Post/Author/DateTime	Post
radkins 11-06-07, 02:03 PM	When a sorceror takes levels in a prc that advances spellcasting, does the character still get trade out spells known every even level? Trading out spells seem like it would be part of advancing spells known, but I just wanted to get everyone elses opinion on it.
Saragon42 11-06-07, 05:58 PM	When a sorceror takes levels in a prc that advances spellcasting, does the character still get trade out spells known every even level? Trading out spells seem like it would be part of advancing spells known, but I just wanted to get everyone elses opinion on it. Unless the PrC specifically says otherwise, the rules seem to say (and this surprised me) that the sorceror does get to swap out spells. The "+1 level of existing [...] spellcasting class" seems to refer to the "Spells" block of the character class, and the spell swap falls under that heading, not another part of the sorceror's class abilities. Compare that to the Beguiler, who can swap out spells (IIRC) but also has a separate class feature for Expanded Knowledge. If that isn't quite enough proof, consider this quote from the Archmage (SRD) prestige class: When a new archmage level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if he had also gained a level in whatever arcane spellcasting class in which he could cast 7th-level spells before he added the prestige class level. Emphasis mine. The sorceror class's list of spells known is directly affected by the spell-swapping feature of its spellcasting ability. So I would say, yes, a PrC entered into with sorceror spellcasting would allow swapping out spells at the appropriate spellcasting progression level.
runestar 11-07-07, 08:51 AM	The ability to swap out spells is a function of your sorc lv, not your effective spellcaster lv. Think of it as some sort of class feature, like familiar power lv. Thus, if you do not actually take lvs in sorc, you cannot swap out old spells for new ones.
StevenO 11-07-07, 06:16 PM	I'd go with allowing the character to swap spells based on what the equivalent sorcerer casting ability is. I certainly consider it part of a character's "spells known" with regards to casting. For sorcerers and other spontaneous casters I'd even expand the ability a little bit. I'd allow a character gaining an improvement on a spell currently known to replace the old spell while gaining the new spell. The best example is the Monster Summoning line, I'd allow a sorcerer who knows MS1 and chooses MS2 (or even a later versions) as a new spell to replace the MS1 for free. They may not be able to use the new spell quite as often as the old spell but I see it as a character improving on something they already know how to do.
Merestil Haye 11-08-07, 07:53 AM	The ability to exchange spells is part of the "spells" class feature of the Sorcerer. So if a PrC advances a Sorcerer's spellcasting, it grants all the benefits of advancing Sorcerer spellcasting that it does not explicitly rule out. If the PrC does not say that spontaneous casters don't get to trade spells, or that the PrC has it's own method of acquiring spells that replaces the standard classes' ability, the character can change a spell if appropriate (ie if the standard classes' spellcasting allows them to).
radkins 11-08-07, 01:54 PM	Thanks guys. It seems like I agreed with the majority of you all about considering it part of their spells known. Just hadn't seen an official ruling on that and wanted to get some outside opinions.