Jumping during a charge attack? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Jumping during a charge attack? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
tos_shai_hulud
11-20-07, 11:58 AM According to charge, if impediments exist, a character cannot charge, but what about making a jump check to avoid impediments? For instance, five goblins riding worgs are attempting to charge the spellcaster, but a party member is in the way. Can they jump over the party member to get to the spellcaster as part of their Ride-by Attack? If they clear 5', are they considered successful (although they provoke an attack of opportunity)? Or would it be the character's height as the DC to avoid him as an impediment (taller creatures require higher Jump DCs). I believe the character in the way is 6½ feet, so would that be a DC 26 jump check? Or would jumping be considered a change in direction, thus disallowed as part of the charge?
Marcus Majarra
11-20-07, 12:40 PM Your tactic is only possible through the use of the Leap Attack feat (Complete Adventurer). The thing is, normally, when you're jumping, you're not moving in a straight line. Rather, you're moving in a quadratic curve.
Zinger2099
11-20-07, 12:52 PM Beat me to it. I was just about to say that Marcus. :P
tos_shai_hulud
11-20-07, 12:54 PM Ok, what about a prone character? Are they considered "in the way" for a charge? What about an incorporeal creature?
Zinger2099
11-20-07, 01:09 PM Ok, what about a prone character? Are they considered "in the way" for a charge? What about an incorporeal creature?

The rules for entering a prone character's square isn't any different from entering a non-prone character's square. Now, if the character was also helpless (i.e. unconcious as well, and not just lying prone) then you can move into his/her square freely, but you still couldn't charge through it. A body in a square, to my knowledge, is considered rough terrain. But even if it isn't, it's still an obstruction, and you can't charge through any kind of obstructions.

As for an incorporeal creature, if the creature is an enemy, then no. You can't enter an enemies square (unless you tumble, and you can't tumble on a charge) be it incorporeal or not. If the incorporeal creature is an ally, then, I really don't know. Maybe? It'd be a DM call.

That's my best take on the issue.
tos_shai_hulud
11-20-07, 01:26 PM Ok, thanks.
Andrew
11-20-07, 02:05 PM I had held an opinion like the above posters (that it wasn't possible without Leap Attack), but I think I recently saw a block of text addressing this in the Rules Compendium. I'm away from my books, though, so can't check the specifics.
tos_shai_hulud
11-20-07, 05:48 PM Ok, here is a slightly different approach. These are goblin worg-riders. They all have high ride skill (+14). Leap
You can get your mount to leap obstacles as part of its movement. Use your Ride modifier or the mount’s Jump modifier, whichever is lower, to see how far the creature can jump. If you fail your Ride check, you fall off the mount when it leaps and take the appropriate falling damage (at least 1d6 points). This usage does not take an action, but is part of the mount’s movement.

Would this usage of the Ride skill allow a charge over obstacles? Like people in the way, should the result be high enough (I doubt it will be, since the mount will not be making running leaps, but only charging). Since these worgs were trained, they have higher than normal jump checks, so I would use the rider's ride check to see how far/high they could jump, and with a DC 48 to clear a 6' tall character, he is not going to make it.

But, do the rules support this usage for a mounted player making leaps to continue a charge attack?
Zinger2099
11-20-07, 06:31 PM I would assume no. Leap is done as part of a movement. Charge is a special attack that is a full-round action. I am fairly certain Leap is intended to be used as part of a move action only, but I could be wrong.

That being said, the whole point of a charge is that you are running as fast as possible at your target. You move double your speed and attack in the turn. That's essentially 3 actions right there. The restrictions apply because of this fact. Essentially a charge is a combination of an attack and the run action. The reason you are able to move double your speed and attack is because you are fully exerting yourself towards running at a target, and anything that would slow you down even just a little would interfear with that charge, such as jumping over obstacles, moving around corners, and the like.

There are feats that let you have more versatility within a charge, such as leaping, ignoring obstacles, turning, ect. But under normal circumstances these actions are not possible.

