Post/Author/DateTime	Post
mod5000 01-30-08, 06:53 PM	Do Crusaders from Tome of Battle use positive energy for their healing strikes and stances like Crusader's Strike, Martial Spirit, and Revitalizing Strike? Do these strikes heal undead normally, damage them, or do nothing? How do they effect warforged? And the flavor makes them look like they're "morale" effects... So undead wouldn't be healed by them anyway, right?
navar100 01-30-08, 08:40 PM	Good question. It never says positive energy, morale effect, or any descriptor, just heals. I would have to say yes, a crusader could heal an allied undead. Even a construct for that matter.
Crimson_Concerto 01-30-08, 08:42 PM	The healing has no type, so it's effective on any ally.
Necroramo 01-30-08, 09:47 PM	Yeah, except for the level 9 version that replicates the heal spell
navar100 01-31-08, 01:33 AM	Yeah, except for the level 9 version that replicates the heal spell I think that's semantics. One could interpret it to mean the actual Heal spell, but I also think it could mean it duplicates the effects but is not in fact the heal spell. After all, since it is not a supernatural ability a crusader can use it in an anti-magic area, and it will work.
JHelmer 01-31-08, 02:42 AM	So you're telling me that 'heartened by feats of bravery', the damaged Warforges parts /jump up and screw themselves back on/? :eek: You're telling me that the mindless undead cohort of the evil blackguard crusader takes comfort in knowing that the blackguard/crusader can occaisionally whack the good-guy over and over again, and so that earlier claymore hit is just a bit less damaging than it was before? Why did the Last War ever end if they could just pump the info for a few Crusaders into the Warforged Lineup and make the Artificers job a whole heck of a lot easier? Can anyone at least point out another source of healing in DnD (short of the monk's self-heal) that does NOT use positive energy?
mod5000 01-31-08, 03:04 AM	The psionic power Body Adjustment can do that. Or "take the pain" of others with Empathic Transfer. Perhaps it could be explained in that a crusader "takes the pain" of an ally and transfers it to a foe, albeit indirectly and less efficiently than a psion does?
navar100 01-31-08, 04:29 AM	Tome of Battle is that good. :D
mod5000 01-31-08, 04:32 AM	I think that's semantics. One could interpret it to mean the actual Heal spell, but I also think it could mean it duplicates the effects but is not in fact the heal spell. After all, since it is not a supernatural ability a crusader can use it in an anti-magic area, and it will work. I could actually see that, since it says that the target gets the benefit of a heal spell--not that it's cast on the target.
runestar 01-31-08, 06:33 AM	Can anyone at least point out another source of healing in DnD (short of the monk's self-heal) that does NOT use positive energy? The healing from the devoted defender discipline is not necessarily the same sort of healing as the cure wound line of spells. Hp is a rather abstract term in dnd after all. I don't think this is a problem. Mechanics-wise, it does not appear game breaking. Only problem is trying to rationalize it.
mvincent 01-31-08, 03:32 PM	So you're telling me that 'heartened by feats of bravery', the damaged Warforges parts /jump up and screw themselves back on/? :eek: You're telling me that the mindless undead cohort of the evil blackguard crusader takes comfort in knowing that the blackguard/crusader can occaisionally whack the good-guy over and over again, and so that earlier claymore hit is just a bit less damaging than it was before?Side note: that appears to be the premise in 4e.
Crimson_Concerto 01-31-08, 11:17 PM	Can anyone at least point out another source of healing in DnD (short of the monk's self-heal) that does NOT use positive energy?Crusader strikes don't use positive energy either. Otherwise they would be supernatural in nature instead of extraordinary. Rather, these specific crusader strikes take advantage of the fact that HP is an abstraction. The strikes don't actually close any wounds or repair any damage. It's more like they inspire endurance and confidence in allies, encouraging them to try harder to shrug-off their pain. That being said, I really believe they should have put in some stipulation that creatures immune to morale bonuses should be immune to this healing as well...
Andrew 02-01-08, 01:45 AM	So you're telling me that 'heartened by feats of bravery', the damaged Warforges parts /jump up and screw themselves back on/?Kind of like you're telling me that because you're beating the pants out of someone my shattered bones will knit together faster. No, it doesn't make sense.
Voran 02-01-08, 07:02 PM	At extreme levels this can seem a little off, but HP stuff is off to begin with. Part of it is "heal broken bones" part of it is "Gee I guess I wasn't as hurt as I thought".
Andrew 02-02-08, 03:26 AM	I think I failed to actually post the relevant conclusion above: if hit points are an abstraction of the ability to continue functioning instead of representing physical damage for flesh-and-blood characters, they are the same abstraction for constructs and undead.