Balance DC of a sloped slippery floor? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Balance DC of a sloped slippery floor? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Rebel581
06-18-07, 12:25 AM I want to make a trap that just seems like stairs and then when the PCs start to charge up them to attack the wizard, he activates a button so that the floor gives out and they start sliding downwards. How do I do that and what would the Balance DC be to avoid falling down? Would it be a Reflex check?

And can you charge up stairs that are more than a 45 degree angle upwards?
Kouk
06-18-07, 01:35 AM To find the difficulty of the balance check, use the charts for the Balance skill and add up all the relevant modifiers to get the DC.

You can't charge up 45 degree stairs normally, because these stairs are like "difficult terrain".

From DMG (SRD)
Miscellaneous Features
Stairs

The usual way to connect different levels of a dungeon is with stairs. Straight stairways, spiral staircases, or stairwells with multiple landings between flights of stairs are all common in dungeons, as are ramps (sometimes with an incline so slight that it can be difficult to notice; Spot DC 15). Stairs are important accessways, and are sometimes guarded or trapped. Traps on stairs often cause intruders to slide or fall down to the bottom, where a pit, spikes, a pool of acid, or some other danger awaits.

Gradual Stairs
Stairs that rise less than 5 feet for every 5 feet of horizontal distance they cover don’t affect movement, but characters who attack a foe below them gain a +1 bonus on attack rolls from being on higher ground. Most stairs in dungeons are gradual, except for spiral stairs (see below).

Steep Stairs
Characters moving up steep stairs (which rise at a 45-degree angle or steeper) must spend 2 squares of movement to enter each square of stairs. Characters running or charging down steep stairs must succeed on a DC 10 Balance check upon entering the first steep stairs square. Characters who fail stumble and must end their movement 1d2×5 feet later. Characters who fail by 5 or more take 1d6 points of damage and fall prone in the square where they end their movement. Steep stairs increase the DC of Tumble checks by 5.

Spiral Stairs
This form of steep stairs is designed to make defending a fortress easier. Characters gain cover against foes below them on spiral stairs because they can easily duck around the staircase’s central support.

Railings and Low Walls
Stairs that are open to large rooms often have railings or low walls. They function as described for ledges.

Note you can charge down the stairs, just not up them.
Inigo Carmine
06-18-07, 12:03 PM On a side note, to simplify matters, you could remove the whole "activation" aspect of it.

You could just have it so that the foundation of the stairway is just a ramp (at 45 degrees or whatever you want).

The steps could either be illusions, or even easier, a substance that is shaped to look like steps. It's strong enough to maintain a crafted shape under its own weight, but not enough to support the weight of someone trying to climb up them like stairs.

Something solid (like hollow hardened clay) is easy enough...if you want something slippery, I can't think of a substance offhand, but you can always handwave that as an abstract alchemical substance.

The skill description of balance doesn't give a good set DC for a steep incline (I think the inclines it implies are less than 45 degrees), but that the DC for a slope is just for running/charging and not to actually lose balance and be unable to move. What is clear is that something very slick is a +5 DC.

I think for an angle steeper than 45 degrees, you're looking for a very high base balance DC, something around 20ish (+5 for being slippery). What I would also suggest is a lower climb DC (about 12 before the +5 for being slick). Climbing is much easier than balancing on such a slope, but you're lookign at a much slower rate of movement, and also the denial of dex bonus to AC.

EDIT: rethinking it, a slick sharply inclined surface should definitely have the possibility of falling, so take with a grain of salt what I mentioned about the rules for a sloped surface. I would further correct this, but I've got to go.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rebel581 06-18-07, 12:25 AM	I want to make a trap that just seems like stairs and then when the PCs start to charge up them to attack the wizard, he activates a button so that the floor gives out and they start sliding downwards. How do I do that and what would the Balance DC be to avoid falling down? Would it be a Reflex check? And can you charge up stairs that are more than a 45 degree angle upwards?
Kouk 06-18-07, 01:35 AM	To find the difficulty of the balance check, use the charts for the Balance skill and add up all the relevant modifiers to get the DC. You can't charge up 45 degree stairs normally, because these stairs are like "difficult terrain". From DMG (SRD) Miscellaneous Features Stairs The usual way to connect different levels of a dungeon is with stairs. Straight stairways, spiral staircases, or stairwells with multiple landings between flights of stairs are all common in dungeons, as are ramps (sometimes with an incline so slight that it can be difficult to notice; Spot DC 15). Stairs are important accessways, and are sometimes guarded or trapped. Traps on stairs often cause intruders to slide or fall down to the bottom, where a pit, spikes, a pool of acid, or some other danger awaits. Gradual Stairs Stairs that rise less than 5 feet for every 5 feet of horizontal distance they cover don’t affect movement, but characters who attack a foe below them gain a +1 bonus on attack rolls from being on higher ground. Most stairs in dungeons are gradual, except for spiral stairs (see below). Steep Stairs Characters moving up steep stairs (which rise at a 45-degree angle or steeper) must spend 2 squares of movement to enter each square of stairs. Characters running or charging down steep stairs must succeed on a DC 10 Balance check upon entering the first steep stairs square. Characters who fail stumble and must end their movement 1d2×5 feet later. Characters who fail by 5 or more take 1d6 points of damage and fall prone in the square where they end their movement. Steep stairs increase the DC of Tumble checks by 5. Spiral Stairs This form of steep stairs is designed to make defending a fortress easier. Characters gain cover against foes below them on spiral stairs because they can easily duck around the staircase’s central support. Railings and Low Walls Stairs that are open to large rooms often have railings or low walls. They function as described for ledges. Note you can charge down the stairs, just not up them.
Inigo Carmine 06-18-07, 12:03 PM	On a side note, to simplify matters, you could remove the whole "activation" aspect of it. You could just have it so that the foundation of the stairway is just a ramp (at 45 degrees or whatever you want). The steps could either be illusions, or even easier, a substance that is shaped to look like steps. It's strong enough to maintain a crafted shape under its own weight, but not enough to support the weight of someone trying to climb up them like stairs. Something solid (like hollow hardened clay) is easy enough...if you want something slippery, I can't think of a substance offhand, but you can always handwave that as an abstract alchemical substance. The skill description of balance doesn't give a good set DC for a steep incline (I think the inclines it implies are less than 45 degrees), but that the DC for a slope is just for running/charging and not to actually lose balance and be unable to move. What is clear is that something very slick is a +5 DC. I think for an angle steeper than 45 degrees, you're looking for a very high base balance DC, something around 20ish (+5 for being slippery). What I would also suggest is a lower climb DC (about 12 before the +5 for being slick). Climbing is much easier than balancing on such a slope, but you're lookign at a much slower rate of movement, and also the denial of dex bonus to AC. EDIT: rethinking it, a slick sharply inclined surface should definitely have the possibility of falling, so take with a grain of salt what I mentioned about the rules for a sloped surface. I would further correct this, but I've got to go.