Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Wopple 04-24-07, 05:18 PM	Okay... so black flame zealots are divine based. They also use wisdom for all their checks and such. but, for death attack, it says "As listed under the assassin description"... and here is the problem. Is the + to the death attack DC from int or wis? To me it would make more sense for it to be WIS, why would an entirely divine class randomly need int for one of it's abilities? What did everyone else interprit from this/what do you all use for this situation?
tos_shai_hulud 04-24-07, 06:19 PM	I think it is based on Intelligence. Having a class feature based on a non-primary stat makes it a lesser class ability. There is nothing wrong with that. Not every class ability should be maximized for power.
Wopple 04-24-07, 11:24 PM	They shouldn't? ;)
runestar 04-25-07, 12:15 AM	The assumption is that the black flame zealot was an optimized prc to begin it. Nothing could be further from the truth. It is quite a weak prc mechanically.:(
Someone 04-25-07, 12:36 AM	The assumption is that the black flame zealot was an optimized prc to begin it.That's because all of its good stuff is on page XX. :D
Wopple 04-26-07, 03:11 PM	Qua? It seems okay... but I'll admit I think it would be better balanced with a +1 spell level every level. But both balance and roleplaying sense should make it at wisdom. They aren't sneaky and deathey because they are smart and skill oriented, it's their lack of fear and zealotry, which to me seems all about will.
tos_shai_hulud 04-26-07, 03:24 PM	True, which is why they have the feature, but it is intelligence which determines how well they know where to put the blade. Their zealotry makes them cold and calculating (unlike an assassin's intelligence), but it is still their intellect which rules where to stick the blade for maximum effect.
claypigeons 04-26-07, 07:20 PM	True, which is why they have the feature, but it is intelligence which determines how well they know where to put the blade. Their zealotry makes them cold and calculating (unlike an assassin's intelligence), but it is still their intellect which rules where to stick the blade for maximum effect. Eh... Not really. A rogue can sneak attack with 3 int... hardly the top of intelligence, AND sneak attack is, for all intents and purposes, stabbing/hitting someone in something vital.
evilviper77 04-26-07, 10:30 PM	Um, Wopple don't even worry arguing real life tangents to DnD game rules. The stats that count are there for balance more than anything else. There isn't any point trying to reason why something depends on this exact ability. If you feel it wouldn't be overpowered to use Wis then allow it. If you want to adhere to the rules exactly then i'd say stick it with Int because it does say "As listed under ___". In the end it's up to you.(I'm assuming you're a DM since this is DM rule counseling. If you're a player then just talk to your DM and abide by his wishes.. Cause by the book it should be int.)
Wopple 04-28-07, 02:08 PM	True, true. The main point this ties into, too, is a VERY annoying habit Wizards has of not even thinking of these things. Sometimes it is for balance, but alot of the time it's just that thet pump out 2-4 books EVERY MONTH and can't be bothered to have any of it actualy thought out or even touched in the errata, half the time. They also make "patches" in theire errata, which is basically saying ha! I did NOT think of that! over and over again.. *sigh*