Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ElyasRavenwood 02-10-08, 10:36 AM	I have a quick question about monks and their unarmed strikes. I understand that for a monk an unarmed strike can be anything from a knee, elbow, fist, kick and even a head but. I understand that a monk’s unarmed strike is treated as a natural and manufactured weapon for the purposes of spells. I also understand that the monk adds his full strength bonus for his unarmed strikes. Here is my question: Kicks arguably have more force behind them then a punch and yet the monk would add the same strength bonus to a kick as well as a punch. They are all unarmed strikes. Fighters get to do 1.5x their Str. modifier, when wielding a weapon two handed. Would it unbalance the game to allow a monk to do the same 1.5x their Str. modifier to unarmed strikes, which are kicks? I have one other question. What happens if I have a human fighter who takes first the unarmed strike feat, then superior unarmed strike feat, and finally the Improved natural attack feat? What kind of damage would his unarmed strikes do? Would he have the option of doing lethal or subdual damage without the -4 to hit penalty? Would his unarmed strikes be treated as a natural and manufactured weapon for the purposes of spells? I would expect that he does not get any flurry of blows, and any iterative attacks would come off of his base attack bonus progression. I also assume that he would not get any kind of Ki strike abilities, namely no magic, lawful, or adamantine, strikes. What are your thoughts? Thanks.
Merestil Haye 02-10-08, 10:56 AM	Some of the benefits a Monk has with Unarmed Strikes come from the Improved Unarmed Strike feat, and the rest from Monk training. The feat :Benefit You are considered to be armed even when unarmed —that is, you do not provoke attacks or opportunity from armed opponents when you attack them while unarmed. However, you still get an attack of opportunity against any opponent who makes an unarmed attack on you. In addition, your unarmed strikes can deal lethal or nonlethal damage, at your option. That's reasonably clear. The featholder is considered armed when making unarmed strikes, and can choose to deal lethal or nonlethal damage. That makes everything else a function of Monk training. Increasing damage, the ability to treat the attack as either a natural or manufactured weapon, flurry of blows (and all improvements to it) - all these are part of the Monk training regime, and not benefits of Improved Unarmed Strike. As I understand the rules, Unarmed Strikes get iterative attacks. (Even if you don't have IUS). I don't accept this, and rule against it in my games.
Kouk 02-10-08, 05:04 PM	If you were to allow a Monk to use his legs for 1.5x damage, what would the trade-off be? Why would he not always use kicks? There is a feat, Hammer Fist in Races of Faerun and also reprinted in Dragon Magazine and Dragon Compendium. It allows one to take a Standard Action to make an attack which deals 1.5x Str bonus with unarmed, because you are sort of clasping your hands together and hitting with both at the same time (2 handed attack). In the Dragon version it does not require you be a Dwarf like it does in RoF.
weasel0 02-11-08, 03:21 PM	Hammer Fist is also in the Prestige Monk. A 3.0 splat.
ElyasRavenwood 02-11-08, 10:55 PM	Thanks for your thoughts gentlemenYou have given me a place to start looking. The feat looks like a good idea. thanks