods are formed from and sustained by mortal worship. They're empowered by the faith of their believers, and they exist in many ways as a manifestation of that faith.

3)Can a region's beliefs affect their deity? For example, if a sect of Pelor's worshippers believed that he was also the moon god as well as the sun god, would Pelor be affected?

Yes, mortal faith can and does mold the powers, appearance, and portfolios of deities. If Pelor for instance was heavily worshipped as also a moon deity, then manifestation's of Pelor's power would likely be perceived by those people as appearing differently than by large groups of people who worshipped him only as a sun god. Deities can be worshipped as having multiple aspects (aspect in the general sense, not the mini-avatar sense), and ultimately if enough people believed in as such the deity itself would change to adapt.

4)If a group were to start a new cult, would a new deity be created?

At some point if their belief reached some unknown critical threshold yes, they would spark the appearance of a new deity, or an extant deity would adopt an aspect (in the general sense again) to fit their belief, gain from their worship, and grant their clerics spells in line with that.

5)If a cult worshipped a creature (for example, a giant spider), would it gain supernatural powers?

Again if there's enough worship to reach some nebulous critical threshold.
Windbit
03-13-07, 07:20 AM So, in the example that Pelor was also worshipped as a moon deity, would the new aspect of Pelor be seperate from the original? And if the majority of Pelor's followers did believe him to be a moon deity, would Pelor combine with that aspect?
RavenGraygem
03-13-07, 03:35 PM No. Because aspects are not the same as portfolios.
Windbit
03-13-07, 06:10 PM What exactly is a portfolio?
The_Cheeseman
03-14-07, 01:48 PM I do not mean to be rude, but as it seems you are quite interested in this subject (which you have good reason to be, because deities are quite interesting) you really should pick up a copy of Deities and Demigods for the full explanation. Also, bear in mind that much of the official stances on deities are very unclear, and much of the book is written in the form of suggestions or guidelines for GMs to use in creating their own pantheons.
Shemeska the Marauder
03-14-07, 02:20 PM 3e Deities & Demigods isn't worth your money. There are better books on the topic from prior editions.
Kain Darkwind
03-14-07, 02:24 PM 3e Deities & Demigods isn't worth your money. There are better books on the topic from prior editions.

To further that thought, the important mechanics can be found at www.d20srd.org. The only thing you are missing from the book would be the stats of the deities themselves....all of which could have been better done by integrating them with the epic rules.

Like Shem said, you aren't missing much by skipping the book. Flavorwise, there exist a ton of better sources, and rule wise, you can get them online for free.
RavenGraygem
03-14-07, 05:36 PM A portfolio is an area or aspect of existence that a deity has a particular interest in, such as truth, agriculture, athletics, tyranny, war, woods, and so on.

A deity's portfolio is usually an integral part of the deity itself, shaping it's outlook, alliances, hatreds, and goals. But portfolios can be poached by other deities, lost due to disinterest, gained through the belief of worshippers (i.e. Pelor as a moon god), and shared by more than one deity in the same pantheon at times (the nature of the deities determines whether there is cooperation, friendly competition, or outright loathing and constant warfare over a shared portfolio).
Naderion
03-14-07, 05:38 PM Usually, you don't need any mechanics for deities. They are gods. They can do about everything if they want to.
Witch
03-14-07, 05:43 PM Usually, you don't need any mechanics for deities. They are gods. They can do about everything if they want to.
No they can't. They're not "God" in a monotheistic sense.
Angelflesh
03-15-07, 12:28 AM No they can't. They're not "God" in a monotheistic sense.

He's right, they are usually limited to what is in their portfolio, but still have nearly limitless resources when it comes to minor things (killing mortals, creating objects, etc.).
Azar_of_Faerun
03-15-07, 02:36 AM I recommend picking up the Third Edition Deities and Demigods, and ignore the annoyingly persistent and holier(unholier?)-than-thou fogies living in the past :)
Witch
03-15-07, 07:46 AM I recommend picking up the Third Edition Deities and Demigods, and ignore the annoyingly persistent and holier(unholier?)-than-thou fogies living in the past :)
Or realize they give good advice. Deities built without Epic Level rules are silly.
Azar_of_Faerun
03-17-07, 04:29 AM Uh, if the Epic Level Rulebook came after/during Deities and Demigods, how could I be referring to you as an old fogie?

