Silence [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Silence [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Charlym_Zuardan
09-25-07, 06:10 PM in the spell description it says that no sound can be produced in the affected area... 20ft radius i think... including spells with verbal components.

it says that you can target an object, creature, or point in space. if you target a creature which is unwilling, they get a will saving throw to negate it.

my question is this.

if you cast it on a point in space, or on a willing creature, and then a spellcaster moves into the affecte area, or the creature moves near a spellcaster, does the spellcaster get to make a save or is he automatically silenced?

the description is a little vague and just says that if it is cast ON an unwilling creature then a save applies.. it doesnt say anything about a creature moving into the affected area or anything like that.
heffroncm
09-25-07, 06:17 PM Actually, I find the description pretty specific. If cast on an unwilling creature, they get a saving throw. At no other time would they get a saving throw, or the spell would say so.

So yeah, you can cast it on a pebble next to the BBEG Wizard. And, next round, he can move 25' and be out of the radius, and cast a spell on you.
Charlym_Zuardan
09-25-07, 06:50 PM so in theory one could cast it on an ally, who could then move in to melee range of an enemy spellcaster, and as long as he stays within 25ft theres nothing the spellcaster can do about it.

thats actually pretty powerful for a level 2 spell if used properly

:)

good to know
heffroncm
09-25-07, 06:55 PM Yeah, it's a great spell. Also, as a low-level effect, it's fairly well protected from area dispels if you cast it on an ally.

There are ways around verbal components, though. Silent Spell and Nonverbal Spellcasting come to mind.
Some_call_me_Tim
09-25-07, 07:43 PM so in theory one could cast it on an ally, who could then move in to melee range of an enemy spellcaster, and as long as he stays within 25ft theres nothing the spellcaster can do about it.Of course, it cuts both ways, in tight quarters it may very well nerf friendly spellcasters as well.

If your DM will allow it, cast silence on a tanglefoot bag and throw it at the caster. Even if your DM doesn't allow that, use the tanglefoot bag to glue the sucker down then cast silence on a point near him then pummel him to oblivion.
weasel0
09-25-07, 10:03 PM Rogue using Slieght of Hand to plant a silenced pebble on the BBEG caster.
DMCuindless
09-25-07, 11:01 PM The party in my current campaign uses the silence tactic with great success. All three casters (Bard, Sorcerer and Cleric) have the Silent Spell feat. Although it raises the casting level by one, it completely eradicates enemy casters (though, as was said before, there are ways around it). They typically cast the spell on the tank's sword, which brings up an interesting question: What happens if an enemy sunders the object that silence is cast on?
Some_call_me_Tim
09-26-07, 12:30 PM Rogue using Slieght of Hand to plant a silenced pebble on the BBEG caster.Where does he put it? In a pocket? That won't work as silence is an emanation.
Lilinthra
09-26-07, 12:49 PM The party in my current campaign uses the silence tactic with great success. All three casters (Bard, Sorcerer and Cleric) have the Silent Spell feat. Although it raises the casting level by one, it completely eradicates enemy casters (though, as was said before, there are ways around it). They typically cast the spell on the tank's sword, which brings up an interesting question: What happens if an enemy sunders the object that silence is cast on?
Silent Spell can't be used to enhance Bard spells, at least not without a houserule.
Myzery78
09-26-07, 01:43 PM A sundered item is destroyed, so the silence spell would end. Same goes for the tanglefoot bag, so short of a house rule(which is by no means unreasonable) a silenced bag that breaks is no longer silenced.
weasel0
09-26-07, 09:43 PM Where does he put it? In a pocket? That won't work as silence is an emanation.

Hmmmm, a good point. Though if you were to think this through to it's full....

Anyone standing behind a fighter would not be in the silence field as his body would block the emanation in back of him. Unless it's a fill, in which case any crack in armor, belt loop or other such loose article, robe fold, would be useful because then only completely sealing the item would stop it from functioning.
heffroncm
09-26-07, 10:11 PM Hmmmm, a good point. Though if you were to think this through to it's full(pun maybe?)....

Anyone standing behind a fighter would not be in the silence field as his body would block the emanation in back of him. Unless it's a fill, in which case any crack in armor, belt loop or other such loose article, robe fold, would be useful because then only completely sealing the item would stop it from functioning.

You need full cover to stop an emanation. A body only provides partial cover. A tower shield works.
weasel0
09-26-07, 10:16 PM Ah so see, it's fine to plant the pebble on him then.
heffroncm
09-26-07, 10:35 PM Ah so see, it's fine to plant the pebble on him then.