But then, we're starting to get away from RAW and into Intent of RAW. To be honest, I don't know if the Leap special ability would allow a creature to jump over obstacles as part of a charge. But I would assume no, simply because of the very nature of a charge.
Bopple
11-20-07, 09:15 PM You cannot change the direction while charging.
If you have to jump vertically(5' or higher), then you cannot charge.
If you don't have to jump vertically(like jumping over a chasm narrower than 15' because you automatically go up a quarter of the long jump distance), then you can.
tos_shai_hulud
11-20-07, 09:16 PM Leap describes use during a mount's movement not move action. This would indicate that any time that it is in motion, it can leap. This does not indicate that it can charge with obstacles in the way, fully intent on leaping over them. It may be that because the obstacles are there, it cannot charge, even though it possesses the ability to leap over them, just by nature of the definition of Charge.

Of course, I can easily see a cavalry charger bringing his mount into a full run with a line of people in his way, plowing through them to strike down an archer. This seems to indicate that mounted combat should be treated differently, and perhaps additional liberties taken with charging should a mounted rider attempt a charge attack. Of course, this again becomes a question of the RAI as opposed to RAW, since the RAW is not explicit on this matter.
tos_shai_hulud
11-20-07, 09:37 PM Ok, then what happens with a thri-kreen with maximum ranks in jump? He begins with a +30, let us assume that he has 21 ranks (the ranks of a thri-kreen with 16 levels in monk, making him ECL 20, since he also has two racial HD), 5 ranks of tumble (for synergy). Let's give him a ring of jumping (+10) and a strength score of 24 (began with an 18, +2 racial, +4 from level increase). We give him the following feats: Run, Skill Focus: Jump, Acrobatic, Leap of the Heavens (from PHB II).

With 90' move speed, he has a +24, +10 from ring, +7 from Strength, +21 from ranks, +30 from race, +4 from Run feat (if running), +5 from Leap of the Heavens (if running), +2 synergy from Tumble, +3 from Skill focus, +2 from Acrobatic, so that when he makes a running jump, he has a +99 (+9 if running) to his jump check. This means that for a long jump, the character can jump no less than 100 feet on a roll of one. That translates to 25 feet of vertical distance for a vertical jump. At some point, the character's vertical distance will clear 5' from a horizontal jump. Is this simply ignored? Do you simply treat the long jump as though there is no vertical movement?
Bopple
11-20-07, 10:16 PM Hmm? I said it's limited - obstacle shorter than 15'(or jump distance less than 20').
tos_shai_hulud
11-21-07, 02:07 AM Hmm? I said it's limited - obstacle shorter than 15'(or jump distance less than 20').

I was informed by a friend with the Rules Compendium (which I do not possess) that long jumps in general are permissible during a charge. Is that limitation listed somewhere in those rules, or is that your own interpretation?

Additionally, if someone is making a long jump, do you determine how high they jump? If someone is making a vertical jump, do you determine the distance they travel? Or is the other axis simply ignored?
Bopple
11-21-07, 02:19 AM Long Jump: A long jump is a horizontal jump, made across a gap like a chasm or stream. At the midpoint of the jump, you attain a vertical height equal to one-quarter of the horizontal distance.
Emphasis mine.
If you jump 20' or more horizontally, you automatically jump 5' or more vertically.
That means you don't go in straight line, if you jump 20' or more, horizontally.
And we all know you have to go in straight line, if you want to charge.
Zinger2099
11-21-07, 08:23 AM You cannot change the direction while charging.
If you have to jump vertically(5' or higher), then you cannot charge.
If you don't have to jump vertically(like jumping over a chasm narrower than 15' because you automatically go up a quarter of the long jump distance), then you can.

There is a feat, though I can't remember it's name, that allows you to turn once on a charge.
Bopple
11-21-07, 08:27 AM Yeah, and there is even a Skill Trick for that.
irdeggman
11-21-07, 11:04 AM The feat is fleet of foot (CW)

You can make a single direction change of no more than 90 degrees. If yuo ae using the charge action you must move in a straight line for 10 feet after the turn to maintain the charge.