I was referring to the 2e mafia
The_Cheeseman
03-17-07, 05:39 PM Personally, I don't really like the epic rules all that much, and I doubt I would have added much of it to the deities, as written. All I may have used were some epic feats, I tend to prefer not to take epic class levels, since they add very little to a character, so I would have had class setups very similar to what was presented already. The basic crunch, like epic save and attack bonuses, were already implemented with Deities and Demigods, anyway.

However, Deities and Demigods includes much more than crunch, much of the fluff is quite useful for aspiring pantheon-builders, and I think they do a good job providing a springboard for creative thought in that regard.
Witch
03-17-07, 05:53 PM All I may have used were some epic feats
Which is a lot.

I tend to prefer not to take epic class levels, since they add very little to a character
They add epic feats.

And let's not forget epic spellcasting (or was that included? I lost my copy a few years ago).
Rerecros
03-17-07, 10:03 PM If he's playing by eberron rules there are no Aspects, or even any direct proof of the existence of gods.
crimsonwolf
03-18-07, 11:40 AM trust me if his asking about gods he wouldnt be wasting time in a godless area of play.... hmm.. Whos the Over Denity for Far Realm?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Windbit 03-12-07, 10:02 PM	I know it's up to the DM to make a cosmology, but I was wondering what the standard rules for deities are. Here's a few of my questions, but feel free to give me any info you think would be helpful: 1)What is an Aspect? 2)Do deities gain their power from worship? 3)Can a region's beliefs affect their deity? For example, if a sect of Pelor's worshippers believed that he was also the moon god as well as the sun god, would Pelor be affected? 4)If a group were to start a new cult, would a new deity be created? 5)If a cult worshipped a creature (for example, a giant spider), would it gain supernatural powers?
Ordbyrht 03-12-07, 10:48 PM	. . . I was wondering what the standard rules for deities are. The standard rules for deities can be found at The Hypertext d20 SRD (v3.5 d20 System Reference Document (http://www.d20srd.org/). Other than that, I can answer a few of the questions. 1)What is an Aspect? This answer comes straight from the Wizard's mouth. An aspect is "the embodiment of a small portion of an arch-fiend's or deity's life force." (Miniatures Handbook p. 46). While many might assume that an aspect is the same as an avatar, they would be wrong. Unlike an avatar (for more detail on avatars, please see Deities and Demigods, an aspect is not an extension of a deity, that is, a deity does not directly control an aspect. 2)Do deities gain their power from worship? For the most part, deities require the belief of mortal worshippers to sustain themselves. Overdeities, such as Ao of Toril and the High God of Krynn, may not require worship. A sphere's population is generally ignorant of overdeities and they simply do not respond to prayer or grant clerical abilities. The primal deities that were birthed before the creation of the Prime Material Plane or even before the formation of the Outer Planes may also not require worship.
Shemeska the Marauder 03-13-07, 01:36 AM	2)Do deities gain their power from worship? Ultimately D&D gods are formed from and sustained by mortal worship. They're empowered by the faith of their believers, and they exist in many ways as a manifestation of that faith. 3)Can a region's beliefs affect their deity? For example, if a sect of Pelor's worshippers believed that he was also the moon god as well as the sun god, would Pelor be affected? Yes, mortal faith can and does mold the powers, appearance, and portfolios of deities. If Pelor for instance was heavily worshipped as also a moon deity, then manifestation's of Pelor's power would likely be perceived by those people as appearing differently than by large groups of people who worshipped him only as a sun god. Deities can be worshipped as having multiple aspects (aspect in the general sense, not the mini-avatar sense), and ultimately if enough people believed in as such the deity itself would change to adapt. 4)If a group were to start a new cult, would a new deity be created? At some point if their belief reached some unknown critical threshold yes, they would spark the appearance of a new deity, or an extant deity would adopt an aspect (in the general sense again) to fit their belief, gain from their worship, and grant their clerics spells in line with that. 5)If a cult worshipped a creature (for example, a giant spider), would it gain supernatural powers? Again if there's enough worship to reach some nebulous critical threshold.