Um. Wait. You can hide behind a Tower Shield and that will provide enough cover from Silence to provent it's spread to you, but having it stuck in someones pocket won't? That doesn't make much sense.
DMCuindless
09-26-07, 10:35 PM Ah so see, it's fine to plant the pebble on him then.

Attach a little sovereign glue to it and stick it to his body.
DMCuindless
09-26-07, 10:36 PM A sundered item is destroyed, so the silence spell would end. Same goes for the tanglefoot bag, so short of a house rule(which is by no means unreasonable) a silenced bag that breaks is no longer silenced.

Excellent! Two birds with one stone! The fighter loses his weapon and the party loses it's silence spell...
heffroncm
09-26-07, 11:10 PM Attach a little sovereign glue to it and stick it to his body.

Oh, the joy of combining low-level spells creatively. Like using Telekinesis to dip Silence rocks into Sovereign Glue, then flinging them at people.
DMCuindless
09-26-07, 11:14 PM Oh, the joy of combining low-level spells creatively. Like using Telekinesis to dip Silence rocks into Sovereign Glue, then flinging them at people.

That's about the coolest thing I've ever heard! I have got to try that next time I play a sorcerer.
Tedronai
09-27-07, 08:10 AM I prefer using Loadstones, they're harder to get rid of, and come with extra penalties for the unfortunate victim (half speed, I believe). If they even try to pull it off, the curse will activate and will teleport back into their possession. Last I checked, Remove Curse and Break Enchantment have verbal components, and wouldn't be generally prepared as silenced spells (so for the rest of the day, at the very least, the target it SOL).

