Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Brehon 03-21-07, 06:36 AM	1.) In the Animate Dead spell, it states that "No matter how many times you use this spell, however, you can control only 4 HD worth of undead creatures per caster level." However, the Deathbound domain from Libris Mortis has the granted power of "Your limit for controlling undead animated with spells increases to three times your caster level instead of the normal two times caster level." Obviously, these two things seem contradictory. How would you adjudicate the Deathbound domain if you assume that the Animate Dead spell is correct? 2.) When you cast Awaken Undead (from the Libris Mortis), do you think the CR of the affected undead should increase? The spell makes no mention of it, but since it gives the creature all the extraordinary abilities that it had in life it could significantly alter the creature's combat effectiveness. For instance, the skeleton of a kelubar demodand (upon being awakened) gains back its acidic slime, 4d6 of sneak attack, stench and improved uncanny dodge. Do these abilities add enough to the creature to warrant an increase in CR? I'm looking for other opinions and lines of reasoning before I make a ruling in my game, so feel free to offer any perspective that you have. Thanks.
Merestil Haye 03-21-07, 07:47 AM	1.) In the Animate Dead spell, it states that "No matter how many times you use this spell, however, you can control only 4 HD worth of undead creatures per caster level." However, the Deathbound domain from Libris Mortis has the granted power of "Your limit for controlling undead animated with spells increases to three times your caster level instead of the normal two times caster level." Obviously, these two things seem contradictory. How would you adjudicate the Deathbound domain if you assume that the Animate Dead spell is correct?The Deathbound domain has errata. It doesn't actually say "Your limit for controlling undead ...". Instead it says "Your limit for creating undead ...". 2.) When you cast Awaken Undead (from the Libris Mortis), do you think the CR of the affected undead should increase? The spell makes no mention of it, but since it gives the creature all the extraordinary abilities that it had in life it could significantly alter the creature's combat effectiveness. For instance, the skeleton of a kelubar demodand (upon being awakened) gains back its acidic slime, 4d6 of sneak attack, stench and improved uncanny dodge. Do these abilities add enough to the creature to warrant an increase in CR? I'm looking for other opinions and lines of reasoning before I make a ruling in my game, so feel free to offer any perspective that you have. Thanks.I can't see any reason why the CR will not increase from 6, but remember that even the abilities they get back won't all work as well as they did in life - the Stench will have a save DC of 16, for example. I'd reckon no more than CR7 for that animated skeleton. To be honest, I don't think you can give hard and fast rules here. Each animated skeleton is going to get a very different slate of abilities restored, and it's those abilities, and how well they synergise with each other, and the undead type, that should determine the final CR. In the Kelubar example, three of the four are unchanged, while the fourth is weakened by the fact that Con is a nonability for undead, and the stench save DC is based on Con.