Rules Compendium

"You can make a long jump to avoid an obstacle as part of a charge, as long as you meet all other criteria for making a charge before, during, and after the jump."

There is a difference between making a vertical jump and making a long jump.

As pointed out making a long jump involves going up some vertical distance in the process but no where as much as a vertical jump does.
weasel0
11-22-07, 01:07 AM Asinine thought for the day:

I long jump 20 feet. I'm assumed to get 5 feet off the ground. So, by RAW, I've just used 25 feet of movement.

5 feet up(1 diagonal) +10 feet horizontal + 5 feet back down(10feet for second diagonal)

I mean, if you really wanna get technical with it and all. Otherwise, let's just let it be simplified and say make your long jump check. Pass? good, attack roll. Fail? sorry, you fall prone, who's next?
Bopple
11-22-07, 03:06 AM If there were nothing that bypass the limit of charging attack, then you might have a point.
But there are certain features like Fleet of Feet, Acrobatic Charge, Twisted Charge, and ect.
If you give it away for free, then you penalize them unfairly.
tos_shai_hulud
11-22-07, 03:10 AM If there were nothing that bypass the limit of charging attack, then you might have a point.
But there are certain features like Fleet of Feet, Acrobatic Charge, Twisted Charge, and ect.
If you give it away for free, then you penalize them unfairly.

Well, I suppose you are arguing against the ruling in the Rules Compendium that irdeggman posted, then. According to the Rules Compendium, a long jump (of any distance) can be used as part of a charge.
Bopple
11-22-07, 08:14 PM How so? It is just clarifying that attempting a long jump itself does not hinder your charging.
You can make a long jump to avoid an obstacle as part of a charge, as long as you meet all other criteria for making a charge before, during, and after the jump.
Emphasis mine.
It's clearly stated that you have to meet the normal requirement of charge.

If it means you can bypass the normal limit of charge(like changing directions), there is no reason not to allow High Jump, while allowing Long Jump.

Seriously, if you can long-jump 40'(thus automatically high-jumping 10') while charging, why can't you just high-jump 10' to jump over a creature?
Marcus Majarra
11-22-07, 09:40 PM Seriously, if you can long-jump 40'(thus automatically high-jumping 10') while charging, why can't you just high-jump 10' to jump over a creature?
Because you typically can't make a high jump to avoid an obstacle. Obstacles, by definition, must be blocking your charge path. When you're making a high jump, you're never actually avoiding obstacles. In fact, you don't even have any forward movement when making a high jump.
Bopple
11-22-07, 09:48 PM Then if you want to jump over a high-pole(like Olympics), you have to make a long jump, in D&D world?
weasel0
11-22-07, 10:50 PM .... yeeeeaaah, but with high jump, you actually are changing directions from a horizontal compass defined direction to a vertical direction. At least with a long jump, you're still maintaining the same compass direction.
Also, just because your jump check says you cleared 40', doesn't mean you did. Simply roll the check to match the DC for the amount of distance you want. Then look and see if that 10' is enough to clear the obsticle(40' as the example). If your check tells you that you succeeded your attempted say, 15', and your check was enough fo 40', let the guy be the star of the moment and let him get the 15' foward with enough veritical to clear his obsticle. This is a game of heroics afterall!
mvincent
11-26-07, 07:05 PM when you're jumping, you're not moving in a straight line. Rather, you're moving in a quadratic curve.From the 3.5 FAQ:
"You can make a long jump as part of a charge. You must
still follow all the normal rules for making a charge, such as
moving in a straight line on the battle grid. This tactic can let
you avoid some of the normal restrictions against charging. If a
square of difficult terrain is between you and your charge
target, you could possibly jump over it with a long jump. (The
fact that your jump means that your movement isn’t a perfectly
straight line doesn’t make the charge illegal—you’re still
moving in a straight line as far as the battle grid is concerned,
and the jump isn’t really changing your direction.)"