Windbit 03-13-07, 07:20 AM	So, in the example that Pelor was also worshipped as a moon deity, would the new aspect of Pelor be seperate from the original? And if the majority of Pelor's followers did believe him to be a moon deity, would Pelor combine with that aspect?
RavenGraygem 03-13-07, 03:35 PM	No. Because aspects are not the same as portfolios.
Windbit 03-13-07, 06:10 PM	What exactly is a portfolio?
The_Cheeseman 03-14-07, 01:48 PM	I do not mean to be rude, but as it seems you are quite interested in this subject (which you have good reason to be, because deities are quite interesting) you really should pick up a copy of Deities and Demigods for the full explanation. Also, bear in mind that much of the official stances on deities are very unclear, and much of the book is written in the form of suggestions or guidelines for GMs to use in creating their own pantheons.
Shemeska the Marauder 03-14-07, 02:20 PM	3e Deities & Demigods isn't worth your money. There are better books on the topic from prior editions.
Kain Darkwind 03-14-07, 02:24 PM	3e Deities & Demigods isn't worth your money. There are better books on the topic from prior editions. To further that thought, the important mechanics can be found at www.d20srd.org. The only thing you are missing from the book would be the stats of the deities themselves....all of which could have been better done by integrating them with the epic rules. Like Shem said, you aren't missing much by skipping the book. Flavorwise, there exist a ton of better sources, and rule wise, you can get them online for free.
RavenGraygem 03-14-07, 05:36 PM	A portfolio is an area or aspect of existence that a deity has a particular interest in, such as truth, agriculture, athletics, tyranny, war, woods, and so on. A deity's portfolio is usually an integral part of the deity itself, shaping it's outlook, alliances, hatreds, and goals. But portfolios can be poached by other deities, lost due to disinterest, gained through the belief of worshippers (i.e. Pelor as a moon god), and shared by more than one deity in the same pantheon at times (the nature of the deities determines whether there is cooperation, friendly competition, or outright loathing and constant warfare over a shared portfolio).
Naderion 03-14-07, 05:38 PM	Usually, you don't need any mechanics for deities. They are gods. They can do about everything if they want to.
Witch 03-14-07, 05:43 PM	Usually, you don't need any mechanics for deities. They are gods. They can do about everything if they want to. No they can't. They're not "God" in a monotheistic sense.
Angelflesh 03-15-07, 12:28 AM	No they can't. They're not "God" in a monotheistic sense. He's right, they are usually limited to what is in their portfolio, but still have nearly limitless resources when it comes to minor things (killing mortals, creating objects, etc.).
Azar_of_Faerun 03-15-07, 02:36 AM	I recommend picking up the Third Edition Deities and Demigods, and ignore the annoyingly persistent and holier(unholier?)-than-thou fogies living in the past :)
Witch 03-15-07, 07:46 AM	I recommend picking up the Third Edition Deities and Demigods, and ignore the annoyingly persistent and holier(unholier?)-than-thou fogies living in the past :) Or realize they give good advice. Deities built without Epic Level rules are silly.
Azar_of_Faerun 03-17-07, 04:29 AM	Uh, if the Epic Level Rulebook came after/during Deities and Demigods, how could I be referring to you as an old fogie? I was referring to the 2e mafia
The_Cheeseman 03-17-07, 05:39 PM	Personally, I don't really like the epic rules all that much, and I doubt I would have added much of it to the deities, as written. All I may have used were some epic feats, I tend to prefer not to take epic class levels, since they add very little to a character, so I would have had class setups very similar to what was presented already. The basic crunch, like epic save and attack bonuses, were already implemented with Deities and Demigods, anyway. However, Deities and Demigods includes much more than crunch, much of the fluff is quite useful for aspiring pantheon-builders, and I think they do a good job providing a springboard for creative thought in that regard.
Witch 03-17-07, 05:53 PM	All I may have used were some epic feats Which is a lot. I tend to prefer not to take epic class levels, since they add very little to a character They add epic feats. And let's not forget epic spellcasting (or was that included? I lost my copy a few years ago).
Rerecros 03-17-07, 10:03 PM	If he's playing by eberron rules there are no Aspects, or even any direct proof of the existence of gods.
crimsonwolf 03-18-07, 11:40 AM	trust me if his asking about gods he wouldnt be wasting time in a godless area of play.... hmm.. Whos the Over Denity for Far Realm?