Question regarding vampires [Archive] - Wizards Community

Question regarding vampires [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ninjacito
01-10-08, 02:43 PM I'm currently writing the fifth level of a dungeon for Dungeons and Dragons 3.5, and I have a vampire coven that I basically have planned to blood drain the entire party and convert them all into vampires. I read the section in Monster Manual 3.5 about creating vampires, but what if you have paladins in your party? What would they get converted into? Paladins have to be LG, but vampires are evil (any). Any suggestions are welcome.
LeeAlucard
01-10-08, 05:06 PM It would make them into ex-paladin vampires. That's all.
bloodtalon
01-10-08, 05:14 PM or have them trade in thier levels as pal for the blackgaurd if they can meet everything else
PenderGrass
01-10-08, 05:24 PM Are you wanting suggestions that adhere strictly to RAW or are you wanting less Core-centric ideas?

:dragon:
*****
LeeAlucard
01-10-08, 05:33 PM or have them trade in thier levels as pal for the blackgaurd if they can meet everything else

Is this a house rule of yours? 'Cuz the RAW doesn't seem to support it. If paladins fall, for any reason, they are just ex-paladins. From there, they can try and redeem themselves and become paladins again, or they can take levels in blackguard, but they aren't just automatically turned into blackguards by the experience. It's a prestige class for a reason.
Evil DM Mk3
01-10-08, 06:48 PM LeeAlucard and bloodtalon are both half right.

If a Blackguard has 11 levels of ex-paladin or more they can swap them for Blackguard levels. However having 5 levels in ex-paladin gives them an extra 1d6 sneak attack, 2 more smite goods and once per day he can heal himself or his fiendish servant his levelx2 hp.
LeeAlucard
01-10-08, 11:32 PM Also, the players might resent you if you make them be vampires, so you might want to provide a way to remove the vampirism if the players really don't like it. Just in case, y'know.
Finarin Panjoro
01-11-08, 10:46 AM No offense, but it sounds like you've pre-scripted a total party kill. Unless your players know this is coming in advance and have signed off on it (that is they have stated we want to play vampries, make it happen) they are going to be extremely annoyed and frustrated by this event since it doesn't sound like there's any way out of it.

Long ago I did something like this in a campaign and the players hated it so much that they simply stopped playing the game.
PenderGrass
01-11-08, 12:47 PM This thread was started by a November thirtieth-er.

:dragon:
*****
ninjacito
01-11-08, 02:41 PM Yes, I understand that the party needs to have a way out, and there will be one. I'm simply going to make this encounter the 5% Run Away room that the DM book allows. They might even defeat the encounter. But I'm just getting prepared for the chance that they all die. In that case, I'd like to leave them the option of playing on, if they want to play a vampire party. The blackguard idea isn't bad, but some of those skills/spells the paladin doesn't use, so while from an RP standpoint it makes sense, I don't see it working in a technical sense. And what is an ex-paladin? What book is that in? Thanks for all the suggestions.
Myzery78
01-11-08, 03:21 PM One thing to keep in mind is that if a person dies of negative levels, they rise only as a vampire spawn. To make the party full vampires they would need to die of the blood drain ability, which is highly unlikely. Unless your vampires have the improved grapple feat its likely they wont even be able to start a grapple, but even if they do pinning somebody and killing them 1d4 con at a time is a slow process.

Also since the party would be under the control of the other vampires, I dont see that being very fun. If the vampires control so many others that they couldnt also control the PCs, it seems highly unlikely that the coven would create free willed vampires from people they just murdered, who might very well want revenge.

All in all if the party engages them you'd probably be best off calling it a party wipe and rolling up new characters.
ninjacito
01-13-08, 04:41 PM Well, you've made some good points. I'm thinking that I'll change the vampires to lycanthropes instead, since it'll be easier to deal with all around.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ninjacito 01-10-08, 02:43 PM	I'm currently writing the fifth level of a dungeon for Dungeons and Dragons 3.5, and I have a vampire coven that I basically have planned to blood drain the entire party and convert them all into vampires. I read the section in Monster Manual 3.5 about creating vampires, but what if you have paladins in your party? What would they get converted into? Paladins have to be LG, but vampires are evil (any). Any suggestions are welcome.
LeeAlucard 01-10-08, 05:06 PM	It would make them into ex-paladin vampires. That's all.
bloodtalon 01-10-08, 05:14 PM	or have them trade in thier levels as pal for the blackgaurd if they can meet everything else
PenderGrass 01-10-08, 05:24 PM	Are you wanting suggestions that adhere strictly to RAW or are you wanting less Core-centric ideas? :dragon: *****
LeeAlucard 01-10-08, 05:33 PM	or have them trade in thier levels as pal for the blackgaurd if they can meet everything else Is this a house rule of yours? 'Cuz the RAW doesn't seem to support it. If paladins fall, for any reason, they are just ex-paladins. From there, they can try and redeem themselves and become paladins again, or they can take levels in blackguard, but they aren't just automatically turned into blackguards by the experience. It's a prestige class for a reason.
Evil DM Mk3 01-10-08, 06:48 PM	LeeAlucard and bloodtalon are both half right. If a Blackguard has 11 levels of ex-paladin or more they can swap them for Blackguard levels. However having 5 levels in ex-paladin gives them an extra 1d6 sneak attack, 2 more smite goods and once per day he can heal himself or his fiendish servant his levelx2 hp.
LeeAlucard 01-10-08, 11:32 PM	Also, the players might resent you if you make them be vampires, so you might want to provide a way to remove the vampirism if the players really don't like it. Just in case, y'know.
Finarin Panjoro 01-11-08, 10:46 AM	No offense, but it sounds like you've pre-scripted a total party kill. Unless your players know this is coming in advance and have signed off on it (that is they have stated we want to play vampries, make it happen) they are going to be extremely annoyed and frustrated by this event since it doesn't sound like there's any way out of it. Long ago I did something like this in a campaign and the players hated it so much that they simply stopped playing the game.
PenderGrass 01-11-08, 12:47 PM	This thread was started by a November thirtieth-er. :dragon: *****
ninjacito 01-11-08, 02:41 PM	Yes, I understand that the party needs to have a way out, and there will be one. I'm simply going to make this encounter the 5% Run Away room that the DM book allows. They might even defeat the encounter. But I'm just getting prepared for the chance that they all die. In that case, I'd like to leave them the option of playing on, if they want to play a vampire party. The blackguard idea isn't bad, but some of those skills/spells the paladin doesn't use, so while from an RP standpoint it makes sense, I don't see it working in a technical sense. And what is an ex-paladin? What book is that in? Thanks for all the suggestions.
Myzery78 01-11-08, 03:21 PM	One thing to keep in mind is that if a person dies of negative levels, they rise only as a vampire spawn. To make the party full vampires they would need to die of the blood drain ability, which is highly unlikely. Unless your vampires have the improved grapple feat its likely they wont even be able to start a grapple, but even if they do pinning somebody and killing them 1d4 con at a time is a slow process. Also since the party would be under the control of the other vampires, I dont see that being very fun. If the vampires control so many others that they couldnt also control the PCs, it seems highly unlikely that the coven would create free willed vampires from people they just murdered, who might very well want revenge. All in all if the party engages them you'd probably be best off calling it a party wipe and rolling up new characters.
ninjacito 01-13-08, 04:41 PM	Well, you've made some good points. I'm thinking that I'll change the vampires to lycanthropes instead, since it'll be easier to deal with all around.