That said, I typically rule that jumping can prevent hindering terrain from stopping a charge (since it isn't really "hindering" if you are jumping over it), but people in the way still prevent a charge even if you jump over them (since they need not be hindering you to prevent the charge, as stated for allies). Odd, but RAW, and fair.
Duvanok
12-02-07, 04:38 PM I allow characters to make a jump as part of a charge as long as there are no obstacles in the way (because you need a clear path to the target. For example, the characters couldn't jump over a wall while charging, but he could jump over a pit.

In fact one of the coolest moves I've seen was:
A barbarian (and party) approaches a chasm with a suspension bridge, the gnoll on the other side sees the party coming, cuts the rope and down goes the bridge. Apparently that really upset the barbarian as he raged, charged straight at the gnoll, leaped over the 20' chasm with axe held high over head, and split the gnolls head wide open. Wasn't sure at the time if everything was "legal" but it was too cool to not let happen.

Later, I remember reading a Sage Advice column where a similar question came up and I seem to remember the Sage supporting my take on it. I'll have to see if I can dig that up. . .
Rood_Inverse
12-02-07, 05:22 PM Ok, then what happens with a thri-kreen with maximum ranks in jump? He begins with a +30, let us assume that he has 21 ranks (the ranks of a thri-kreen with 16 levels in monk, making him ECL 20, since he also has two racial HD),

[. . .]

... when he makes a running jump, he has a +99 (+9 if running) to his jump check. This means that for a long jump, the character can jump no less than 100 feet on a roll of one. That translates to 25 feet of vertical distance for a vertical jump.

