Detect _____ Spells Configuration [Archive] - Wizards Community

Detect _____ Spells Configuration [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Jeibo
04-17-08, 10:05 PM I've been recently thinking of an substitute of Detect Magic/Evil/Good/Law etc. Spells.

I realy dont like the concept of the standard mood-killing talk:

Player: I cast Detect Magic
DM: Yes, there are 2 auras coming to you.

I would much more prefer it like this:

DM: (rolling a d20 for the player) You can feel the presence of Magic around you

or

DM: (same) A strong aura of malice overwhelms you from the Blackguards presence.

So, i've come up with the following way to do this:

I am going to substitute these spells with skills, call them Sense Magic etc.
Who's going to have which as class skills is pretty clear (a Paladin will definately have Sense Evil, a Cleric will have all of them etc.)

A synergy bonus is probably going to be given to the PCs by probably Spellcraft.

What i am not so sure about, is what ability modifier should be added for the final bonus to occur. Should it be each spellcasters' primary ability? or maybe wisdom for all of them?
rodolfomaxi
04-17-08, 10:47 PM Nice, Nice, Nice idea OP.

IMO it should be Wis for all of them.

It makes sense as how they perceive the ambient that surrounds them by this attribute. (listen, spot, sense motive etc.)

I'm rather curious tough...

How would you handle such check?

Example: Fill the dialogue above.

DM: The black dressed wizard invites you all for a tea.
Player: I want to sense evil on him.
DM: Well, looking to his eyes you perceive ... roll the check.
Player: Duh! A natural 1.
DM:

And then what would be the check if the player had rolled a 20?
And the check when the wizard is true neutral that pretends to sell the PCs for the bounty on their heads?
Jeibo
04-18-08, 08:44 AM Well i won't have a problem with that :)

With the specific group i've been playing for years now, the Playerss don't see the dice they roll (they throw them in a half-closed box and only the DM can see them) Then the DM gives a description depending on the roll. They don't even know their Hit Points, (the DM gives a description of the dmg dealt proportionally to the hit points)
e.g. One takes a blow dealing 30 dmg, to someone with 50 hp
Description: Swings his axe at you, chopping off your leg, your on the floor :D

But, apart from that i am planning to be making the Sense X checks for them.

Yeah, i thought it should be wisdom too, but one of my players came up with a good argument:

"If as a sorcerer i am using my charisma to manipulate the weave and make use of arcana, why should i be using wisdom to sense its presence around me?"

So that messed things up a bit :P
Radijs
04-18-08, 09:18 AM It sounds like a nice concept. But I'd be rather peeved that I'd have to invest in 2 more skills just so I can use a couple of cantrips.

Detect magic already has a roll assigned to it. Spellcraft in order to recognize the school of the auras or in case of active spells, the actual spell in use.
Anyr
04-18-08, 08:28 PM The idea is certainly flavourful. I like the idea that things like magical auras and alignments can be found in the same way that a skilled observer can tell how someone is feeling or whether enemies have walked across nearby ground. One problem is that most spellcasters who would use these the most have very few skill points to devote to them. Wizards at least tend to have high intelligence, but Clerics, Sorcerers and suchlike may only have 2 or 3 points per level. After buying up skills like Concentration, Knowledge and Spellcraft they'd probably be rather hardpressed to find enough points to invest in these new detection abilities. It might be more convenient to make them applications of existing skills (such as Spellcraft) than to make an entirely unique skill for each one.
Jeibo
04-18-08, 09:43 PM Yeah, that is true, and maybe the biggest problem i got so far.

I was thinking of two alternatives:

1. Maybe ranks for this skills only should be earned each time they level up, something like hit points or something. Make them roll 1d4-1 (min 1) every time they level up and add that to one of these skills or something.

2. Perhaps for every 3 ranks you have in spellcraft you gain 1 extra rank in these skills. Maybe with the equivalent knowledge skill too.
Radijs
04-19-08, 03:29 AM You could also use an existing skill, like spellcraft to use with these spells or a caster level check.

What kind of DC would it be though? And what would one learn at the various stages?
Jeibo
04-19-08, 09:41 AM Same things as Detect spells:

First round, (as a standard action) you find out presense of auras etc.