Just make sure you don't actually carry the item yourself, use spells to move it: Mage Hand or Telekinesis for manipulation, Floating Disk for transporting it to the target.
weasel0
09-28-07, 12:37 AM Just for the record, I never said pocket. Just becuase I use SoH doesn't mean I'm using "Pickpocket." Let's leave 2ndEd(and 3.0? -I started after 3.5) behind us. I said(yes-bad form to quote self, but I see no choice here):crack in armor, belt loop or other such loose article, robe foldand to clarify, by robe fold, I mean like a sash loosely hanging across the opponent.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Charlym_Zuardan 09-25-07, 06:10 PM	in the spell description it says that no sound can be produced in the affected area... 20ft radius i think... including spells with verbal components. it says that you can target an object, creature, or point in space. if you target a creature which is unwilling, they get a will saving throw to negate it. my question is this. if you cast it on a point in space, or on a willing creature, and then a spellcaster moves into the affecte area, or the creature moves near a spellcaster, does the spellcaster get to make a save or is he automatically silenced? the description is a little vague and just says that if it is cast ON an unwilling creature then a save applies.. it doesnt say anything about a creature moving into the affected area or anything like that.
heffroncm 09-25-07, 06:17 PM	Actually, I find the description pretty specific. If cast on an unwilling creature, they get a saving throw. At no other time would they get a saving throw, or the spell would say so. So yeah, you can cast it on a pebble next to the BBEG Wizard. And, next round, he can move 25' and be out of the radius, and cast a spell on you.
Charlym_Zuardan 09-25-07, 06:50 PM	so in theory one could cast it on an ally, who could then move in to melee range of an enemy spellcaster, and as long as he stays within 25ft theres nothing the spellcaster can do about it. thats actually pretty powerful for a level 2 spell if used properly :) good to know
heffroncm 09-25-07, 06:55 PM	Yeah, it's a great spell. Also, as a low-level effect, it's fairly well protected from area dispels if you cast it on an ally. There are ways around verbal components, though. Silent Spell and Nonverbal Spellcasting come to mind.
Some_call_me_Tim 09-25-07, 07:43 PM	so in theory one could cast it on an ally, who could then move in to melee range of an enemy spellcaster, and as long as he stays within 25ft theres nothing the spellcaster can do about it.Of course, it cuts both ways, in tight quarters it may very well nerf friendly spellcasters as well. If your DM will allow it, cast silence on a tanglefoot bag and throw it at the caster. Even if your DM doesn't allow that, use the tanglefoot bag to glue the sucker down then cast silence on a point near him then pummel him to oblivion.
weasel0 09-25-07, 10:03 PM	Rogue using Slieght of Hand to plant a silenced pebble on the BBEG caster.
DMCuindless 09-25-07, 11:01 PM	The party in my current campaign uses the silence tactic with great success. All three casters (Bard, Sorcerer and Cleric) have the Silent Spell feat. Although it raises the casting level by one, it completely eradicates enemy casters (though, as was said before, there are ways around it). They typically cast the spell on the tank's sword, which brings up an interesting question: What happens if an enemy sunders the object that silence is cast on?
Some_call_me_Tim 09-26-07, 12:30 PM	Rogue using Slieght of Hand to plant a silenced pebble on the BBEG caster.Where does he put it? In a pocket? That won't work as silence is an emanation.
Lilinthra 09-26-07, 12:49 PM	The party in my current campaign uses the silence tactic with great success. All three casters (Bard, Sorcerer and Cleric) have the Silent Spell feat. Although it raises the casting level by one, it completely eradicates enemy casters (though, as was said before, there are ways around it). They typically cast the spell on the tank's sword, which brings up an interesting question: What happens if an enemy sunders the object that silence is cast on? Silent Spell can't be used to enhance Bard spells, at least not without a houserule.
Myzery78 09-26-07, 01:43 PM	A sundered item is destroyed, so the silence spell would end. Same goes for the tanglefoot bag, so short of a house rule(which is by no means unreasonable) a silenced bag that breaks is no longer silenced.
weasel0 09-26-07, 09:43 PM	Where does he put it? In a pocket? That won't work as silence is an emanation. Hmmmm, a good point. Though if you were to think this through to it's full.... Anyone standing behind a fighter would not be in the silence field as his body would block the emanation in back of him. Unless it's a fill, in which case any crack in armor, belt loop or other such loose article, robe fold, would be useful because then only completely sealing the item would stop it from functioning.
heffroncm 09-26-07, 10:11 PM	Hmmmm, a good point. Though if you were to think this through to it's full(pun maybe?).... Anyone standing behind a fighter would not be in the silence field as his body would block the emanation in back of him. Unless it's a fill, in which case any crack in armor, belt loop or other such loose article, robe fold, would be useful because then only completely sealing the item would stop it from functioning. You need full cover to stop an emanation. A body only provides partial cover. A tower shield works.
weasel0 09-26-07, 10:16 PM	Ah so see, it's fine to plant the pebble on him then.
heffroncm 09-26-07, 10:35 PM	Ah so see, it's fine to plant the pebble on him then. Um. Wait. You can hide behind a Tower Shield and that will provide enough cover from Silence to provent it's spread to you, but having it stuck in someones pocket won't? That doesn't make much sense.
DMCuindless 09-26-07, 10:35 PM	Ah so see, it's fine to plant the pebble on him then. Attach a little sovereign glue to it and stick it to his body.
DMCuindless 09-26-07, 10:36 PM	A sundered item is destroyed, so the silence spell would end. Same goes for the tanglefoot bag, so short of a house rule(which is by no means unreasonable) a silenced bag that breaks is no longer silenced. Excellent! Two birds with one stone! The fighter loses his weapon and the party loses it's silence spell...
heffroncm 09-26-07, 11:10 PM	Attach a little sovereign glue to it and stick it to his body. Oh, the joy of combining low-level spells creatively. Like using Telekinesis to dip Silence rocks into Sovereign Glue, then flinging them at people.
DMCuindless 09-26-07, 11:14 PM	Oh, the joy of combining low-level spells creatively. Like using Telekinesis to dip Silence rocks into Sovereign Glue, then flinging them at people. That's about the coolest thing I've ever heard! I have got to try that next time I play a sorcerer.
Tedronai 09-27-07, 08:10 AM	I prefer using Loadstones, they're harder to get rid of, and come with extra penalties for the unfortunate victim (half speed, I believe). If they even try to pull it off, the curse will activate and will teleport back into their possession. Last I checked, Remove Curse and Break Enchantment have verbal components, and wouldn't be generally prepared as silenced spells (so for the rest of the day, at the very least, the target it SOL). Just make sure you don't actually carry the item yourself, use spells to move it: Mage Hand or Telekinesis for manipulation, Floating Disk for transporting it to the target.
weasel0 09-28-07, 12:37 AM	Just for the record, I never said pocket. Just becuase I use SoH doesn't mean I'm using "Pickpocket." Let's leave 2ndEd(and 3.0? -I started after 3.5) behind us. I said(yes-bad form to quote self, but I see no choice here):crack in armor, belt loop or other such loose article, robe foldand to clarify, by robe fold, I mean like a sash loosely hanging across the opponent.