Turn this into a class. Give him falling object+weapon damage. Call the class Dragoon. You've solved an ancient question that has tormented nerds since video games were invented. The bards will sing your name forever.
mvincent
12-03-07, 12:34 AM I remember reading a Sage Advice column where a similar question came up and I seem to remember the Sage supporting my take on it. I'll have to see if I can dig that up. . .Er... I believe I gave that in the post before yours (i.e. FAQ comes from Sage Advice)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
tos_shai_hulud 11-20-07, 11:58 AM	According to charge, if impediments exist, a character cannot charge, but what about making a jump check to avoid impediments? For instance, five goblins riding worgs are attempting to charge the spellcaster, but a party member is in the way. Can they jump over the party member to get to the spellcaster as part of their Ride-by Attack? If they clear 5', are they considered successful (although they provoke an attack of opportunity)? Or would it be the character's height as the DC to avoid him as an impediment (taller creatures require higher Jump DCs). I believe the character in the way is 6½ feet, so would that be a DC 26 jump check? Or would jumping be considered a change in direction, thus disallowed as part of the charge?
Marcus Majarra 11-20-07, 12:40 PM	Your tactic is only possible through the use of the Leap Attack feat (Complete Adventurer). The thing is, normally, when you're jumping, you're not moving in a straight line. Rather, you're moving in a quadratic curve.
Zinger2099 11-20-07, 12:52 PM	Beat me to it. I was just about to say that Marcus. :P
tos_shai_hulud 11-20-07, 12:54 PM	Ok, what about a prone character? Are they considered "in the way" for a charge? What about an incorporeal creature?
Zinger2099 11-20-07, 01:09 PM	Ok, what about a prone character? Are they considered "in the way" for a charge? What about an incorporeal creature? The rules for entering a prone character's square isn't any different from entering a non-prone character's square. Now, if the character was also helpless (i.e. unconcious as well, and not just lying prone) then you can move into his/her square freely, but you still couldn't charge through it. A body in a square, to my knowledge, is considered rough terrain. But even if it isn't, it's still an obstruction, and you can't charge through any kind of obstructions. As for an incorporeal creature, if the creature is an enemy, then no. You can't enter an enemies square (unless you tumble, and you can't tumble on a charge) be it incorporeal or not. If the incorporeal creature is an ally, then, I really don't know. Maybe? It'd be a DM call. That's my best take on the issue.
tos_shai_hulud 11-20-07, 01:26 PM	Ok, thanks.
Andrew 11-20-07, 02:05 PM	I had held an opinion like the above posters (that it wasn't possible without Leap Attack), but I think I recently saw a block of text addressing this in the Rules Compendium. I'm away from my books, though, so can't check the specifics.
tos_shai_hulud 11-20-07, 05:48 PM	Ok, here is a slightly different approach. These are goblin worg-riders. They all have high ride skill (+14). Leap You can get your mount to leap obstacles as part of its movement. Use your Ride modifier or the mount’s Jump modifier, whichever is lower, to see how far the creature can jump. If you fail your Ride check, you fall off the mount when it leaps and take the appropriate falling damage (at least 1d6 points). This usage does not take an action, but is part of the mount’s movement. Would this usage of the Ride skill allow a charge over obstacles? Like people in the way, should the result be high enough (I doubt it will be, since the mount will not be making running leaps, but only charging). Since these worgs were trained, they have higher than normal jump checks, so I would use the rider's ride check to see how far/high they could jump, and with a DC 48 to clear a 6' tall character, he is not going to make it. But, do the rules support this usage for a mounted player making leaps to continue a charge attack?
Zinger2099 11-20-07, 06:31 PM	I would assume no. Leap is done as part of a movement. Charge is a special attack that is a full-round action. I am fairly certain Leap is intended to be used as part of a move action only, but I could be wrong. That being said, the whole point of a charge is that you are running as fast as possible at your target. You move double your speed and attack in the turn. That's essentially 3 actions right there. The restrictions apply because of this fact. Essentially a charge is a combination of an attack and the run action. The reason you are able to move double your speed and attack is because you are fully exerting yourself towards running at a target, and anything that would slow you down even just a little would interfear with that charge, such as jumping over obstacles, moving around corners, and the like. There are feats that let you have more versatility within a charge, such as leaping, ignoring obstacles, turning, ect. But under normal circumstances these actions are not possible. But then, we're starting to get away from RAW and into Intent of RAW. To be honest, I don't know if the Leap special ability would allow a creature to jump over obstacles as part of a charge. But I would assume no, simply because of the very nature of a charge.
