Post/Author/DateTime	Post
BoringInfoGuy 08-22-07, 10:40 PM	A little while back, my Paladin's Chocobo (Dragon #323) Mount hit 8HD. I realized that I missed adding his ability increase for hitting 8HD. No problem, but as I was checking through the advancement rules to verify make certain that creatures do get ability increases with level, I noticed something else I'd forgotten. Some monsters increase in size as they go up in HD. And sure enough, the Chocobo goes up one size category after hitting 8HD. So here is my question. Does a paladin mount that increases it's HD due to the Paladin gaining levels follow the normal size increase advancement rules? A standard Warhorse does not normally advance, so I can't use it as a model. Sorry, this is from a player, not the group's DM. But I'm pretty much the rules guy for the group. Either way as both good and bad aspects for my character.
pres_man 08-22-07, 11:02 PM	I realized that I missed adding his ability increase for hitting 8HD. Paladin mounts do not get ability increases at multiples of four, from gaining extra HD due to the mount feature (they still get it before becoming a mount). Instead they get a Str bump and Int bump. No problem, but as I was checking through the advancement rules to verify make certain that creatures do get ability increases with level, I noticed something else I'd forgotten. Some monsters increase in size as they go up in HD. And sure enough, the Chocobo goes up one size category after hitting 8HD. Again those rules are for normally advanced creatures. Most advanced versions of animals and creatures are actually more like different breeds. Your typical wolf is not going to gain HD, for example, and get bigger. Instead a bigger breed of wolf is going to have more HD than a smaller breed. So here is my question. Does a paladin mount that increases it's HD due to the Paladin gaining levels follow the normal size increase advancement rules? No. Here is the text. Extra eight-sided (d8) Hit Dice, each of which gains a Constitution modifier, as normal. Extra Hit Dice improve the mount’s base attack and base save bonuses. A special mount’s base attack bonus is equal to that of a cleric of a level equal to the mount’s HD. A mount has good Fortitude and Reflex saves (treat it as a character whose level equals the animal’s HD). The mount gains additional skill points or feats for bonus HD as normal for advancing a monster’s Hit Dice. The mount gains hp, bab, saves, skills, and feats, that is all. A standard Warhorse does not normally advance, so I can't use it as a model. Doesn't matter, you are not using the animal advancement rules, you are using the paladin's mount rules. Think about it this way, if the normal advancement rules applied that means a warhorse as a paladin mount couldn't gain any bonus HD.
BoringInfoGuy 08-23-07, 06:29 PM	Thank you. After reading your reply, it is obvious that you are correct. I would say that the advancement rules can be used to showcase a particularly strong example of a creature instead of a different breed. But that would be in addition to - as opposed to replacing - the different breeds approach. But that is only a minor quibble. Your reasoning is superb.
pres_man 08-23-07, 07:01 PM	I would say that the advancement rules can be used to showcase a particularly strong example of a creature instead of a different breed. But that would be in addition to - as opposed to replacing - the different breeds approach. Well when I said breed I had in mind a chihuahua versus a mastiff. But yeah, unique individuals also can be represented that way as well. I just meant there was usually a "genetic" difference there. But my point was typical an individual creature does not "advance", it is either "advanced" or it is standard, but it doesn't usually change over time (except for the normal aging things).