As for the DCs... i have no idea what they should be :P
Radijs
04-19-08, 02:33 PM Would it really be so much of an addition in that case? The diffrent detect spells don't tell you /that/ much.
And the only one that can tell you any detail is detect magic which already requires a spellcraft check.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jeibo 04-17-08, 10:05 PM	I've been recently thinking of an substitute of Detect Magic/Evil/Good/Law etc. Spells. I realy dont like the concept of the standard mood-killing talk: Player: I cast Detect Magic DM: Yes, there are 2 auras coming to you. I would much more prefer it like this: DM: (rolling a d20 for the player) You can feel the presence of Magic around you or DM: (same) A strong aura of malice overwhelms you from the Blackguards presence. So, i've come up with the following way to do this: I am going to substitute these spells with skills, call them Sense Magic etc. Who's going to have which as class skills is pretty clear (a Paladin will definately have Sense Evil, a Cleric will have all of them etc.) A synergy bonus is probably going to be given to the PCs by probably Spellcraft. What i am not so sure about, is what ability modifier should be added for the final bonus to occur. Should it be each spellcasters' primary ability? or maybe wisdom for all of them?
rodolfomaxi 04-17-08, 10:47 PM	Nice, Nice, Nice idea OP. IMO it should be Wis for all of them. It makes sense as how they perceive the ambient that surrounds them by this attribute. (listen, spot, sense motive etc.) I'm rather curious tough... How would you handle such check? Example: Fill the dialogue above. DM: The black dressed wizard invites you all for a tea. Player: I want to sense evil on him. DM: Well, looking to his eyes you perceive ... roll the check. Player: Duh! A natural 1. DM: And then what would be the check if the player had rolled a 20? And the check when the wizard is true neutral that pretends to sell the PCs for the bounty on their heads?
Jeibo 04-18-08, 08:44 AM	Well i won't have a problem with that :) With the specific group i've been playing for years now, the Playerss don't see the dice they roll (they throw them in a half-closed box and only the DM can see them) Then the DM gives a description depending on the roll. They don't even know their Hit Points, (the DM gives a description of the dmg dealt proportionally to the hit points) e.g. One takes a blow dealing 30 dmg, to someone with 50 hp Description: Swings his axe at you, chopping off your leg, your on the floor :D But, apart from that i am planning to be making the Sense X checks for them. Yeah, i thought it should be wisdom too, but one of my players came up with a good argument: "If as a sorcerer i am using my charisma to manipulate the weave and make use of arcana, why should i be using wisdom to sense its presence around me?" So that messed things up a bit :P
Radijs 04-18-08, 09:18 AM	It sounds like a nice concept. But I'd be rather peeved that I'd have to invest in 2 more skills just so I can use a couple of cantrips. Detect magic already has a roll assigned to it. Spellcraft in order to recognize the school of the auras or in case of active spells, the actual spell in use.
Anyr 04-18-08, 08:28 PM	The idea is certainly flavourful. I like the idea that things like magical auras and alignments can be found in the same way that a skilled observer can tell how someone is feeling or whether enemies have walked across nearby ground. One problem is that most spellcasters who would use these the most have very few skill points to devote to them. Wizards at least tend to have high intelligence, but Clerics, Sorcerers and suchlike may only have 2 or 3 points per level. After buying up skills like Concentration, Knowledge and Spellcraft they'd probably be rather hardpressed to find enough points to invest in these new detection abilities. It might be more convenient to make them applications of existing skills (such as Spellcraft) than to make an entirely unique skill for each one.
Jeibo 04-18-08, 09:43 PM	Yeah, that is true, and maybe the biggest problem i got so far. I was thinking of two alternatives: 1. Maybe ranks for this skills only should be earned each time they level up, something like hit points or something. Make them roll 1d4-1 (min 1) every time they level up and add that to one of these skills or something. 2. Perhaps for every 3 ranks you have in spellcraft you gain 1 extra rank in these skills. Maybe with the equivalent knowledge skill too.
Radijs 04-19-08, 03:29 AM	You could also use an existing skill, like spellcraft to use with these spells or a caster level check. What kind of DC would it be though? And what would one learn at the various stages?
Jeibo 04-19-08, 09:41 AM	Same things as Detect spells: First round, (as a standard action) you find out presense of auras etc. As for the DCs... i have no idea what they should be :P
Radijs 04-19-08, 02:33 PM	Would it really be so much of an addition in that case? The diffrent detect spells don't tell you /that/ much. And the only one that can tell you any detail is detect magic which already requires a spellcraft check.