Bopple 11-20-07, 09:15 PM	You cannot change the direction while charging. If you have to jump vertically(5' or higher), then you cannot charge. If you don't have to jump vertically(like jumping over a chasm narrower than 15' because you automatically go up a quarter of the long jump distance), then you can.
tos_shai_hulud 11-20-07, 09:16 PM	Leap describes use during a mount's movement not move action. This would indicate that any time that it is in motion, it can leap. This does not indicate that it can charge with obstacles in the way, fully intent on leaping over them. It may be that because the obstacles are there, it cannot charge, even though it possesses the ability to leap over them, just by nature of the definition of Charge. Of course, I can easily see a cavalry charger bringing his mount into a full run with a line of people in his way, plowing through them to strike down an archer. This seems to indicate that mounted combat should be treated differently, and perhaps additional liberties taken with charging should a mounted rider attempt a charge attack. Of course, this again becomes a question of the RAI as opposed to RAW, since the RAW is not explicit on this matter.
tos_shai_hulud 11-20-07, 09:37 PM	Ok, then what happens with a thri-kreen with maximum ranks in jump? He begins with a +30, let us assume that he has 21 ranks (the ranks of a thri-kreen with 16 levels in monk, making him ECL 20, since he also has two racial HD), 5 ranks of tumble (for synergy). Let's give him a ring of jumping (+10) and a strength score of 24 (began with an 18, +2 racial, +4 from level increase). We give him the following feats: Run, Skill Focus: Jump, Acrobatic, Leap of the Heavens (from PHB II). With 90' move speed, he has a +24, +10 from ring, +7 from Strength, +21 from ranks, +30 from race, +4 from Run feat (if running), +5 from Leap of the Heavens (if running), +2 synergy from Tumble, +3 from Skill focus, +2 from Acrobatic, so that when he makes a running jump, he has a +99 (+9 if running) to his jump check. This means that for a long jump, the character can jump no less than 100 feet on a roll of one. That translates to 25 feet of vertical distance for a vertical jump. At some point, the character's vertical distance will clear 5' from a horizontal jump. Is this simply ignored? Do you simply treat the long jump as though there is no vertical movement?
Bopple 11-20-07, 10:16 PM	Hmm? I said it's limited - obstacle shorter than 15'(or jump distance less than 20').
tos_shai_hulud 11-21-07, 02:07 AM	Hmm? I said it's limited - obstacle shorter than 15'(or jump distance less than 20'). I was informed by a friend with the Rules Compendium (which I do not possess) that long jumps in general are permissible during a charge. Is that limitation listed somewhere in those rules, or is that your own interpretation? Additionally, if someone is making a long jump, do you determine how high they jump? If someone is making a vertical jump, do you determine the distance they travel? Or is the other axis simply ignored?
Bopple 11-21-07, 02:19 AM	Long Jump: A long jump is a horizontal jump, made across a gap like a chasm or stream. At the midpoint of the jump, you attain a vertical height equal to one-quarter of the horizontal distance. Emphasis mine. If you jump 20' or more horizontally, you automatically jump 5' or more vertically. That means you don't go in straight line, if you jump 20' or more, horizontally. And we all know you have to go in straight line, if you want to charge.
Zinger2099 11-21-07, 08:23 AM	You cannot change the direction while charging. If you have to jump vertically(5' or higher), then you cannot charge. If you don't have to jump vertically(like jumping over a chasm narrower than 15' because you automatically go up a quarter of the long jump distance), then you can. There is a feat, though I can't remember it's name, that allows you to turn once on a charge.
Bopple 11-21-07, 08:27 AM	Yeah, and there is even a Skill Trick for that.
irdeggman 11-21-07, 11:04 AM	The feat is fleet of foot (CW) You can make a single direction change of no more than 90 degrees. If yuo ae using the charge action you must move in a straight line for 10 feet after the turn to maintain the charge. Rules Compendium "You can make a long jump to avoid an obstacle as part of a charge, as long as you meet all other criteria for making a charge before, during, and after the jump." There is a difference between making a vertical jump and making a long jump. As pointed out making a long jump involves going up some vertical distance in the process but no where as much as a vertical jump does.
weasel0 11-22-07, 01:07 AM	Asinine thought for the day: I long jump 20 feet. I'm assumed to get 5 feet off the ground. So, by RAW, I've just used 25 feet of movement. 5 feet up(1 diagonal) +10 feet horizontal + 5 feet back down(10feet for second diagonal) I mean, if you really wanna get technical with it and all. Otherwise, let's just let it be simplified and say make your long jump check. Pass? good, attack roll. Fail? sorry, you fall prone, who's next?
Bopple 11-22-07, 03:06 AM	If there were nothing that bypass the limit of charging attack, then you might have a point. But there are certain features like Fleet of Feet, Acrobatic Charge, Twisted Charge, and ect. If you give it away for free, then you penalize them unfairly.
