Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Asilomar 04-30-07, 06:26 PM	If the Ranger chose 'Human' would he also call undead that were made from Human favored?
Argo 04-30-07, 06:29 PM	No. He'd have to choose 'Undead'.
tos_shai_hulud 04-30-07, 06:52 PM	It depends, actually. Some undead, such as Vampires, retain their humanoid qualities. Skeletons, on the other hand, lose them. A human skeleton would be Undead (Augmented Humanoid), but not have the Human subtype (as required by your favored enemy ability). A Vampire on the other hand does not say that it loses its subtypes, and therefore would be Undead (Augmented Humanoid, Human)
Mock26 04-30-07, 07:18 PM	It depends, actually. Some undead, such as Vampires, retain their humanoid qualities. Skeletons, on the other hand, lose them. A human skeleton would be Undead (Augmented Humanoid), but not have the Human subtype (as required by your favored enemy ability). A Vampire on the other hand does not say that it loses its subtypes, and therefore would be Undead (Augmented Humanoid, Human) But what if it was a halfling vampire? :D
tos_shai_hulud 04-30-07, 07:28 PM	Lol, Halflings (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfling.htm) are Humanoid (Halfling). A ranger would need to use his favored evemy for Humanoid (Halfling) for it to apply to a halfling vampire.
SALDAR 04-30-07, 07:29 PM	If the Ranger chose 'Human' would he also call undead that were made from Human favored? No. When a ranger chooses a favored enemy he chooses a creature type. In the case of a human the creature type would be Humanoid (Human). Humanoids and Outsiders also require you choose a subtype. An undead creature, no matter what type it had before, is now of type Undead, there are no subtypes for undead. A vampire is of type Undead. A halfing vampire is no longer a Humanoid (Halfling), it is an Undead. You would need Favored Enemy Undead to gain the bonuses against it.
tos_shai_hulud 04-30-07, 07:29 PM	Also note, a ranger with Favored Enemy (Humanoid (Human)) and Favored Enemy (Undead) stacks the bonuses, as they are untyped.
tos_shai_hulud 04-30-07, 07:39 PM	An undead creature, no matter what type it had before, is now of type Undead, there are no subtypes for undead. This is wrong. Most undead overrides subtype. Vampires and Ghosts, for example, keep any subtypes they had while living: Size and Type The creature’s type changes to undead. Do not recalculate the creature’s base attack bonus, saves, or skill points. It gains the incorporeal subtype. Size is unchanged. This would make a Human Ghost have the type: Undead (Augmented Human) (Human, Incorporeal) Size and Type The creature’s type changes to undead (augmented humanoid or monstrous humanoid). Now, compare this to the skeleton entry (for example): Size and Type The creature’s type changes to undead. It retains any subtype except for alignment subtypes (such as good) and subtypes that indicate kind. It does not gain the augmented subtype. It uses all the base creature’s statistics and special abilities except as noted here. Note here that it does NOT gain the augmented subtype. It does get the Kind subtype, so a skeleton could be Undead (Human), but it would not be Undead (Augmented Humanoid, Human). This is a special case where a ranger does not gain his bonus against Humans against the skeleton, because it is no longer Humanoid.
SALDAR 04-30-07, 08:21 PM	This is wrong. Most undead overrides subtype. Vampires and Ghosts, for example, keep any subtypes they had while living: My mistake. I meant there are no subtypes for Undead that favored enemy bonuses are applied to. A vampire would have these subtypes but they no longer matter for the purposes of favored enemy bonuses. When applying the Vampire Template the creature's type changes to Undead, therefore, it is no longer a Humanoid so any favored enemy bonuses that apply to a Humanoid creature would no longer apply to the Undead creature. The Undead type does not require the ranger to specify a subtype so subtypes, whatever they may be, are no longer applicable. If its type is Undead then only the bonuses for Favored Enemy Undead would apply. This would make a Human Ghost have the type: Undead (Augmented Human) (Human, Incorporeal) Actually it would be Undead (Augmented Human, Incorporeal). Since this creature is no longer a Humanoid (Human) any favored enemy bonuses that work against Humanoid (Human) do not apply nor would they stack with favored enemy bonuses for other creature types.
Mock26 04-30-07, 08:33 PM	Lol, Halflings (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfling.htm) are Humanoid (Halfling). A ranger would need to use his favored evemy for Humanoid (Halfling) for it to apply to a halfling vampire. I don't think I've ever seen or even heard about a halfling vampire. I may have to put one into my campaign!
tos_shai_hulud 04-30-07, 08:44 PM	My mistake. The bonuses don't stack. If the ranger chooses humanoids or outsiders as a favored enemy, he must also choose an associated subtype, as indicated on the table. If a specific creature falls into more than one category of favored enemy, the ranger’s bonuses do not stack; he simply uses whichever bonus is higher.
Marcus Majarra 05-01-07, 02:16 AM	Despite gaining the Augmented Humanoid (Human) subtype, a human vampire is no subject to favored enemy bonuses for Humanoid (Human). The augmented subtype only allows the base creature to retain the features of the original type (as defined by its type; see the Monster Manual). Being vulnerable to favored enemy is not a type feature. Favored enemy is a ranger class feature that allows the ranger to gain bonuses against creatures of a specific type (and subtype, in the case of humanoids and outsiders). The clause under favored enemy stipulating that favored enemy bonuses don't stack is there because certain creatures inherently have more than one valid type/subtype combination. The Balor is an example, qualifying for both Outsider (Evil) and Outsider (Chaotic).