tos_shai_hulud 11-22-07, 03:10 AM	If there were nothing that bypass the limit of charging attack, then you might have a point. But there are certain features like Fleet of Feet, Acrobatic Charge, Twisted Charge, and ect. If you give it away for free, then you penalize them unfairly. Well, I suppose you are arguing against the ruling in the Rules Compendium that irdeggman posted, then. According to the Rules Compendium, a long jump (of any distance) can be used as part of a charge.
Bopple 11-22-07, 08:14 PM	How so? It is just clarifying that attempting a long jump itself does not hinder your charging. You can make a long jump to avoid an obstacle as part of a charge, as long as you meet all other criteria for making a charge before, during, and after the jump. Emphasis mine. It's clearly stated that you have to meet the normal requirement of charge. If it means you can bypass the normal limit of charge(like changing directions), there is no reason not to allow High Jump, while allowing Long Jump. Seriously, if you can long-jump 40'(thus automatically high-jumping 10') while charging, why can't you just high-jump 10' to jump over a creature?
Marcus Majarra 11-22-07, 09:40 PM	Seriously, if you can long-jump 40'(thus automatically high-jumping 10') while charging, why can't you just high-jump 10' to jump over a creature? Because you typically can't make a high jump to avoid an obstacle. Obstacles, by definition, must be blocking your charge path. When you're making a high jump, you're never actually avoiding obstacles. In fact, you don't even have any forward movement when making a high jump.
Bopple 11-22-07, 09:48 PM	Then if you want to jump over a high-pole(like Olympics), you have to make a long jump, in D&D world?
weasel0 11-22-07, 10:50 PM	.... yeeeeaaah, but with high jump, you actually are changing directions from a horizontal compass defined direction to a vertical direction. At least with a long jump, you're still maintaining the same compass direction. Also, just because your jump check says you cleared 40', doesn't mean you did. Simply roll the check to match the DC for the amount of distance you want. Then look and see if that 10' is enough to clear the obsticle(40' as the example). If your check tells you that you succeeded your attempted say, 15', and your check was enough fo 40', let the guy be the star of the moment and let him get the 15' foward with enough veritical to clear his obsticle. This is a game of heroics afterall!
mvincent 11-26-07, 07:05 PM	when you're jumping, you're not moving in a straight line. Rather, you're moving in a quadratic curve.From the 3.5 FAQ: "You can make a long jump as part of a charge. You must still follow all the normal rules for making a charge, such as moving in a straight line on the battle grid. This tactic can let you avoid some of the normal restrictions against charging. If a square of difficult terrain is between you and your charge target, you could possibly jump over it with a long jump. (The fact that your jump means that your movement isn’t a perfectly straight line doesn’t make the charge illegal—you’re still moving in a straight line as far as the battle grid is concerned, and the jump isn’t really changing your direction.)" That said, I typically rule that jumping can prevent hindering terrain from stopping a charge (since it isn't really "hindering" if you are jumping over it), but people in the way still prevent a charge even if you jump over them (since they need not be hindering you to prevent the charge, as stated for allies). Odd, but RAW, and fair.
Duvanok 12-02-07, 04:38 PM	I allow characters to make a jump as part of a charge as long as there are no obstacles in the way (because you need a clear path to the target. For example, the characters couldn't jump over a wall while charging, but he could jump over a pit. In fact one of the coolest moves I've seen was: A barbarian (and party) approaches a chasm with a suspension bridge, the gnoll on the other side sees the party coming, cuts the rope and down goes the bridge. Apparently that really upset the barbarian as he raged, charged straight at the gnoll, leaped over the 20' chasm with axe held high over head, and split the gnolls head wide open. Wasn't sure at the time if everything was "legal" but it was too cool to not let happen. Later, I remember reading a Sage Advice column where a similar question came up and I seem to remember the Sage supporting my take on it. I'll have to see if I can dig that up. . .
Rood_Inverse 12-02-07, 05:22 PM	Ok, then what happens with a thri-kreen with maximum ranks in jump? He begins with a +30, let us assume that he has 21 ranks (the ranks of a thri-kreen with 16 levels in monk, making him ECL 20, since he also has two racial HD), [. . .] ... when he makes a running jump, he has a +99 (+9 if running) to his jump check. This means that for a long jump, the character can jump no less than 100 feet on a roll of one. That translates to 25 feet of vertical distance for a vertical jump. Turn this into a class. Give him falling object+weapon damage. Call the class Dragoon. You've solved an ancient question that has tormented nerds since video games were invented. The bards will sing your name forever.
mvincent 12-03-07, 12:34 AM	I remember reading a Sage Advice column where a similar question came up and I seem to remember the Sage supporting my take on it. I'll have to see if I can dig that up. . .Er... I believe I gave that in the post before yours (i.e. FAQ comes from Sage Advice)